How to do Psalms Title in PB-Bible

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Schumitinu | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Aug 5 2015 6:16 PM

I'm working on a Bible that uses the LEB Versemap. Now the psalms often times have a title line that is handled differently in different translations. The one I'm working on has the title separate and V1 starts after the title (see screenshot below).

So I'm wondering how this needs to be set up. Right now it looks like this. Would this work? Or is there a way to mark it as 'title'?

[[@BibleLEB:Ps 3]]{{~ Ps 3 }}

{{field-on:bible}}A psalm of David, at his fleeing from the presence of Absalom, his son.{{field-off:bible}}
[[@BibleLEB:Ps 3:1]]1 {{field-on:bible}}Yahweh, how many are my enemies; many are rising against me.{{field-off:bible}}

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 5 2015 6:55 PM

This is a major flaw of most English Bibles. This "introduction" should be verse 1 in all cases. Because it is handled (i.e. dismissed) as a introduction, these lines are not included as part of most Logos searches. That stinks because some of the info is very important in understanding what the Psalm is about. I wish Logos would devise a way of including this material as PART OF THE PSALM...since that's exactly what it is.

Ha! Just noticed this is in the Files forum, so I doubt anyone from Logos will see it.

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Schumitinu:
Or is there a way to mark it as 'title'?

I'm not at a computer where I can check this, but I think "[[@BibleLEB:Ps 3:title]]" should work. (Logos calls the BHS v1 the "title" verse in most English versemaps.)

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David Paul:
Because it is handled (i.e. dismissed) as a introduction, these lines are not included as part of most Logos searches.

The "title" verse should be included in all Bible searches in Logos. Can you provide steps to reproduce a search where it's not included?

David Paul:
I wish Logos would devise a way of including this material as PART OF THE PSALM...since that's exactly what it is.

It should be included as the "title" verse in all English Bibles in Logos.

David Paul:
Ha! Just noticed this is in the Files forum, so I doubt anyone from Logos will see it.

True, only people from Faithlife have seen it. Stick out tongue

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 5 2015 9:21 PM

David Paul:

This is a major flaw of most English Bibles. This "introduction" should be verse 1 in all cases. Because it is handled (i.e. dismissed) as a introduction, these lines are not included as part of most Logos searches. That stinks because some of the info is very important in understanding what the Psalm is about. I wish Logos would devise a way of including this material as PART OF THE PSALM...since that's exactly what it is.

Ha! Just noticed this is in the Files forum, so I doubt anyone from Logos will see it.

Could you give an example? I find that it is treated as part of the Psalm in most of the translations I use.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 5 2015 11:31 PM

Okay, I guess I'm responding to how it's treated in L3. I can see that it is searchable in L5...but...

Taking this example, say I want to do a search on "Saul". 

How do I get this report in L5? In L3 it's a right click and a left click (Englishman's Concordance).

I understand L5 doesn't do an Englishman's Concordance search, but I want the report above with this layout. How do I get this?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 5 2015 11:57 PM

Okay ... I see no relationship between the Search question and the question of Psalm titles .... and who said you can't do an Englishman's Concordance? I think one of the oldies but goodies tip of the day entries gave instructions recently (Rosie as OP?)... and me answering a question using  Strongs number? I leave that to others. But I suspect this is what you want.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 12:51 AM

Actually, though it looks similar, that isn't the same search. Notice that your search results begin in 1 Samuel, leaving out 5 results that the Englishman's Concordance search based on lemma provided. The Englishman's Concordance returns all hits based on the Hebrew lemma, not a particular English word.

As far as relevance to the OP, I'm just trying to understand how to generate usable data in the form I need it should I want to do a search on a given word in one of the Psalms' "introductions". The search you generated isn't that. I appreciate the effort, though.

Oh, and the answer to the first question (who said?) is Morris Proctor. I asked him myself at the first L4 presentation he did in Tennessee in 2009. EC search is the workhorse command of what I do every day...dozens, maybe a hundred or so, times a day. He said there was a way to generate a similar report, but I don't remember what that was because I found out that L4 had abandoned other critical functions of my daily routine, so I gave up all hope of "moving forward" with the new platforms. Some of the worst money I ever spent was going to that L4 seminar only to be told in person by Bob himself (in so many words) that I was stuck with L3 forever. I had an awful feeling in the pit of my stomach for years after that. I console myself with the fact that if Cubans can keep 50s era cars running with spit and bailing wire, I can keep L3 chugging along as well. But L3 isn't perfect because it's frozen in time, so I have to access L5 now out of necessity.

So the question still stands...how do I get an EC report equivalent in L5?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 1:04 AM

Hey I said I don't do Strong's Stick out tongue

See Rosie in TIP of the day: Best answers of the week on Englishman's Concordance.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 1:28 AM

Okay...I think I can make that happen. But as usual, the process is far more complicated than what L3 requires. So you just type the Strong's number in the box? And I'm assuming the < & > are needed, yes?

You say you don't do Strong's...do you not need to generate this kind of report? Strong's is just the mechanism for lemma identification.

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 1:31 AM

Btw, I bookmarked that link. Thanks.

I guess MP just meant what the link says...Logos does what EC does by design so the actual resource EC isn't needed any longer, but the kind of search is still called an "EC search". I'm sure the publishers of EC are thrilled!

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 1:42 AM

Why introduce Strong's when I can use the lemma itself? TIP of the day: Strong's numbers - a brilliant and obsolete idea

Which I get built through the right-click Context menu

Note: you can fire off the Strong's search from this menu as well.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Darrell | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 1:03 PM

Thanks MJ that tip allowed me to free up a line in my Interlinear ribbon,, :)

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Posts 570
Schumitinu | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 5:24 PM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):

Schumitinu:
Or is there a way to mark it as 'title'?

I'm not at a computer where I can check this, but I think "[[@BibleLEB:Ps 3:title]]" should work. (Logos calls the BHS v1 the "title" verse in most English versemaps.)

Ok, back to my initial question...

Thanks Bradley for the tip. Unfortunately it did not work. The milestone now shows in the Bible text and in the log file was the following message:
[Warning] Unrecognized milestone BibleLEB:Ps 3:title

Any other suggestions?

Posts 570
Schumitinu | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 6 2015 6:51 PM

It looks like that :title is not part of the LEB versemap (https://wiki.logos.com/Bible_Verse_Maps#Psalm). So I tried to take out all the LEB tags. It worked in that most of the psalms titles are recognized now and work as such. But there is now a whole range of other verses that are not recognized. Here is my log file

https://community.logos.com/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Discussions.Components.Files/66/5282.PBB_5F00_2015_2D00_08_2D00_07T01_5F00_31_5F00_24Z.log:550:0

Any suggestions?

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Schumitinu | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 7 2015 5:43 PM

bump

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 8 2015 10:19 AM

To me it looks like the LEB versemap for Psalms works just like BHS and Luther  (i.e. what other bibles call 'title' is verse 1). EDIT: however, looking into the LEB it seems the entry in the wiki is wrong and LEB might belong into a different column.  

Your link doesn't work for me right now, and I'm not sure what you meant by "taking out" the LEB reference.

The point is that PB bibles can have only one versemap, so you need to be careful which you choose - Logos has created a unique versemap for nearly every bible, the chaos is so big.  

In fact, if your bible follows the LEB versemap, you need to call the LEB references in the milestones. Have you tried verse 0?

Running Logos 8 latest beta version on Win 10

Posts 570
Schumitinu | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 8 2015 6:32 PM

NB.Mick:

I'm not sure what you meant by "taking out" the LEB reference.

The point is that PB bibles can have only one versemap, so you need to be careful which you choose - Logos has created a unique versemap for nearly every bible, the chaos is so big.  

In fact, if your bible follows the LEB versemap, you need to call the LEB references in the milestones. Have you tried verse 0?

Yes, I first used [[@BibleLEB:PS 3:title]]{{field-on:bible}} and then toke the 'LEB' part out so to use a non-specific versemap [[@Bible:PS 3:title]]{{field-on:bible}}. This worked for the psalms title, but I ended up with lots of verses unassigned, meaning they did not fit into the general versemap. The interesting thing is, if you use the LEB the title line shows 'Psalm 3:title' in the reference field. But looking at the versemap wiki I don't see any Bible that is listed having that milestone as part of the versemap. So to me it looks like a bug. The LEB (and others) use the milestone (which is a valid milestone that can be searched) but the versemaps available to build a PB Bible do not contain them.

No, I have not tried verse 0

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 10 2015 8:59 AM

When I built the verse maps Wiki page, I didn't add support for Psalm titles, but I can see that it is needed. I'm away at the moment, but I'll try and see if it can be updated when I get back. 

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Aug 10 2015 9:00 AM

Thanks Mark!

Running Logos 8 latest beta version on Win 10

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