Thanks for the Exegetical Summaries updates this year! (and a further suggestion)

Logos has been actively updating the Exegetical summaries series this year, thanks a lot!

https://www.logos.com/product/38965/exegetical-summaries-series

But so far only the Malachi has this very nice functionality: when hovering the mouse on a link, it shows the correct Bible version (here the NIV and also my top Bible version). Next time when FL updates this series, I wish they could add this functionality to all!

Find more posts tagged with

Comments

James Taylor

Excellent I hadn't noticed this, but it sure does increase the value of this series

Lee

This is very useful. Thanks FL.

Edwin Bowden

Logos has been actively updating the Exegetical summaries series this year, thanks a lot!

https://www.logos.com/product/38965/exegetical-summaries-series

[Y][Y]

Veli Voipio

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/920387#Comment_920387

Well, this morning I received the updated version of Malachi, and it gave me a very bad surprise: the best feature is lost!

Is there any way to get the old version back?

Is there any way to change the title of this thread - for example update=downgrade (the Microsoft way) ?

I hope Faithlife will find someone answer to this disappointment here before the sun rises in Bellingham! [8o|]

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/928192#Comment_928192

This seems like a reasonable request. I'll put an update into motion.

Mike Tourangeau

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/958611#Comment_958611

I see that some of the Exegetical Summaries link directly to commentaries, but some do not. I did a search in the forums but did not find any specific info on this. Has Faithlife committed to updating the entire series to link directly to commentaries?

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1009689#Comment_1009689

I see that some of the Exegetical Summaries link directly to commentaries, but some do not. I did a search in the forums but did not find any specific info on this. Has Faithlife committed to updating the entire series to link directly to commentaries?

Yes. That is the plan. They're not being updated as fast as I'd hoped but they've all been approved and are at various stages of progress.

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1009880#Comment_1009880

They're not being updated as fast as I'd hoped

So we must be patient.

but they've all been approved and are at various stages of progress.

That is good to hear.

LimJK

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1009880#Comment_1009880

Yes. That is the plan. They're not being updated as fast as I'd hoped but they've all been approved and are at various stages of progress.

[Y] +1 Thank You!

Milkman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010344#Comment_1010344

So will this upgrade be fully functional? If not FL needs to let the purchaser be aware of it. I can't imagine they would release a product knowing the past issues with this product. I don't think they will, but if it's not fully functional, FL NEEDS TO let the buyer be appraised about them.

I'm planning to buy the second volume of John, but not before these issues are resolved.

mm.

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010701#Comment_1010701

So will this upgrade be fully functional? If not FL needs to let the purchaser be aware of it. I can't imagine they would release a product knowing the past issues with this product. I don't think they will, but if it's not fully functional, FL NEEDS TO let the buyer be appraised about them.

I'm planning to buy the second volume of John, but not before these issues are resolved.

mm.

Exegetical Summaries have always been functional. They've never been not released according to our baseline standards for commentaries. Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

The volume you linked was produced according to our new, enhanced standards.

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010930#Comment_1010930

Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

Kyle, this is much appreciated. To help me understand, could you summarize how the tagging is different and goes beyond the normal process?

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010932#Comment_1010932

Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

Kyle, this is much appreciated. To help me understand, could you summarize how the tagging is different and goes beyond the normal process?

Absolutely!

Here's what happened and how we responded.

Exegetical Summaries was produced many, many years ago. When comparing other translations, the commentary used abbreviations for Bible translations and commentary series. Rather than use a normal abbreviation tag (e.g. when you hover over the abbreviation "NIV" the popup would read New International Version) which is completely standard for all our books--if there is an abbreviation page in the front of the book those abbreviations get tagged as abbreviations--we did something different. We made the abbreviations links (e.g. if there was an NIV abbreviation for John 3:16 we would link you to John 3:16 of the NIV).
Some of the books we produced in the early 2000's were sort of the wild west in terms of standardization. When we do full updates of resources we bring them up to our current standards. This is normally a very good thing but it went wrong here.
About a year ago I put the series in for an update, this was to add further linking and to feed a feature set. Unfortunately by updating it to our current standards it broke a feature people really, really liked: the abbreviations were no longer links, they were just abbreviation popups!
This was an understandable frustration. The update felt like a regression. So we began the process of changing the abbreviations back to links.
I also updated our production processes so that the Exegetical Summaries series becomes its own special thing that will always deviate from our Standard Operating Procedure of how we tag abbreviations.
Since this happened I think we've produced or are in the process of producing two or three new volumes. These have been produced according to the new standards for Exegetical Summaries (the standards people like!).

I hope that clears things up.

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010954#Comment_1010954

Thanks Kyle for the thorough explanation and for your team's commitment to continue to make the Exegetical Summaries better which, in turn, makes Logos even better!

Tom Reynolds

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011040#Comment_1011040

Great to hear. This series is the best single series you offer.

Bobby Terhune

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011048#Comment_1011048

Kyle,

Was linking to BAG going to change to linking to BADG?

Whyndell Grizzard

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011059#Comment_1011059

Kyle,

Why not pick up the series "A Semantic and Structural Analysis" I use these in print often, and these would be a great addition to L8.

Milkman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1010930#Comment_1010930

thanks Kyle,

So when you say:

Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

Can we be rest assured that these Summaries will meet if not exceed the high standards that FL puts in all resources? I'm speaking directly about the other Summaries in this series that are 'fully functional' meaning all tags and hyper links are operative.

So will this upgrade be fully functional? If not FL needs to let the purchaser be aware of it. I can't imagine they would release a product knowing the past issues with this product. I don't think they will, but if it's not fully functional, FL NEEDS TO let the buyer be appraised about them.

I'm planning to buy the second volume of John, but not before these issues are resolved.

mm.

Exegetical Summaries have always been functional. They've never been not released according to our baseline standards for commentaries. Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

The volume you linked was produced according to our new, enhanced standards.

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011059#Comment_1011059

Kyle,

Was linking to BAG going to change to linking to BADG?

We get asked this from time to time in other contexts and I'll try answer this two ways: one that is how we handle it generally and the other in regards to Exegetical Summaries.

General: We won't change a citation. i.e. if a resource references a particular work we're not going to update the resource so it points to a different work even if their related. BAG and BADG are particularly tricky in this regard since they don't have a one-to-one paged relationship (i.e. page 60 isn't the same in either). Thus, if a resource references BAG we'll tag it that way. This is great for the lucky ones that have it but not great for the rest. We've heard the request to make it available for sale and its something that we would like to have happen but hasn't been able to happen yet.
Exegetical Summaries: What I said generally applies here as well but I want to add one piece of additional information. When I mentioned earlier that we changed links to abbreviations and are in the process of changing them back to links this was true if there was a verifiable target. Back to my original example of the an abbreviation for NIV on John 3:16: we're able to link to John 3:16 because we have a known destination (NIV) and a known target (John 3:16) which a viable anchor point (a milestone for John 3:16). This is true for commentaries as well. An abbreviation of WBC used on John 3:16 tells us the resource (WBC Commentary on John) and a known target with a viable anchor point (John 3:16). An abbreviation like BAG tells us a known destination (BAG) but doesn't provide us a known target with a viable anchor point. Thus these were abbreviations, remained abbreviations, and will continue to be abbreviations.

Hope that helps!

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011080#Comment_1011080

thanks Kyle,

So when you say:

Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

Can we be rest assured that these Summaries will meet if not exceed the high standards that FL puts in all resources? I'm speaking directly about the other Summaries in this series that are 'fully functional' meaning all tags and hyper links are operative.

So will this upgrade be fully functional? If not FL needs to let the purchaser be aware of it. I can't imagine they would release a product knowing the past issues with this product. I don't think they will, but if it's not fully functional, FL NEEDS TO let the buyer be appraised about them.

I'm planning to buy the second volume of John, but not before these issues are resolved.

mm.

Exegetical Summaries have always been functional. They've never been not released according to our baseline standards for commentaries. Due to customer feedback we have created processes for this particular series that make the tagging for this series go beyond our normal processes for how a commentary might be tagged.

The volume you linked was produced according to our new, enhanced standards.

I think I answered something similar earlier. In case you missed it, I'll repost it. If I still haven't answered your question, I'll take another try:

Absolutely!

Here's what happened and how we responded.

Exegetical Summaries was produced many, many years ago. When comparing other translations, the commentary used abbreviations for Bible translations and commentary series. Rather than use a normal abbreviation tag (e.g. when you hover over the abbreviation "NIV" the popup would read New International Version) which is completely standard for all our books--if there is an abbreviation page in the front of the book those abbreviations get tagged as abbreviations--we did something different. We made the abbreviations links (e.g. if there was an NIV abbreviation for John 3:16 we would link you to John 3:16 of the NIV).
Some of the books we produced in the early 2000's were sort of the wild west in terms of standardization. When we do full updates of resources we bring them up to our current standards. This is normally a very good thing but it went wrong here.
About a year ago I put the series in for an update, this was to add further linking and to feed a feature set. Unfortunately by updating it to our current standards it broke a feature people really, really liked: the abbreviations were no longer links, they were just abbreviation popups!
This was an understandable frustration. The update felt like a regression. So we began the process of changing the abbreviations back to links.
I also updated our production processes so that the Exegetical Summaries series becomes its own special thing that will always deviate from our Standard Operating Procedure of how we tag abbreviations.
Since this happened I think we've produced or are in the process of producing two or three new volumes. These have been produced according to the new standards for Exegetical Summaries (the standards people like!).

Milkman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011105#Comment_1011105

Thank you Kyle,

I'm not sure if you alluded to 'when' these Summaries will be fully tagged/linked in each Resource.

In your reply you said:

This was an understandable frustration. The update felt like a regression. So we began the process of changing the abbreviations back to links.

So the question(s) I have is:

will all the current and future Summaries be fully tagged/linked?
will those Summaries that I have in my library be updated so I can click & select links and not just get a popup?

Not sure if the forum is the best way to communicate frustrations. However, there may be some others who feel the same.

regards.

Bobby Terhune

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011214#Comment_1011214

Kyle,

I just grabbed at random this section from 1 thes. 1:1

LEXICON—a. χάρις (LN 88.66): ‘grace’ [BAGD, Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions], ‘favor’ [BAGD], ‘kindness’ [LN].
b. εἰρήνη (LN 22.42; 25.248): ‘peace’ [Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions].

Since you are enhancing the tagging on this resource above and beyond your normal tagging standards, can a case be made to link the BAGD & LN links to "words" actually take us to that word is the appropriate resource? it would greatly enhance the usefulness of this series.

Alain Maashe

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011375#Comment_1011375

Kyle,

I just grabbed at random this section from 1 thes. 1:1

LEXICON—a. χάρις (LN 88.66): ‘grace’ [BAGD, Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions], ‘favor’ [BAGD], ‘kindness’ [LN].
b. εἰρήνη (LN 22.42; 25.248): ‘peace’ [Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions].

Since you are enhancing the tagging on this resource above and beyond your normal tagging standards, can a case be made to link the BAGD & LN links to "words" actually take us to that word is the appropriate resource? it would greatly enhance the usefulness of this series.

Michael McLane

But so far only the Malachi has this very nice functionality: when hovering the mouse on a link, it shows the correct Bible version (here the NIV and also my top Bible version). Next time when FL updates this series, I wish they could add this functionality to all!

I am not getting this behavior. Is there a setting that I need to flip on in order for it to do this?

Mark

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011394#Comment_1011394

I also am not seeing this behavior in Malachi. Kyle, what are we doing wrong?

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011214#Comment_1011214

Thank you Kyle,

I'm not sure if you alluded to 'when' these Summaries will be fully tagged/linked in each Resource.

In your reply you said:

This was an understandable frustration. The update felt like a regression. So we began the process of changing the abbreviations back to links.

So the question(s) I have is:

will all the current and future Summaries be fully tagged/linked?

will those Summaries that I have in my library be updated so I can click & select links and not just get a popup?

Not sure if the forum is the best way to communicate frustrations. However, there may be some others who feel the same.

regards.

Here is where we are in the process:

Titles that have been updated or created according to the new (old) standards:

An Exegetical Summary of Acts 15–28
An Exegetical Summary of Joel
An Exegetical Summary of John 10–21
An Exegetical Summary of Luke 1–11
An Exegetical Summary of Matthew 17–28
An Exegetical Summary of Revelation 1–11

The rest of the series is being worked on, included the Malachi volume referenced above.

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011389#Comment_1011389

Kyle,

I just grabbed at random this section from 1 thes. 1:1

LEXICON—a. χάρις (LN 88.66): ‘grace’ [BAGD, Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions], ‘favor’ [BAGD], ‘kindness’ [LN].
b. εἰρήνη (LN 22.42; 25.248): ‘peace’ [Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions].

Since you are enhancing the tagging on this resource above and beyond your normal tagging standards, can a case be made to link the BAGD & LN links to "words" actually take us to that word is the appropriate resource? it would greatly enhance the usefulness of this series.

+1

This isn't anything we have planned at the moment. Currently it would need to be an intensive mostly manual endeavor. It would be technology we'd need to develop in order to scale.

Mark

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011432#Comment_1011432

Here is where we are in the process:

Titles that have been updated or created according to the new (old) standards:

An Exegetical Summary of Acts 15–28

An Exegetical Summary of Joel

An Exegetical Summary of John 10–21

An Exegetical Summary of Luke 1–11

An Exegetical Summary of Matthew 17–28

An Exegetical Summary of Revelation 1–11

The rest of the series is being worked on, included the Malachi volume referenced above.

Thanks Kyle. I see it working in Joel. So this helped me a lot to see what is being planned for all the series

Mark

Veli Voipio

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011394#Comment_1011394

I am not getting this behavior. Is there a setting that I need to flip on in order for it to do this?

My first post was in September 2017 when it did work. My second post shows that the functionality was lost.

This isn't anything we have planned at the moment. Currently it would need to be an intensive mostly manual endeavor. It would be technology we'd need to develop in order to scale.

I look forward to that. I guess it would be useful for many other resources too, and could enhance the Logos leading edge.

[H]

Michael S.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011048#Comment_1011048

Great to hear. This series is the best single series you offer.

This series does for textual analysis what the Lexham Bible Guides do for hermeneutical analysis.

https://www.logos.com/product/27493/lexham-bible-guides-pauls-letters-collection

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1013283#Comment_1013283

Great to hear. This series is the best single series you offer.

This series does for textual analysis what the Lexham Bible Guides do for hermeneutical analysis.

https://www.logos.com/product/27493/lexham-bible-guides-pauls-letters-collection

Thank you for the kind words Tom and Michael. I shared your comments with the creators of the Exegetical Summaries series this morning and they were both thankful and encouraged.

And also thank you for the kind words about Lexham Bible Guides! We like them too!

Michael S.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1013340#Comment_1013340

Thank you for the kind words Tom and Michael. I shared your comments with the creators of the Exegetical Summaries series this morning and they were both thankful and encouraged.

And also thank you for the kind words about Lexham Bible Guides! We like them too!

That is great! I hope both of those works continue until all 66 (and more if possible) are done. They are a good time saver: a personal research assistant (which flows well with the vision of the Logos program).

Veli Voipio

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011433#Comment_1011433

Kyle,

I just grabbed at random this section from 1 thes. 1:1

LEXICON—a. χάρις (LN 88.66): ‘grace’ [BAGD, Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions], ‘favor’ [BAGD], ‘kindness’ [LN].
b. εἰρήνη (LN 22.42; 25.248): ‘peace’ [Hn, HNTC, ICC, LN, Lns, WBC; all versions].

Since you are enhancing the tagging on this resource above and beyond your normal tagging standards, can a case be made to link the BAGD & LN links to "words" actually take us to that word is the appropriate resource? it would greatly enhance the usefulness of this series.

+1

This isn't anything we have planned at the moment. Currently it would need to be an intensive mostly manual endeavor. It would be technology we'd need to develop in order to scale.

This might be a workaround for the time being:

Just press the Louw-Nida link, when the Louw-Nida resource has the BDAG as multiple resource.

Sometimes needs manual scrolling in the BDAG panel.

Claude Brown Jr

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1011432#Comment_1011432

Thank you Kyle,

I'm not sure if you alluded to 'when' these Summaries will be fully tagged/linked in each Resource.

In your reply you said:

This was an understandable frustration. The update felt like a regression. So we began the process of changing the abbreviations back to links.

So the question(s) I have is:

will all the current and future Summaries be fully tagged/linked?

will those Summaries that I have in my library be updated so I can click & select links and not just get a popup?

Not sure if the forum is the best way to communicate frustrations. However, there may be some others who feel the same.

regards.

Yes

Yes

Here is where we are in the process:

Titles that have been updated or created according to the new (old) standards:

An Exegetical Summary of Acts 15–28

An Exegetical Summary of Joel

An Exegetical Summary of John 10–21

An Exegetical Summary of Luke 1–11

An Exegetical Summary of Matthew 17–28

An Exegetical Summary of Revelation 1–11

The rest of the series is being worked on, included the Malachi volume referenced above.

Here we are FIVE YEARS later no linking satisfaction.....

Donovan R. Palmer

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1253420#Comment_1253420

Watching this thread and anything to do with Exegetical Summaries. I use this resource every day!

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1253420#Comment_1253420

Here we are FIVE YEARS later no linking satisfaction.....

By July of 2019 we pushed out updates to 32 titles. Is there something in particular that is missing?

Mark

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1254229#Comment_1254229

Kyle

Is this series finished or is work being done on other books of the Bible?

Kyle G. Anderson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/1254306#Comment_1254306

Kyle

Is this series finished or is work being done on other books of the Bible?

I'm not sure. According to SIL's website there are only 32 volumes and they don't list any of their publishing plans.