Help this languishing (great) Resource!

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This post has 19 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 301
Jerry Smith | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Jan 29 2015 8:08 AM

Help promote this great resource for NT study . . .

Commentary on the New Testament from the Talmud and Midrash (3 vols.)
by Strack, Hermann L., Billerbeck, Paul

https://www.logos.com/product/30801/commentary-on-the-new-testament-from-the-talmud-and-midrash

Posts 1240
HJ. van der Wal | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 8:31 AM

Yes

And for those for whom English is a foreign language: https://www.logos.com/product/30802/kommentar-zum-neuen-testament-aus-talmud-und-midrasch

Posts 591
Rayner | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 9:19 AM

Wow!  This looks very exciting.  /Another/ thing that looks very exciting. 

Posts 617
Ryan | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 10:10 AM

Wow Jerry, somehow I had missed this one. Looks like a great resource. I just placed my order. Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

Posts 301
Jerry Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 10:13 AM

Ryan B:

Wow Jerry, somehow I had missed this one. Looks like a great resource. I just placed my order. Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

You're most welcome! I pre-ordered it almost 2 years ago and can't believe it hasn't moved further. Would love to see it released soon and in my Logos Library!

Posts 463
Nick Steffen | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 10:36 AM

I hope it moves soon!

Posts 1602
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 11:09 AM

I bid on it in March of last year.  It's been going slow.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 3:05 PM

And the price went up since I pre-ordered, so a word to the wise: jump in now.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 3:25 PM

You may want to read Dr. Gary Shogren's caution about this resource here. I searched my resources for Strack AND Billerbeck and display the top resources by number of hits below. I think you can see that having access to this work in English would be invaluable. (Of course, Logos would have to be willing to re-tag these resources for Str-B to get the cross reference value that this resource can provide.)

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 1602
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 4:58 PM

Mark Smith:

You may want to read Dr. Gary Shogren's caution about this resource here.

Good points, Mark.

Posts 591
Rayner | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 5:57 PM

Steve:

Mark Smith:

You may want to read Dr. Gary Shogren's caution about this resource here.

I've withdrawn my bid and my excitement after reading the caution.

Posts 231
Todd Frusti | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 6:18 PM

I pre-ordered last March and am looking forward to having this resource.

Mark Smith:
You may want to read Dr. Gary Shogren's caution about this resource here.

Thanks for sharing.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 6:20 PM

Rayner:
I've withdrawn my bid and my excitement after reading the caution.

Did you notice that Dr. Shogren wants this resource published? Note the volumes I gave a snapshot of. Besides the valuable dictionaries and encyclopedias, the ICC of Matthew, NIGTC of Luke and Hebrews, the BECNT on Luke, WBC volumes on Matthew, John, and Romans indicate that serious scholars frequently cite Str-B. They are not avoiding their work. (No one would say these authors don't know their stuff or are out-of touch with contemporary scholarship.)

I believe Dr. Shogren would want us to use Str-B with discernment and cross-checking, just as we should any source. To have all the resources I listed tagged with the Str-B links would open up a lot of insight and study opportunities.

I hope this resource will be produced and that tagging will be added to all the above resources (and more).

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 777
Lew Worthington | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 6:25 PM

Rayner:

I've withdrawn my bid and my excitement after reading the caution.

Shogren's points are good. But the same can be said, to some degree, for almost anything written about, say, Paul before 1977. But that doesn't render these resources invalid or worthless. Similarly, while nobody buys into Bultmann's John commentary wholesale, I'm not quite ready to turn it into kindling. Scholarship is a funny thing: When reading old resources, we have to be alert to the fact that they couldn't know what we now know. When reading new resources, we have to be alert that what they are saying hasn't stood the test of time.

Likewise, I wouldn't rule out Einstein's work on gravity because he didn't account for quantum effects. Nor would I rule out Hawking's early writings because he didn't account for what he learned since then.

I think one reason we are apt to heed Shogren's words is that these are issues that we have batted around so much for the last 40 years that these are almost "canonical" topics. In another 10-40 years, the focus will shift somewhere else.

Hmm. When I read some of my older stuff, I ask myself if I really did say that. And most of the time, I really did! Big Smile

Posts 2220
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 29 2015 7:50 PM

I've been so waiting for this work. 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 301
Jerry Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 30 2015 9:29 AM

Lew Worthington:
When reading old resources, we have to be alert to the fact that they couldn't know what we now know. When reading new resources, we have to be alert that what they are saying hasn't stood the test of time.

Definitely! S&B are excellent sources for research and well worth addition to a serious library! I too have been eagerly waiting for their availability . . .

Posts 162
Clifford B. Kvidahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 30 2015 9:40 AM

While I find Gary's word of caution to be wise a one we should certainly heed, we must also be careful not to throw the baby out with the bath water. The same caution can also be raised in regards to Kittel's TDNT. James Barr's scathing critique against the linguistics of TDNT is enough to cause us to chuck Kittel as well—if we follow the same logic. But just as there is still a cautious usefulness with respect to TDNT, this is also the case with Str-B. Yes, we know far more about Rabbinic Judaism than Strack and Billerbeck did in their days, but this is not a fault of theirs. Rather, this is due to our ever increasing understanding of what dates back to the first century and what does not. The work of men like Intone-Brewer and others have been vital for our understanding of 1st century Judaism and later Rabbinic Judaism.

Cliff

Posts 591
Rayner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 30 2015 11:09 AM

Ok, point taken.  However, as somebody that is not particularly knowledgeable about Rabbinic Judaism, it's going to be tricky knowing quite where Strack and Billerbeck have been improved by new scholarship and where they've just been quoted by other scholars, but not checked for accuracy. 

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 30 2015 12:03 PM

Jerry Smith:
  I pre-ordered it almost 2 years ago and can't believe it hasn't moved further. Would love to see it released soon and in my Logos Library! 

I pre-ordered mine on 15th March 2013. Still would like to have it. 

I recently checked the word "hopeless" in the NET Bible, and it occurs only once, so I think I should wait in positive mood Smile

Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 8.1

Posts 777
Lew Worthington | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 30 2015 1:23 PM

Veli Voipio:

I recently checked the word "hopeless" in the NET Bible, and it occurs only once, so I think I should wait in positive mood Smile

Big Smile

With smiles like that, I just might have to get this resource, too!

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