Promised But Not Delivered

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This post has 17 Replies | 2 Followers

Posts 957
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, Feb 19 2017 3:01 PM

Not sure what to think here ...

Six months after the promise of resources for Verbum 7 we are still waiting:

Verbum Advanced Homiletic Training *

Verbum Advanced Academic Training *

The Confessions of St. Augustine (Audio) *

Orthodoxy (Audio) *         

The Imitation of Christ (Audio) *

Saint Augustine: Letters: vol. VI (1*–29*)

1917 Code of Canon Law *
1917 Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law by Edward Peters *

After the departure of the last of the Catholic products resource champions, It's hard to avoid the connection. 

.... after $$.$$$$ we have a trust problem here Bob. 

Posts 2372
Jan Krohn | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 7:00 PM

Despite all the recent problems, the one thing which Faithlife has been absolutely reliable with in the past is, that they always deliver what they promise.

Sure, delivery can take many months (remember EBNE...) or communication of the ETA of the delivery can be minimal or even non-existent, but in the end they've always delivered.

Therefore, I don't agree that there's a trust problem.

Past IT Consultant. Past Mission Worker. Entrepreneur. Future Seminary Student.
Why Amazon sucks: Full background story of my legal dispute with the online giant

Posts 692
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 7:31 PM

I don't see a problem. I looked at the first 2 in your list. The progress is 100% and is under development. The publication date is 2016. Is this the worst we've ever seen? I think not. They have my full support.

Dale Heath

Posts 692
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 7:43 PM

Steve:

Not sure what to think here ...

Six months after the promise of resources for Verbum 7 we are still waiting:

Please give the details of this promise.

If it's this statement "* Your purchase includes this resource, which isn’t available yet. The resource will automatically download to Verbum once it’s available." I don't see where it's been violated. Once the resource has been released, we'll get it.

Dale Heath

Posts 6591
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 8:01 PM

I'm too busy enjoying other resources, I don't mind waiting for those other ones.

DAL

Posts 27034
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 9:06 PM

Steve:
After the departure of the last of the Catholic products resource champions, It's hard to avoid the connection. 

Your evidence? otherwise it is just an assumed connection

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 5162
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 19 2017 9:29 PM

In the context of Steve's post progress = 100% is meaningless. All that says is enough people were interested in buying to make it financially viable. What is at issue is how long is each persons piece of string in terms of expectation of having paid for the product are you prepared to wait to actually receive it. It has become apparent, only through Steve's asking in another thread that there is currently no product manager, hence Steve's concern about progress on these particular projects. Projects without a leader do tend to stall so while Steve may not be able to make a direct link, he does raise a valid question for which it would be good if somebody at FL were able to comment, rather than him simply being chastised by some fellow  customers for not wording his concerns in a manner that they would have done.

Posts 957
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 4:20 AM

My apologies for a poorly worded post.  Embarrassed  I'll try to do better next time.

Just a couple of follow up comments ...

Still concerned about resources that have been paid for and not delivered after six months.  [Different that pre-pub and EBNE which delivered and then delivered again after a year.] 

Some subjective observations ... turnover in that part of FL appears to have been heavy in the last three to four years ... 100% from an outsiders point of view.  The Blog has almost died from a practical standpoint.  Communication is very thin compared to what it was eighteen months ago.  In short, aside from Verbum 7 itself, it's been discouraging.

I'm sure Ben and Thomas are working on it just as Louis was before he left.  It just seems like a very long time for something advertised as part of a base package.

Yes, I'm enjoying everything else in my new library and very happy for it.  Smile

Posts 259
scooter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 5:01 AM

Steve:
Some subjective observations ... turnover in that part of FL appears to have been heavy in the last three to four years ... 100% from an outsiders point of view.  The Blog has almost died from a practical standpoint.  Communication is very thin compared to what it was eighteen months ago.  In short, aside from Verbum 7 itself, it's been discouraging.

Steve:
Still concerned about resources that have been paid for and not delivered after six months

6 months: U have every right to be concerned.  Thin communication: if workers have quit, then whoever is left at a more senior level should communicate at least quarterly. And comm. should not have to wait for a concerned customer in the forum. 

Companies tend to focus on internals.  Putting customers' concerns on a to do list + then updating them seems sensible, but not always done.  ''The squeaky wheel gets greased.''

Posts 692
Dale E Heath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 5:58 AM

Steve:
''The squeaky wheel gets greased.''

Is the Forum the best place to squeak? Perhaps an email to CS or Bob, or a call to CS would be more effective. I'm just guessing here, being fairly new on the Forum. CS should be able to give you an estimated release date for the missing resources that are at 100%.

The Logos 7 Standard has several resources in the same boat. I think part of the problem is that some of the resources in the base packages are pre-pub that aren't doing very well. It would be helpful if pre-pubs in a base package were also listed all together down where the *notation is. We could then find them easier and check on their progress.

I'm not being critical. These are just random uninformed thoughts that I had.

Dale Heath

Posts 999
Mike Pettit | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 6:23 AM

Jan Krohn:

Despite all the recent problems, the one thing which Faithlife has been absolutely reliable with in the past is, that they always deliver what they promise.

Sure, delivery can take many months (remember EBNE...) or communication of the ETA of the delivery can be minimal or even non-existent, but in the end they've always delivered.

Therefore, I don't agree that there's a trust problem.

This is not actually true, but the instance that I can remember (NIV 1984 RI) was out of their control so it not a "trust" issue, but an "ability" issue.

The root problem is FL's tedious repetition that it would take too much resource to keep people updated and people get upset if timelines change. It does suggest that their own internal controls are lacking in some respects and that the customer is not the priority, it is really a cultural issue that I do find worrying.   

Posts 1051
LogosEmployee
Kyle G. Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 9:53 AM

Steve:

Verbum Advanced Homiletic Training

Verbum Advanced Academic Training

At the moment I don't have any info on this one. I'll see what I can find out.

Steve:

The Confessions of St. Augustine (Audio)

The audio for this is being currently recorded.

Steve:

Orthodoxy (Audio)

The Imitation of Christ (Audio)

Saint Augustine: Letters: vol. VI (1*–29*)

We'll need to update the web page. These have already been delivered.

Steve:

1917 Code of Canon Law

1917 Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law by Edward Peters

The resources themselves are complete. We're finishing up work on a new data type that will allow one to navigate the resources by their 1917 CCL number.

Posts 3150
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 21 2017 5:54 PM

Dale E Heath:
Is the Forum the best place to squeak?

For the record: usually, yes. Smile

Posts 654
Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 22 2017 5:04 AM

SineNomine:

Dale E Heath:
Is the Forum the best place to squeak?

For the record: usually, yes. Smile

Agreed.  I've gotten a much better (and quicker) response to issues in the forums than with sending emails.  I made a suggestion in the "Suggestions" forum a couple weeks ago and it's already been completed.

Posts 5162
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 22 2017 10:43 AM

Dale E Heath:
Is the Forum the best place to squeak? Perhaps an email to CS or Bob, or a call to CS would be more effective. I'm just guessing here, being fairly new on the Forum. CS should be able to give you an estimated release date for the missing resources that are at 100%.

More often than not CS haven't go a clue about what you are asking when it comes to issues like this and if we have to email the CEO of the company every time we have a question to actually get an answer - that means there is something really bad internally going on within the company.

Posts 3938
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 23 2017 10:57 AM

Jan Krohn:

Despite all the recent problems, the one thing which Faithlife has been absolutely reliable with in the past is, that they always deliver what they promise.

Sure, delivery can take many months (remember EBNE...) or communication of the ETA of the delivery can be minimal or even non-existent, but in the end they've always delivered.

Therefore, I don't agree that there's a trust problem.


Syncing personal books to mobile apps was promised back when 4 first came out by the sales people.

Now we are up to version 7, and while PB can be synced between computers, this isn't even on the horizon for mobile devices last I checked.

What about the PB store?

What about quarterly journal updates?

Just saying, they don't ALWAYS follow through. Just usually, and certainly at their own pace.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 5253
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 23 2017 2:03 PM

abondservant I am quite sure Bob or someone from faithlife stated that the PB on mobile devices was something abandoned for legal and technical reasons. I keep important personal books on my iPad in Accordance because it allows you to sync them yourself allowing you to have your personal books on your devices....

-Dan

Posts 3938
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 23 2017 5:48 PM

Dan Francis:

abondservant I am quite sure Bob or someone from faithlife stated that the PB on mobile devices was something abandoned for legal and technical reasons. I keep important personal books on my iPad in Accordance because it allows you to sync them yourself allowing you to have your personal books on your devices....

-Dan



Proving my point. They don't always follow through.

It seems to me that what was actually said was back burner-ed for the foreseeable future. The legal reasons are no different than in syncing between computers as I recall. It was mostly technical and to do with indexing... Could be wrong on that. I haven't been too active on the forums in the last year or so.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

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