Dear Faithlife, I am not stupid

Page 3 of 4 (76 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 Next >
This post has 75 Replies | 5 Followers

Posts 26021
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 11:34 AM

Mark Barnes:
but a lot can change in the months/years before it finally arrives.

I agree. That is one reason I'm not happy about the length of time some items spend under development. While it is not the oldest, the Grail Psalms are the ones that come to mind.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 5241
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 1:31 PM

Don Awalt:

It's interesting, for years now Bob has commented that in addition to the (most important) mission to take the Bible to as many people as possible in as many ways as possible, there was an underlying reality that the existing customer base would not spend like they have in the past - the the majority of current users purchase the most at the beginning of their Logos relationship, and little if anything after.  I can't help but think at times that some of the policies are effecting a self-fulfilling prophecy with regard to making it easy for long time customers to stay as engaged as in the past.

Hopefully this is just a bump in the road and we see  renewed interest in the existing customer base. Things are often not as bad as they seem when bad, nor as good as they seem when good.

The issue for me for the most part everything I really want to buy is gathering interest. And a few high priority items were just canceled... I cannot buy what FL will not produce...

-Dan

Posts 476
Travis Walter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 1:43 PM

For whatever reason I get emails from sales purchases but nothing for a list service type.  So I have never gotten the canceled email either and I doubt I will..   But seeing this list is shocking that over 300-400 prepubs were canceled.

Posts 236
Michael March | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 2:05 PM

Glad you put that offhand comment in about the Grail Psalms MJ. I love them and just added my order. Looks close from the green bar.

Windows PC - Android Phone - Surface Pro 4

Posts 266
Roger Dittmar | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 2:25 PM

Thanks! I just pre-ordered Grail Psalms, also.

Posts 2820
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 2:33 PM

There is no question that all MJ said is true.  It is, indeed, unlikely that the money we intended to spend for canceled prepubs will be spent for other Logos books.  We are more likely to buy those books elsewhere.

I suppose that Faithlife must aim for the broadest market.  Unfortunately, the deeper we go in our study, the more narrow is the market for the resources that we need.

I have found personal books to be a partial solution at times.  If Logos does not carry something that I really want, and it is available in another ebook format, I have sometimes bought the ebook from another source and converted it to a Logos personal book.  For years I wanted George Ladd’s commentary on Revelation, and it went into my library as a personal book.  A few years later it became available in Logos, and I bought the resource from Logos and deleted my personal book.

That has been one partial solution for me.  It would not be for many, I am sure.  Some may feel that I violated copyright.  However, I legally purchased the book.  Just as I would convert a music cd that I purchased to an mp3 to play on my iPod, I felt no ethical problem with converting a purchased book into Logos personal book.  I certainly did not share any copyrighted material, but used the ebook I purchased personally in the best way for me.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 3937
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 3:16 PM

Mark Barnes:

  1. Too many expensive pre-pubs are released at the same time, so I can't afford all of them in one go.
  2. Earlier pre-pubs which take so long to produce, and have have been surpassed by more attractive later pre-pubs.
  3. My financial circumstances have worsened since ordering (or the exchange rate is significantly less favourable).



Yes! I'm about to go cull a bunch of CP and PP that may have interested me two years ago, but no longer do for various reasons (eg newer/better/more thorough/current books elsewhere).

2 & 3 are probably the biggest reasons why I cancel though. When one makes 800$ a month, it doesn't take much of a shift of fortune to mess with your add on purchases.

For what its worth. If I cancel 1000$ of pre-pub or CP items, then that will not translate into 1000$ of new purchases from logos or anywhere else.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 775
Lew Worthington | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 3:26 PM

JAL:

Bob Pritchett:
And we're actually working on some 'hacks' to make even more books available (Vyrso-style). 

That seems appropriate. I commend Faithlife for routinely improving existing resources, yet I find many Logos Editions just don't warrant the price premium and likely never will.

This would be a huge bonus for me. Many -- perhaps most -- of the Logos resources that I spend the most continuous time in are those that I just read. I don't need them to be tagged or enhanced with anything sophisticated. I just want to read them. For me, the reference works (dictionaries, commentaries, etc.) and language tools are the most critical to have the value-added effort required to make them full-blown Logos resources. The rest can exist peacefully and less expensively as Vyrso-style books.

And in that case, they're better off in my Logos collection than on my physical bookshelf or in Kindle or anything else.

Posts 1073
Sean | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 4:57 PM

Bob, you need to take a serious look at the confidence-shaking signals you have sent out recently as a business as a whole (and not just marketing's misguided missives).

A large layoff, the hatchetting of the pre-pub program, ("Gee, should we use kickstarter instead?" [answer: NO!]), the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)--the list could go on. None of these measures help to build customer confidence and do a considerable amount to undermine it.

I recently purged my pre-pub listed because of other problems with the program. I've been ignoring the pre-pub emails for a while & need to simply unsubscribe from them. The reasons for investing in more Logos books has been decreasing of late, not increasing. You need to do something about that--and not just have marketing send out more mails.

 Logos Now Subscriber -- 22/2/2018

Posts 1699
JoshInRI | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 6:07 PM

I hope this one doesn't get scrapped

https://www.logos.com/product/54357/the-bible-knowledge-background-commentary-new-testament

Running a company, especially a Godly one with a Biblical Mission and Vision (not the same thing) is not easy.

God bless Faithlife and all the workers who made the cut (ahem).

Joshua in Rhode Island

Posts 3937
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 9:59 PM

Sean:

Bob, you need to take a serious look at the confidence-shaking signals you have sent out recently as a business as a whole (and not just marketing's misguided missives).

A large layoff, the hatchetting of the pre-pub program, ("Gee, should we use kickstarter instead?" [answer: NO!]), the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)--the list could go on. None of these measures help to build customer confidence and do a considerable amount to undermine it.

I recently purged my pre-pub listed because of other problems with the program. I've been ignoring the pre-pub emails for a while & need to simply unsubscribe from them. The reasons for investing in more Logos books has been decreasing of late, not increasing. You need to do something about that--and not just have marketing send out more mails.

Did something similar. I still see value, but hesitate to invest any more with as many changes as are being made. Things that worked one way, now work differently. Things that were a good deal now cause hesitation.

I'm going to take a year or two off from buying things From Logos. IF in a year or two things look better and have become stable again then I'll re-evaluate things then. If how things work (eg payment plans, pp, cp, etc) still are basically the same... well only the Lord knows.

I'm even considering not renewing my academic status to help keep me from making purchases for the next few months.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 3937
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 10:00 PM

JoshInRI:

God bless Faithlife and all the workers who made the cut (ahem).

Joshua in Rhode Island



As well those who didn't make the cut.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 623
JAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 10:12 PM

Sean:
the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)

I continue to reflect on this, it is a significant confidence shaker.

"The Christian mind is the prerequisite of Christian thinking. And Christian thinking is the prerequisite of Christian action." - Harry Blamires, 1963

Posts 5241
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 10:17 PM

JAL:

Sean:
the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)

I continue to reflect on this, it is a significant confidence shaker.

It baffles the mind that this top priority item has failed to get released...but then staff is bleeding and may still be happening,

-Dan

Posts 26021
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 10:35 PM

Sean:
the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)--the list could go on.

Please bear in mind that QA has improved significantly despite it not being Bob's nature to have strict procedures and job descriptions, partially a conscious effort to encourage individual initiative. Assuming that my evaluation is correct there are two probable explanations for the dramatic reorganization: (a) the company has grown to the point that it's market position requires a significant change in approach ... in which case we should see the changes generate another period of growth and stability or (b) the company reached a stall point because of weaknesses in long-term planning and is attempting to adjust which may or may not be successful ... in which case we may see a continued period of instability while they figure out what works. What I don't see yet is any sign of failure to be able to maintain its current position which, were it to occur I would anticipate a sale/takeover.

What I do consider essential is to continue to push hard for the foundational resources for this type of chain ... if the professors use Logos their students are more apt to user Logos; if students use Logos they are more apt to continue to use Logos in their ministry; if the pastor uses Logos, his staff is more apt to use Logos; if the staff uses Logos the volunteers are more apt to use Logos; if the volunteers use Logos the average member in the pew is more apt to use Logos. At each level, Logos has to offer the resources that level considers foundational or the chain is broken and Logos is in a crap shoot with cheaper products. So keep pushing for the things needed for your church/denomination.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 623
JAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 23 2016 10:37 PM

Dan Francis:

JAL:

Sean:
the Encyclopedia Britannica fiasco (entirely foreseeable & preventable)

I continue to reflect on this, it is a significant confidence shaker.

It baffles the mind that this top priority item has failed to get released...but then staff is bleeding and may still be happening

I am neither surprised nor upset that the finished resource has not shipped. Production had to begin from scratch and I hope entails heightened attention to detail. My confidence is shaken by the initial failures - I don't know that the causes have been understood and addressed.

"The Christian mind is the prerequisite of Christian thinking. And Christian thinking is the prerequisite of Christian action." - Harry Blamires, 1963

Posts 1602
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 24 2016 6:36 AM

JoshInRI:

It's showing as Under Development.  I don't think that is in the same category as those that were eliminated.

Posts 999
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 24 2016 10:35 AM

MJ. Smith:

What I do consider essential is to continue to push hard for the foundational resources for this type of chain ... if the professors use Logos their students are more apt to user Logos; if students use Logos they are more apt to continue to use Logos in their ministry; if the pastor uses Logos, his staff is more apt to use Logos; if the staff uses Logos the volunteers are more apt to use Logos; if the volunteers use Logos the average member in the pew is more apt to use Logos. At each level, Logos has to offer the resources that level considers foundational or the chain is broken and Logos is in a crap shoot with cheaper products.

However they choose to make it happen, that does seem to be the key issue.

Posts 89
David Mitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 24 2016 2:42 PM

Weighing in on the prepub cancel email-  of course I appreciate you letting me know, and i was disappointed to see a cancellation (Who wouldn't want Schlatter:)!!).  

But the email itself was written in such a way that at first glance I thought you were sending me some Logos credit in lieu of the cancellation.  I felt that was a poor move in the writing department over there.   Please if you are asking people to buy books be forthright about it - there was too much euphemism in the email.  Being positive is good but telling me I suddenly have money to spend is a bit too much spin for my liking.

Posts 180
Paul C | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 24 2016 3:08 PM

Bob Pritchett:
Again, we didn't mean any offense... but simply sent the same email to everyone affected. For you it was clearly the wrong message, but for some it probably made a bit more sense.
Per chance we should send them our I.Q.   It might help them decide who should receive the snake oil messages.

Page 3 of 4 (76 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 Next > | RSS