End of Community Pricing?

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This post has 58 Replies | 3 Followers

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 29 2016 1:44 PM

Dan Francis:
it had never got close to the required amounts... but I am guessing it was seen as too key a work for the NOET crowd not to be done.

I have had suspicions on several titles that suddenly go 100%. I'm guessing they, too, are key works that Faithlife wants to see released.

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Ted Weis | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 29 2016 2:36 PM

Mikko Paavola:

There's currently 444 open community pricing items. That's much more than some years ago.

Wow! That's a huge amount. I wonder how long some of these titles have lingered in the "tar pits" and "roach motel." Does the fact these are still lingering show that the better public domain titles are already produced?

On another thought, it sure would be fun if Logos would have an "original community pricing sale" on some of these titles that have long been in the store, so newbies could reap the original benefits.

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 29 2016 4:16 PM

Matthew C Jones:
I have had suspicions on several titles that suddenly go 100%. I'm guessing they, too, are key works that Faithlife wants to see released.

I think you may be right.

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Travis Walter | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 29 2016 4:56 PM

It looks like only approx 100 of the 444 CP titles have reached 50%.  So only roughly 25% of them seem to maybe have a chance.

Of the 100 or so, 55-60 are at 75% or greater.

Its a very slow process..

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 30 2016 5:53 AM

First Catholic titles stopped being added to Community Pricing. Now everybody suffers.

“God watches over the affairs of those who truly love him without their worrying about them.”St. John of the Cross

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jun 30 2016 6:35 AM

For example the catholic encyclopedia https://www.logos.com/product/8511/the-catholic-encyclopedia is near 40%, and and the bar grows very slowly. They should promote at least some important CP resources on the Logos main pace to get wider attention

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 3 2016 4:21 PM

Travis Walter:

It looks like only approx 100 of the 444 CP titles have reached 50%.  So only roughly 25% of them seem to maybe have a chance.

Of the 100 or so, 55-60 are at 75% or greater.

Its a very slow process..

Do you get the feeling not many people know about Community Pricing? Or, worse yet, maybe Faithlife doesn't have all that many customers.

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 3 2016 4:58 PM

Matthew C Jones:
Do you get the feeling not many people know about Community Pricing?

There have been a number of efforts over the years to educate and encourage Logos users such as bidding on a resource through CP and later get it free. It would be interesting to know how many new CP bidders were created from those efforts.

Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God

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Oldnewbie | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 6:03 AM

I have thoroughly enjoyed CP over the years.  The Loeb edition resources have been great for me as well as the apologetics, church history, systematic theology, church fathers and philosophy offerings have all been welcome additions and I hope to add more still (especially the Loeb editions that still haven't come out yet).  As someone with limited financial resources I am extremely thankful to FL for all the help their research has provided me in expanding my horizons intellectually and spiritually through CP.  Don't stop promoting, guys and gals at FL!

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 7:01 AM

I agree with the initial observation. But I posit three major reasons.

1. The Logosian population is evangelical. So 400+ CPs is irrelevant ... it's a narrow interest world.  That's why a group of older 'Bible' translations sits and sits ... they're not the ESV (NIV, HBC, etc) and logically so.

2. It's a mishmash. I find out about CPs and pre-pubs from the forum, and 'about to ship'.  I don't sit day after day checking CPs or PPs.

3. The classic commentaries set the bar pretty high. I didn't get any, but I was impressed they did so well.

A 4th applies to me. Dinking around with putting CPs and PPs back in play if the cost or bid equation came unglued was a turn off. If they want exactness, fine ... but don't waste my time. Then the PP cleanup sort of finished it off.  

I wonder if too, if people are calming down on purchasing in general. Here in Sedona with visits up a lot, purchasing is down significantly. My guess is  Amazon. Their guess, the cosmos (politics, terrorism, fires, and so on). People are nervous.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 9:02 AM

Veli Voipio:

For example the catholic encyclopedia https://www.logos.com/product/8511/the-catholic-encyclopedia is near 40%, and and the bar grows very slowly. They should promote at least some important CP resources on the Logos main pace to get wider attention

The fact that both Verbum.com and Noet.com lack CP is really hurting titles like this one.

“God watches over the affairs of those who truly love him without their worrying about them.”St. John of the Cross

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 2:44 PM

Denise:

I agree with the initial observation. But I posit three major reasons.

1. The Logosian population is evangelical. So 400+ CPs is irrelevant ... it's a narrow interest world.  That's why a group of older 'Bible' translations sits and sits ... they're not the ESV (NIV, HBC, etc) and logically so.

2. It's a mishmash. I find out about CPs and pre-pubs from the forum, and 'about to ship'.  I don't sit day after day checking CPs or PPs.

3. The classic commentaries set the bar pretty high. I didn't get any, but I was impressed they did so well.

A 4th applies to me. Dinking around with putting CPs and PPs back in play if the cost or bid equation came unglued was a turn off. If they want exactness, fine ... but don't waste my time. Then the PP cleanup sort of finished it off.  

I wonder if too, if people are calming down on purchasing in general. Here in Sedona with visits up a lot, purchasing is down significantly. My guess is  Amazon. Their guess, the cosmos (politics, terrorism, fires, and so on). People are nervous.

I think the Logos/Verbum world has been the cash cow funding a ton of other ventures, and it has started to show - despite some of the new features that have come out from Logos Now, a look at UserVoice and the features people complain about most here are not addressed. It's simple things really that show some true attention to the user base - usability features, basic improvement features for things people use every day. Logos has gotten stale for real work in some important ways. How long have we waited for Personal books to get some reasonable library management features, and support for mobile? But that is not sexy and won't sell new users. There are many examples like this - search has not improved in fundamental ways beyond specialized tagging that is only in select resources. More and more Google searches accomplish what Logos does not. It's not that there isn't work being done on Logos, but when funds have been siphoned off of Logos to do other ventures, the improvements have been slow. 

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Greg | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 3:58 PM

Personally I've cut back on bidding on CP titles just to save money. That, and I've noticed many end up as filler material in new sets with every number release.

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 4:28 PM

Filler material in numbered releases ....excellent point.  I forgot about that.

Logos the Cow (hmmm ... Verbum maybe his brother). Most companies can't survive without milking their cows. And I'm not one to be pontificating ... I think they've got Logos in serious over-kill, to the extent customers can't value improvements ... too many too small.

I still say, to survive, web sophistication, and subscription. They're just pounding sand on the desktop. Of course they'd loose me as a customer, but I'm old.

Mr Bob hasn't touched the hem of the garment until he uses his servers to deliver unbelievable sophistication.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 7:41 PM

Denise:
Logos the Cow (hmmm ... Verbum maybe his brother)

Logos the Cow (hmmm ... Verbum maybe his her brother)

Knowing that D. is always precise ...Wink

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 7:54 PM

Touche!

Although I think Logos the Bull is a bit much. But cash cows are the ladies. Never heard of cash bulls.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jul 4 2016 8:48 PM

Denise:

Touche!

Although I think Logos the Bull is a bit much. But cash cows are the ladies. Never heard of cash bulls.

Top quality bull seamen can be exceptionally pricey. And rodeo bulls can earn a lot too.

-Dan

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 5 2016 11:21 AM

Might I add, (only because of completing my daily activity of deleting spam that came across in email subscriptions from the forums), the thirst for new customers is so intense there are absolutely no barriers to gaining a user account that I can see. Of all the ideas suggested on the forums over the years, nothing will stand in the way of possibly getting one new customer on the forums, even if it means fighting a losing battle against robots and spam to the forums - a level of spam that, despite best efforts to stop it once posted, is well beyond any other forum I spend time on.

Who cares if existing users have to suffer a little, if we can get another user in the forums - they might buy something. Users complain too much. Its like Fathlife is totally content with building their defenses to entry behind the unlocked door. With all the wickedness and sophistication going on in the world today, one day Faithlife is going to find they have been wiped out by some hacker just because it's easily possible - all for the quest of one more user, and despite the fact that this is easily correctable and intensely annoying to current users.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 6 2016 9:02 AM

I continue to enjoy not having email subscriptions totthese or other forums. I rarely see any spam on the Logos forums because of this.

“God watches over the affairs of those who truly love him without their worrying about them.”St. John of the Cross

Posts 163
Randy Lane | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 6 2016 7:03 PM

My take (i.e., hunch) on the dearth of new Community Pricing listings is that public domain resources, and similar items that were historically offered through CP, do not, in reality, add many new customers. And Faith Life wants a steady stream of new customers for obvious reasons - its good business. My company uses the phrase "win lives". 

CP listings did not just appear; a lot of effort is required before posting a CP listing. Obtaining the material in good enough condition to be profitably converted to digital, estimating the effort required to produce it, designing the listing. And a whole whole lot more I am sure. So it is pretty clear to me that when Faith Life had the reorganization with a significant RIF (reduction in force, layoffs), those who were mostly tasked with that pre-posting work associated with CP listings were among those either laid off or assigned to different jobs.

I too miss the constant flow of new CP listings. But like one or more others have chimed in, I cut back for financial reasons. There's still probably 10-20 items in the pile that I would pony up for, but on 2 or 3 are even over the 30% mark.

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