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Bill Hurlburt | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Mar 30 2010 3:18 PM

I didn't purchase Logos 4 JUST for the iPhone integration, but it was a part of my decision. I am very disappointed in the speed on the iPhone.

I've been using Laridian's PocketBible for iPhone since its release and, although there are certain design decisions made by Laridian that I don't like, the app itself is very fast. What I don't particularly like is that Laridian chose to ignore the iPhone UI design guide and has an app for the iPhone that behaves like no other. Unfortunately.

So, I like Logos' design better, but I find the speed intolerable.

I will use Logos on the PC and PocketBible from Laridian for the iPhone.

 

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 2:20 AM

Speed is the biggest reason I only use the Logos iPhone app to access resources I don't have in my other Bible app. But in fairness to Logos, it's worth remembering that when it comes to searching your library, it blows away the competition on speed.

Posts 274
Daniel Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 1:55 PM

Bill Hurlburt:

I didn't purchase Logos 4 JUST for the iPhone integration, but it was a part of my decision. I am very disappointed in the speed on the iPhone.

I'm curious which iPhone you have?  Just asking because I use  the app on my iPod Touch, and I started out with a 1st gen iPod Touch which was fairly slow, and then upgraded to a 2nd Gen, which is still occasionally slow but much faster than the apparent 100MHz jump (412 > 533MHz) would account for.  Again, maybe some things will be optimized as the app matures, but I'm pretty happy with it right now on the slightly newer hardware.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 3:23 PM

I'm on a 3GS which is supposed to be the fastest. But it's speed is very poor. On my other Bible app the only time I ever see a spinning wheel is when I access my library. I never see it at any other time, everything is instant. With Logos, I get spinning wheels frequently, even when working offline.

Posts 42
Andrew Loney | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 6:28 PM

Sad I concur. The integration with iPhone was a significant part of my decision to purchase Logos4. I am VERY disappointed and discouraged with the Logos iPhone app. It is slow to the point of unusable at startup, when initially accessing books and when navigating books. Additionally, there are way too many taps required to get started reading. I want an option to open up to exactly where I left off in a book without any navigation. I have moved this app to the back page on my iPhone and have returned to using the Olive Tree app. Sadly, this means I don't have access to all the resources in my Logos Platinum product, but the reality is that the advertised capability to have resources open up to the same location where I left off in Logos on the desktop has rarely worked and never to the exact same page. Most of the time, the resources open up to the title page instead. Then I spend the time I intended to do more reading instead looking for my spot in the resource. Yes, I have an account and yes the iPhone is logged in to that account. In short, speed is very poor and navigation is poorer still.

Posts 2
Bill Hurlburt | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 6:36 PM

I have a 3G. Not a 3GS. I plan on upgrading to the "new" version that will hopefully be released this summer. So maybe it will be sufficiently fast enough to overcome the deficiency of the app itself.

Posts 42
Andrew Loney | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 31 2010 6:48 PM

There is no reason that we should have to upgrade to faster hardware to get reasonable performance. If other Bible reader apps can do it, I am confident Logos can also. I just hope they do sooner than later.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 1 2010 12:52 AM

I suspect the problem is due to the format Logos use. I don't know for certain, but I think the format may be optimised for downloading in bits, and not actually for offline use. For Logos to be as quick as other software, and to allow access to all your library over the cloud then the app would need to be capable of handling two formats. I suspect it's not, and that's where the performance drags come from.

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Dave Dunkin (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 1 2010 9:36 AM

AndrewLoney:
It is slow to the point of unusable at startup, when initially accessing books and when navigating books. Additionally, there are way too many taps required to get started reading.

Andrew, what version of the app do you have? Version 1.3 released last week starts in 1 second on a 3GS and with one touch opens to the last book at the last read position (or close to it; there's a bug affecting non-Bibles.)

Posts 42
Andrew Loney | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 1 2010 5:22 PM

Dave,

I appreciate your reply following up on my concerns.
I am on version 1.3 and also using a 3GS. The initial startup speed is two seconds, which is about on par with Olive Tree, but that's about where the comparison ends. In that two seconds, Olive Tree is now sitting at the exact spot where I left off in the book I was last reading and it does not matter what my network performance is.

On the other hand, even if I am connected on a 3G network, in Logos iPhone I am now looking at a spinning circle while news, advertising and reading plans download. I can choose to ignore this and tap on the reading pane and then I wait four seconds or more (I just tried it and it took about 10 seconds) for the page to show up. At this point, I'm not sure which book has loaded, so I have to tap the center to see the title. The title is so abbreviated that I still can't figure it out, so I click the info button to determine which book has opened. That's another 2-4 seconds at least. Now I need to determine if the book has opened to my spot in that book. That usually means browsing back a screen or two and reading (maybe re-reading) the text to remind myself of where I am. There is no page number displayed (a book mark would be the best) to assist me in where I am in the book. By this time, my usually short available moment to read has passed and I have to move on having not even found my spot. Bibles always seem to open to Genesis 1. Non-Bible books very rarely open anywhere near where I was reading; more often than not opening to the title page. If the book does open somewhere near, it has never been the exact correct page. Usually it is anywhere from 1-3 screens back and I have to re-read the text to find my spot.

That's when it is working at all. Earlier today, I gave it another try and all I saw was the spinning circle. In this case, at least the app opened, but the book (which has been marked for Offliine) will not open at all. All I get is the spinning circle for minutes on end. The problem is I only have two bars signal on the phone. I give up and go back to Olive Tree where in two seconds I'm reading from exactly where I left off even though I have no bars signal.

I am entirely aware that Logos iPhone is on version 1.x and I understand that Logos developers have been very busy with multiple new products. I am confident that they are working very hard. My concern is that I'm not seeing enough indication that Logos understands how far they still need to go before this app will be worth singing praises. I want access to the resources I have invested in Logos on the iPhone. For now, the poor performance and even poorer navigation features cripple my ability to use it.

I hope you will be able to consider this as constructive criticism and not simply a rant.
Thank you
Andrew

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 1 2010 5:36 PM

AndrewLoney:

Earlier today, I gave it another try and all I saw was the spinning circle. In this case, at least the app opened, but the book (which has been marked for Offliine) will not open at all. All I get is the spinning circle for minutes on end. The problem is I only have two bars signal on the phone.

This is actually a major issue. If Logos thinks it has internet access via 3G, but in fact the signal is too weak, it does just sit there and do nothing. At church (where my signal is poor) I often find myself manually switching into flight mode because that's quicker that waiting for Logos to work out it would be better to go offline.

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Kevin A. Purcell | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 1 2010 7:31 PM

I concur. With a slow Internet connection it takes forever to load the Home screen or a book even if already downloaded.

Not sure if this is a simple or major change, but would be helpful for Logos iPhone app to look to see if the reading list and books are downloaded and get them there before ever going to the Internet. And then after it loads the book that is saved locally it can cache the other stuff from the Internet like the Logos news or any other future info that may show on the Home screen.

To compare, in the desktop app we can turn off the Home page loading at start up. Would be nice if we could do the same with iPhone app.

 

With all that said, there is one thing to remember. Logos library is so much larger than any of the other competitors at this point that there is going to have to be a different approach to making that much content available. I think the current road is the right strategy, but could use a tweak as suggested above to make it smoother.

Looking forward to Saturday.

Posts 49
Michael Robinson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 2 2010 10:59 PM

I too find the slowness very frustrating and disappointing. But thanks for the tip on airplane mode - I now understand why it takes forever to open books I know I have on my iPhone. It would be good (as has been suggested) to fix that problem.

On my phone I use Laridian for speed and ease of flipping to and from other resources. I use logos for word studies and checking the original language. Yes.. I flip a lot between the two apps... stupid mono-tasking! 

But I have to disagree with Kevin: "Logos library is so much larger than any of the other competitors at this point that there is going to have to be a different approach to making that much content available."

That may be true in theory, but the books I really wanted to have in my iPhone, viz. Tyndale Commentaries and BST are not yet available. Until they are, the Logos app isn't that useful to me.

As for the ads on start up - I don;t mind them - and its a free app, but would be nice if they only loaded up on the first use each day. Flipping between apps takes even longer with them there every time!

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Dave Dunkin (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 3 2010 5:50 PM

Logos syncs your position in a book between desktop PCs, Macs and mobile. When you open a book and have an Internet connection, the app asks the server for the last position. If your Internet connection is existant but unusably slow, the app really has no way of know that. In that situation my best advice is to put the device in airplane mode.

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Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 3 2010 6:01 PM

Just tested it. Launch time was just more than 1 sec. Time from launch to opening my Bible was 4 seconds. Time from launch to search for a commentary to opening the commentary and navigating to my location was 18 seconds. Not too slow for my standards.

I am on a wifi connection using cable internet however. So the problem doesn't seem inherent to the app but rather how you connect to the web. Like Dave said, if you have slow internet go in airplane mode

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 3 2010 10:45 PM

Dave Dunkin:

If your Internet connection is existant but unusably slow, the app really has no way of know that.

Surely the iPhone API has a network timeout? Can't you lower it? And if (for example) you get multiple timeouts you could offer to turn off internet.

Dave Dunkin:

In that situation my best advice is to put the device in airplane mode.

Moreover, there's no reason why the app can't have a manually switched offline mode. Why should I lose all background connectivity just in an attempt to make the Logos app usable?

 

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 5 2010 10:14 AM

Mark Barnes:

Dave Dunkin:

In that situation my best advice is to put the device in airplane mode.

Moreover, there's no reason why the app can't have a manually switched offline mode. Why should I lose all background connectivity just in an attempt to make the Logos app usable?

I would concur.

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

Posts 98
April Pyle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 6 2010 8:01 PM

So, I like Logos' design better, but I find the speed intolerable.

 

/Quote

 

I find the Ipod Touch app to be considerably faster for me, since I can't afford to buy a faster computer right now, and mine Toshiba Satellite Pro is about six years old.  New hard drive and new RAM but it's just not fast enough.  I can run Logos 4 but it's slower than molasses in January.  Unfortunately a lot of my resources are not available for the Iphone.  Charles Stanley, David Jeremiah, J Vernon Mcgee....I guess I can read in L3, but I really like the new features of L4.

April

Posts 5242
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 7 2010 10:21 AM

Logos iphone is just the worst of all worlds. I have found it works ok speed wise if  you turn on airplane mode, downloaded resources  work great and at a reasonable speed. What I want Logo to do is allow us to set things into offline mode while we are online. This and only this will make the app usable  for people except when they are connected to a very fast WiFI network. My internet is  only about 4 times as fast as dial up, and it;s the best i can get in my area. Even when i am connected to a 3G network it seems sluggish. If i am connect to a fast Wifi then things are fine. MOST of the things i would like to use on my iphone are not going to be coming out for the phone since most every title from Thomas Nelson seems to be kept out for copyright reasons. And for the daily study bible Logos has no rights to update things to make it iphone compatible. To make matters even worse translation notes will not function in offline mode so again logos becomes pretty useless for most everything but the most basic reading. Thank God for olive tree and with the exception of JFB which has become a paid module I didn't have to buy anything to get most of what i had before on my palm (Ilumina hasn't been updated yet and the CWSB is still several weeks off on it's upgrading). 

-Dan

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