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Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, May 27 2015 11:47 AM

Does Logos Cloud make available standard resources like the NICOT/NT, Word Bible Commentary, HALOT, Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary, and other quality reference tools?

Or is it like the Faithlife Study Bible on steroids? 

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

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Lynden Williams | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 27 2015 11:50 AM

It all depends on which publishers have signed on. 

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David Taylor Jr | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2015 10:56 AM

Michael Childs:

Does Logos Cloud make available standard resources like the NICOT/NT, Word Bible Commentary, HALOT, Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary, and other quality reference tools?

Or is it like the Faithlife Study Bible on steroids? 

I know they have said it is heavy on Public Domain and Lexham titles, but they did say there are others, but haven't let us know what others there are.

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Lynden Williams | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2015 11:10 AM

By Monday we should know.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2015 1:26 PM

Michael Childs:
Does Logos Cloud make available standard resources like the NICOT/NT, Word Bible Commentary, HALOT, Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary, and other quality reference tools?

For now it is mostly Faithlife resources, public domain material (former CP offerings), and a few publishers.

Logos Cloud libraries aren't identical to Logos 6 base packages. They're very different, with a heavy focus on our own content. We've also partnered initially with Baker, Wipf & Stock, Eisenbrauns, and The Gospel Coalition (a few other publishers are considering joining as well). We envision many more publishers joining in the coming months. In addition to this content, we've added various amounts of public domain content to make sure we have all the key categories covered appropriately in each library.

It is Faithlife's job to give a correct answer, but in discussions prior to the public announcement, we were told that the sorts of resources you listed would not be in Logos Cloud. We've heard nothing stated publicly about this, but initially, at least, Logos Cloud will not have access to these resources.

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Phil Gons (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2015 1:37 PM

Michael Childs:

Does Logos Cloud make available standard resources like the NICOT/NT, Word Bible Commentary, HALOT, Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary, and other quality reference tools?

Or is it like the Faithlife Study Bible on steroids? 

We're in conversation with many publishers. Right now we have the following publishers participating:

  1. Ambassador
  2. Baker
  3. Bloombury
  4. Crossway (ESV only, for now)
  5. Eisenbrauns
  6. The Gospel Coalition
  7. Wipf & Stock

We expect to have others joining over the coming weeks and months.

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Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2015 2:59 PM

Well, Baker sounds like an interesting publisher, depending upon what they make available.

Frankly, I can not see much purpose for Logos cloud without some first rate resources available.  It would just be that much less to put toward something I would really use.  I would be more inclined to pay a monthly fee to "rent" a first class resource that I would use than pay for more frills, tools, and public domain resources.   

But I am certainly not negative toward the idea if it meets someone's need.  It is just unlikely to interest me.

I may not be able to say this well, but here goes.  Many of the newer Logos features tend to move beyond inductive study to doing the interpretation for you.  That goes against my grain.  When I want to read someone's interpretation, I prefer it to be a scholar that I know something about.  I want that opinion just to compare with the results of my study and be sure that I have not missed something important.  I do not want someone's opinion to be my beginning point or to be basic to the Bible program.  I see this trend taking place.

I realize that direction may be good for those who did not have the opportunity to attend seminary or study Biblical language.  That is well and good.  But the farther Logos moves in that direction, the less useful it is to pastors and teachers.  The less respected it will be in the more scholarly market.  And I speak not so much of myself, but of seminary professors.  I am just a good ole boy from Mississippi, but I went to Asbury and have slept in a Holiday Inn.  I don't want to be like the guy who bought his Schofield Reference Bible and is convinced the notes are as inspired as the text.

This all may be Logos' intention to broaden its market, and may even be a good thing. But I trust they are considering the trade off involved in the direction they are heading.  It just doesn't interest me.  To repeat myself again, to me it is all about the books.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

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Steve Clevenger | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jun 2 2015 8:11 AM

When I download Logos Cloud for Mac it looks like it wants to replace Logos6 locally on my HD. If I let it do this will it have to download my complete library and index it?

 

Thanks

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jun 2 2015 8:32 AM

Steve Clevenger:

When I download Logos Cloud for Mac it looks like it wants to replace Logos6 locally on my HD.

It seems you downloaded an installer - a dmg file or something. This is probably meant for new users and not needed for people who already run L6. Just disregard it.

Your existing Logos 6 will (provided you have it set to automatically download updates - otherwise it will ask you to) download the Logos Cloud resources you not already own and subsequently index them. This may be a multi-GB download, but it's "only" resources and datasets, not the program itself.   

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jun 2 2015 8:36 AM

Michael Childs:
I may not be able to say this well, but here goes.  Many of the newer Logos features tend to move beyond inductive study to doing the interpretation for you.  That goes against my grain.  When I want to read someone's interpretation, I prefer it to be a scholar that I know something about.  I want that opinion just to compare with the results of my study and be sure that I have not missed something important.  I do not want someone's opinion to be my beginning point or to be basic to the Bible program.  I see this trend taking place.

I'd love you to elaborate on this.

I think at the same time Logos is doin some things I see as lay oriented, it has added some features interesting to academics. The Hebrew Cantillations interactive, the Runge discourse (high definition) material, potentially the Concordance tool, the Ancient literature guide, the new theology guide, clause participants, and the I don't get it yet Case Frames feature come to mind.

Michael Childs:
It is just unlikely to interest me.

And that is with intent. It really isn't aimed at you or me. Logos Now might appeal.

Right now if a lay person wanted to pony up $20-30 a month it seems he/she would get quite a decent sized library of resources, some of which are of good quality (and some of which are dated). I think that's the Cloud crowd FL is looking to attract.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jun 2 2015 5:21 PM

Michael Childs:

I may not be able to say this well, but here goes.  Many of the newer Logos features tend to move beyond inductive study to doing the interpretation for you.  That goes against my grain.  When I want to read someone's interpretation, I prefer it to be a scholar that I know something about.  I want that opinion just to compare with the results of my study and be sure that I have not missed something important.  I do not want someone's opinion to be my beginning point or to be basic to the Bible program.  I see this trend taking place.

I realize that direction may be good for those who did not have the opportunity to attend seminary or study Biblical language.  That is well and good.  But the farther Logos moves in that direction, the less useful it is to pastors and teachers. 

I have a somewhat different take on this although I can see "where you are coming from". First, inductive Bible study is only one form of Bible study - a fairly recent Western perspective. It is useful but it is not the only game in town. I see several of the recent tools as linguistic in nature - trying to fill the gap that exists for most Christians other than academics in particular fields - textual criticism and language specialists. While by its very nature the translation portion of linguistic analysis involves some interpretation, users are being put in a better position to evaluate alternatives than when they pretend to have more language knowledge than they have or when they handpick the raw data they observe.

What I appreciate is the move on the part of Logos to help me sort out my resources and chose how to approach them - I'm thinking of the Ancient Literature, Catholic Topical Index, Sermons, Journals and Systematic Theologies sections. I don't see this kind of expansion to be pushing me as starting at someone else's opinion.

I see much of the movement in media and interactives to be providing resources to religion education/faith formation staff - whether ordained or lay. As I don't see them as research for interpretation, I don't see them as diluting the usefulness of Logos for pastors and academics. I have been pushing Logos for some time to push harder into the Sunday School/religious education/faith formation market as I believe that a tool that can be used by lay participants, staff and clergy can be very helpful in a parish setting - yes, each group has different concerns but each individual can tailor the application to their needs, interests and level of education.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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