Logos changing my saved layouts: feature or bug?

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Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Posted: Sat, Mar 14 2015 7:03 PM

Maybe this is a bug, maybe it's just an incredibly badly thought out feature. I created a layout with this search, and saved the layout. Note I am searching the NRSV interlinear, and my secondary search text is the Lexham English Septuagint.

I then created a different layout, with this search, and saved the search. Note I am searching the Qumran Biblical Dead Sea Scrolls Databse, and my secondary search text is the Dead Sea Scrolls Study Edition (Translations).

Then I re-opened the original layout, only to discover the search had been changed; note the secondary search text is now the Dead Sea Scrolls Study Edition (Translations), instead of the Lexham English Septuagint, which is what I had set it to.

So I changed the secondary search text back to the Lexham English Septuagint, and re-saved the layout. I then returned to my Qumran texts layout, only to find that this had now been changed; the secondary search text is now the Lexham English Septuagint, not the  Dead Sea Scrolls Study Edition (Translations), which I had set it to.

The same thing happens when you create multiple search tabs in a single layout; the secondary text always changes to the secondary text you used in your last search. It's particularly unsatisfying when you spend a lot of time carefully setting up four different layouts, only to find that Logos will arbitrarily change them even while they're closed, and you need to keep resetting them back the way you want them. It defeats the purpose of designing and saving layouts in the first place.

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 14 2015 7:27 PM

I notice that monster target in each of your images; what if the search arguments held in the saved layout are re-targeting?

That said, I've experienced layout versions getting mixed up, even though the latest 'save' should have been the latest version.


Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 14 2015 7:34 PM

Thanks for the suggestion. I removed the search target setting from both layouts; it made no difference, the layouts still change as before.

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 14 2015 7:59 PM

Yes, I've complained about something related to this before, that search settings are global not saved with the Layout.

https://community.logos.com/forums/t/100564.aspx 

I think both issues should be considered together in a design review.

Eli Evans?

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 14 2015 9:21 PM

Thanks Rosie. If we can't rely on layouts remaining the way we designed them, it defeats the purpose of layouts in the first place.

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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 11:31 AM

There are two camps of users, those who want layouts to be generic task-based tile configurations that start in a mostly neutral state, and those who want layouts to be more like "projects" which store their own preferences. Our implementations (called "layouts" since L4, and "workspaces" prior to that) have always leaned heavily toward the former rather than the latter.

The current situation is a mostly unsatisfactory attempt to appease both camps without introducing a new concept for projects by inching toward a middle ground of saving some preferences with the layout but not others. However, we recognize that enough people want full-fledged projects that we'll have to address this need directly. This is currently about third on my list of large design issues to tackle in 2015, Lord willing.

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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 11:37 AM

That said, it looks like the real issue here is that the list of search result display versions (LES vs DSS) is stored per search type, not per search configuration. We can address that independent of the larger layouts vs projects question.

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 6:17 PM

Yes. It's completely counter-intuitive. As for differences in the way people view layouts, I would be very surprised if there's anyone out there who want Logos to change their layouts after they've set them up and saved them.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 6:28 PM

Jonathan Burke:

Yes. It's completely counter-intuitive. As for differences in the way people view layouts, I would be very surprised if there's anyone out there who want Logos to change their layouts after they've set them up and saved them.

Actually, I fall into both camps. I have layouts that are for specific projects where I want the search options to be stable. I also have layouts that are simply starting places that I would like to work in the same way as if I had opened the Search from the tool bar.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 6:32 PM

MJ. Smith:
I have layouts that are for specific projects where I want the search options to be stable.

Unfortunately you can't get that yet. So you're not actually someone who wants their layouts to change after they've set them up and saved them.

MJ. Smith:
I also have layouts that are simply starting places that I would like to work in the same way as if I had opened the Search from the tool bar.

Fortunately you can get that. But most importantly, you can get that without the necessity of crippled layouts which don't save settings; just open a search from the tool bar, then save the layout. Of course this still requires layouts to actually retain their settings.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 16 2015 6:43 PM

Jonathan Burke:

MJ. Smith:
I have layouts that are for specific projects where I want the search options to be stable.

Unfortunately you can't get that yet. So you're not actually someone who wants their layouts to change after they've set them up and saved them.

Actually, mine are being preserved quite nicely which I realize is a matter of luck rather than planning - but I was responding to the "want' not referring to my fortunate status.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 17 2015 1:15 PM

Eli Evans:
This is currently about third on my list of large design issues to tackle in 2015, Lord willing.

And this would be effected in both Logos 5 and Logos 6 because of sync'ing?

Dave
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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 24 2015 9:44 AM

Dave Hooton:

Eli Evans:
This is currently about third on my list of large design issues to tackle in 2015, Lord willing.

And this would be effected in both Logos 5 and Logos 6 because of sync'ing?

We have no plans to make any changes to Layouts in Logos 5. Is that what you were asking?

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 25 2015 6:19 PM

Eli Evans:

Dave Hooton:

Eli Evans:
This is currently about third on my list of large design issues to tackle in 2015, Lord willing.

And this would be effected in both Logos 5 and Logos 6 because of sync'ing?

We have no plans to make any changes to Layouts in Logos 5. Is that what you were asking?

Some users have both Logos 5 and Logos 6, so it would appear that Project layouts won't be implemented in Logos 5, but what about associated sync'ing?

However,

Eli Evans:
That said, it looks like the real issue here is that the list of search result display versions (LES vs DSS) is stored per search type, not per search configuration. We can address that independent of the larger layouts vs projects question.

Would this be addressed in Logos 5?

Dave
===

Windows & Android

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Ryan Gano (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 27 2015 9:01 AM

Dave Hooton:
Some users have both Logos 5 and Logos 6, so it would appear that Project layouts won't be implemented in Logos 5, but what about associated sync'ing?

While there has obviously not been a technical decision on a design that hasn't yet been created I'll tell you what my expectations would be. I'd expect there to be a new type of layout that will not interact with Logos 5. So it will be synced by 6.0 but ignored completely in 5.2b.

Dave Hooton:

Eli Evans:
That said, it looks like the real issue here is that the list of search result display versions (LES vs DSS) is stored per search type, not per search configuration. We can address that independent of the larger layouts vs projects question.

Would this be addressed in Logos 5?

We're not adding new features (or even most bug fixes) to 5.2b. If a change in 6.x necessitates a related change in 5.x we will make the fix. But we are not actively developing on 5.x so it's far more likely that we'll try to make the change in 6.x in a way that doesn't impact 5.x.

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2015 8:37 PM

Eli Evans:
However, we recognize that enough people want full-fledged projects that we'll have to address this need directly. This is currently about third on my list of large design issues to tackle in 2015, Lord willing.

You might get a Christmas card after all. Stick out tongue

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