Value of NIDOTTE and NIDNTT?
What do the New
International Dictionary of Old Testament Theology and Exegesis and the New
International Dictionary of New Testament Theology bring to the exegetical table beyond the language resources that are already in L4 Platinum? Funding is limited and pre-pubs abound, so I'm trying to decide what should be kept and what has, regrettably, to be let go.
Thanks.
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
Comments
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These are some of the most important tools that you can have in your library after the Bible of course.
You have essays related to proper hermeneutics and interpretation.
The various articles allow you to trace the etymology and usage of key biblical terms and concepts in their original context while considering the meaning in the cultures surrounding Israel (Ancient Near East), in the Old Testament, in the period between the two testaments, and in the New Testament. This is very important when you want to take into account the progress of revelation in the development of various doctrines and avoid anachronism by reading back a later meaning into the Old Testament for example. These works excel at giving you both the lexical and theological contexts of words and concepts. The advantage with this "biblical theology" approach is that assertions have to be backed up by specific verses versus relying on elaborate theological system that might or might not be based on the biblical text. The biblical theology approach also allows you to understand how each section of the Bible dealt with a specific topic. i.e. Salvation in the Pentateuch and the legal materials, in the historical books, in wisdom literature and the psalms, in the prophets and so on. It is important to understand the evolution of the concept and see how the NT meaning(s) came about in the progress of revelation. As far as the NT is concerned, it will break it down to the teaching in the gospels, in the letters of Paul, in the general epistles and books by John.
These are good tools for those who want to start thinking biblical about a topic and see how the bible progressively develops a doctrine while understand the nuances between terms that lose something in translation.
These works are also useful to show how different concepts were transmitted from the Hebrew of the OT to the Greek of the NT and what factored into the new terminology.
of course, as always some discernment is needed, the the assertions are more readily verifiable
Alain
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I am fortunate enough to have these in Book form, I refer to them sporadically, would use them more if i could afford them for my Logos 4.
As a non-theologically trained person, i think these are great, even if a bit deep in places for me..
If I had the money would be a definite purchase
Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have
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Bill,
Beyond Platinum in the area of Greek I'd put owning BDAG before NIDNNT. In my opinion NIDNTT is better than TDNT, so if you find value in TDNT you'll probably enjoy having NIDNTT. (If I had NIDNTT I probably wouldn't care if I had TDNT very much.)
I'm not as familiar with the NIDOTTE as I don't have it in print (just
the old pre-Pradis software version that no longer loads on my
computer) so someone else will have to chime in on that one.Pastor, North Park Baptist Church
Bridgeport, CT USA
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Bill, I would agree with Mark, BDAG is more important and useful than NIDNTT, I also agree that NIDNTT is "a little better" than TDNT, but if on a budget which I am and I already had BDAG and TDNT, which I do, I would not feel bad about not having NIDNTT. However I have all three and use all three,and if I had the NIDNTT in Logos, I most likely would go to it before I went to TDNT, but not always, I also have many other resources that I use, and I doubt that I will spring for the NIDNTT in Logos right now.
I feel one of the weaknesses of the Platinum Library are good language centered commentaries, I personally would get sets such as The Greek Testamentby Henry Alford, The Expositor's Greek Testament, Gnomon of the New Testament, before I will pick up NIDNTT.
In fact I have all of these works and I am going pick these up rather than the NIDNTT because they will help round out my library and they will be more useful to me than the NIDNTT, in Logos.
I still hope to pick up the NIDNTT in June!
In Christ,
Jim
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Thanks all for your insight.
Jim, you said you hope to pick up the NIDNTT in June? It will be at the full price by then, right?
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
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I don't believe anyone mentioned the excellent introductory materials included, especially in the OT. Take a peak at the TOC and material available on amazon for more detailed info.
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June is actually the month that it goes off the discount price for Zondervan owners of other editions, I will not get it at full retail, I hope to pick it up before it goes off sale in June, if the other things I want on pre-pubs have not made it outof pre-pub yet, but if they do I will spend my money on them and just not plan on getting NIDNTT.
The email, that I have from Logos says the price is good until June 10th.
In Christ,
Jim
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I remember that blog. I had translated that to mean that Pradis owners could get whatever package of the new Zondervan resources at 40% off the pre-pub price, while orders made after the pre-pub is released would be 40% off the retail price. I could be completely wrong.
I'm sure this question has been answered before, but does the 40% off apply to only the resources you had in Pradis or does it apply also to those you are ordering that you did not previously own?
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
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Bill Moore said:
Jim, you said you hope to pick up the NIDNTT in June? It will be at the full price by then, right?
I had a Logos sales rep tell me yesterday that most of the Zondervan titles would not go up to full retail when they came off Pre-Pub. He couldn't tell me which ones (it was beyond the scope of our conversation).
Prov. 15:23
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In NT studies, BAGD differs from NIDNTT in that it is not a theological dictionary per se. So, I am not sure that they should be pitted as one versus the other. TDNT and NIDNTT are in the same register. They can be used to complement each other but considering the affluence of NT lexical resources, some might find it superfluous to have both. I used NIDNTT in the past and now own TDNT. I don't feel that I am missing something essential.
In OT studies, it's a different ball game because there is comparatively significantly fewer quality lexical resources available. For instance, there is no real equivalent to Louw-Nida's semantic domains (however NIDOTTE does have a semantic index that cross references to its lexical entries). For the OT then, I have found TWOT isolated in providing a strong theological and context sensitive analysis of usage. I do regard NIDOTTE as an essential complement to TWOT. If I had to choose between the two, I would go NIDOTTE for more meat. Someone who wants shorter articles might prefer the TWOT.
Blessings,
Francis
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I agree that NIDNTT is just a bit better than TDNT. I only have it in book form, but I love it.
"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley0 -
I was told by Logos that most books will stay the same price as the pre-pub price, there are only about 3-4 exceptions, and you can see which are the exceptions by going to the home page for that resource. Only the books with a price between the current pre-pub price and the retail price will go up in price.
One thing that will go up is the whole set price.
So as an example you will get 40% off the pre-pub price for NIDNTT now and until June 10th you will get 40% of the same price, but it will not be called a pre-pub price anymore.
In Christ,
Jim
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JimVanSchoonhoven said:
I was told by Logos that most books will stay the same price as the pre-pub price, there are only about 3-4 exceptions, and you can see which are the exceptions by going to the home page for that resource. Only the books with a price between the current pre-pub price and the retail price will go up in price.
One thing that will go up is the whole set price.
So as an example you will get 40% off the pre-pub price for NIDNTT now and until June 10th you will get 40% of the same price, but it will not be called a pre-pub price anymore.
In Christ,
Jim
That's good to know, Jim. Thanks for clarifying.
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
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Bill Moore said:
What do the New
International Dictionary of Old Testament Theology and Exegesis and the New
International Dictionary of New Testament Theology bring to the exegetical table beyond the language resources that are already in L4 Platinum?One of the reasons I ante up for Logos resources is the
linking of articles allows me to push further into study than I would otherwise
have time for with paper volumes. For that reason, I'm interested in acquiring often
linked books.You might want to check your library and see how extensively
resources you frequently use link to the NIDOTTE and NIDNTT.I checked for links to the NIDOTTE in my library and found
557 results in 419 articles in newer resources that I consult frequently. Such as: 101 results in IVP Dictionaries OT
volumes, 263 in NACs, 89 in the NET Bible Notes, and others. In numerous instances, the NIDOTTE was the only reference
cited for a particular point by an author. The links to the NIDNTT are greater, but I didn't look closely yet.Linked access to the exact entry an author is referring to
seems superior to searching other resources and rolling the dice on whether they
contain the same information.I ran across two articles in the Dictionary for Theological Interpretation
of the Bible that compare Lexicons.
libronixdls:jump|pos=LLS-AOL:0<LEXICONS_NT>.0.0|res=LLS:DICTHINTBBL0 -
I agree with Mark Smith: first BDAG as the one essential. Then I'd place NIDNTT next. You can get LSJ online, thank the Lord, from Perseus, but it's still very nice having it in Logos.
Sad to say however: today is the first time I've opened up NIDNTT, and I read two articles...and the Greek words (in transliteration) were misspelled in both articles, by the transposition of the last letter to the beginning of the word!
2. The meaning of doxa and ōdoxaz is a continuation of the LXX (ōdoxaz should be doxazō)I can't think of what the other word was. In both cases the misspellings were consistent throughout the articles, so there must be an electronic problem...
I've sent in a note to "support", this is pretty disappointing.
Gary Shogren http://openoureyeslord.com
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Gary Shogren said:
You can get LSJ online, thank the Lord, from Perseus, but it's still very nice having it in Logos.
Don't forget the link
Gary Shogren said:You can get LSJ online, thank the Lord, from Perseus, but it's still very nice having it in Logos.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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I find both volumes very helpful. I still go the BDAG and HALOT first for translation work. However, as I look for ways to communicate the nuances in sermonic form, I find that the NIDOTTE and NICNTT offer more value. I too am on a tight budget, but don't regret purchasing them.
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