Logos 8 Wishlist

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This post has 494 Replies | 31 Followers

Posts 12813
Forum MVP
Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 20 2018 12:32 AM

David McAllan:
By default, Logos operates as Logos 3 where the search just searched books or collections and displayed results. It was not that slow.

Logos 3 used a different method of indexing. Indexing was quicker, but searching was slower. It had a separate index for every book. Search 20,000 books and it would need to search 20,000 indexes. I'm not convinced that would be an improvement, for anyone with more than a few hundreds books.

David McAllan:
Logos allows users to download a separate index file effectively giving 2 files for each book. Logos will have this separate file indexed and the indexer will search these files and display results. This is how it was with Logos 2. It would require more local hard drive storage, but with abundant storage in today's computers, this should not be a problem

Logos 2 worked in pretty the same way as Logos 4-7. When you added a new resource, there would be a slightly delay on startup while Logos 2 "merged the global word list" or something like that. I forget the exact wording. Merging is the major part of Logos 4-7 indexing, and what takes most of the time.

The reason you probably look back fondly on the 'speed' of Logos 2 and Logos 3 is simply that you had fewer books and there was far less powerful searching. In other words, it wasn't quicker per se, there was just far, far less to index.

Posts 1688
LogosEmployee
Phil Gons (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 20 2018 11:29 AM

There's no client-side indexing on the web app. As we bring more desktop functionality there, that could be part of the solution, so long as you don't have significant offline needs.

We're also exploring some ways to make desktop indexing take significantly less time and happen less often.

Posts 3936
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 20 2018 12:40 PM

David McAllan:

The biggest improve I'd like to see is the end of the indexing. It is an absolute bugbear and I have a 7 core processor.

I can see 2 options being presented to the user of Logos 8:

1. By default, Logos operates as Logos 3 where the search just searched books or collections and displayed results. It was not that slow.

2. Logos allows users to download a separate index file effectively giving 2 files for each book. Logos will have this separate file indexed and the indexer will search these files and display results. This is how it was with Logos 2. It would require more local hard drive storage, but with abundant storage in today's computers, this should not be a problem.

Logos is great, but indexing takes the shine away. That's my 2 cents worth. Thanks.



Unless I remember wrong, Logos is already using sort of a twist on your number two. It downloads the index, and then merges them all together. Searching one BIG file, is a lot faster than searching through twenty thousand individual files. Even if it does take a minute to add in the new data.

Perhaps there is a more efficient structure that could be created for merging the new data into the index, but I find that unlikely. Every suggestion I've had in this area has been met with "well ... we already do that". I don't think about it any more. My ryzen 7 handles the indexing pretty smoothly. I haven't done a full re-index in a while (probably since I built the machine).

The best investments into my own PC that I've made in regards to Logos was the Solid State drive (using an M.2. by Samsung now), and 16gb of ram.

We are using the porshe, or bmw, or mercedes of the bible software world. Gas, oil, and coolant are expensive. But necessary for a mercedes/bmw/bugati/whatever to run right. An appropriately fast computer is sort of like the gas, oil, and coolant for a car. All are neccesary for the car to work right.

I know you mentioned an i7 processor. But which generation? There are 7 now, and each is faster by a good margin than the last. If you have a 7 year old i7 that could well be part of your issue. Assuming its not, the solid state drive breathes new life into your machine. Even if you did that without increasing your Ram.

The SSD upgrade is probably 100$, depending on how much space you need it can be a lot more. Any decent computer tech can help you, or you can do it your self. Its not too hard. The worst part is reinstalling the OS if you don't have software to clone your existing drive.


L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 9680
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 20 2018 1:42 PM

Not disagreeing with David. But I use the indexing primarily on CitedBy panels. Resources like the massorah absolutely demand CitedBy, which means indexing into a very efficient 'find'.

The Logos search itself is abysmal, and I try to avoid it ... mainly using Control-F and in-line. Ignoring the well-criticized UI, the index only benefits the look-up, usually measured in fractions of a second. The major time-burner is presentation time. And if any user-error (me), it's wait, wait, wait. And you get 2-3 sequencing choices from 10 years ago.


Posts 192
Chris K | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 22 2018 1:38 PM

I also agree on better simple search.

Most of the time I am just trying to search an open resource for specific key words or phrases.  This should be pretty straightforward and easy...but not in Logos.  

I would like to see a simple search within a resource more like what we are used to in Google/etc.  It shows the results, with a small preview, and we can click to go to that result, or back to go back to the search results.

While Logos has some impressive advanced searching tools - the simple search (which is used at least for me more often than not) is extremely user-unfriendly/non-existent.

Posts 192
Chris K | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 22 2018 1:39 PM

While I know it has been said that this will not be supported by Faithlife (despite great customer desire) I will throw out again the desire to have personal books uploaded and synced to the cloud and supported on the mobile apps :)

Posts 21150
Forum MVP
Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 22 2018 2:02 PM

Chris K:

Most of the time I am just trying to search an open resource for specific key words or phrases.  This should be pretty straightforward and easy...but not in Logos.  

I would like to see a simple search within a resource more like what we are used to in Google/etc.  It shows the results, with a small preview, and we can click to go to that result, or back to go back to the search results

This is possible today.

In a Basic Search you can select from the set of open resources (click the “All Resources” link to see this and then run the search

Or you could use an Inline Search

if you have tried this, what dont they provide that you are looking for?

Posts 1163
LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 23 2018 2:00 AM

Phil,

I wish to see Logos 8 for Mac not to switch to discrete GPU for stuffs that is really not graphically intensive. However, If you do need to switch to discrete GPU it will be nice to switch it back to built-in GPU.

I recalled raising this in Logos 4 in 2012 ... and somewhere along the way in one of Logos 5, 6 or 7 it was fixed.  Unfortunately, this issue reappeared in the recent update(s). Thank you for your consideration.

See issue raised here:

https://community.logos.com/forums/t/172048.aspx 

JK

MacBookPro Retina 15" Mid 2014 2.5GHz RAM:16GB SSD:512GB macOS Mojave 10.14.1 | iPhone X iOS 12.1

Posts 536
Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 1 2018 5:56 PM

I was trying to prioritize the NABRE bible, but only for certain Catholic resources like the Catholic Daily Readings and the Catechism. I see that I can select a resource for the NABRE to be the prioritized resource. However it looks like I can only do that for one resource from the drop down list.

Can this be changed so that you can select multiple resources from the drop down list instead of just one? I realize I can probably just drag the NABRE over multiple times and do it for each individual resource but that seems like a pain. I just want the NABRE to be my top bible for certain resources (Lectionary, Missal, and Catechism) and the NRSV to be the top bible for everything else. I would love to be able to make a special collection for these three resources that I can then select from the "prioritize only for this resource" drop down list. OR if it would let me select multiple resources from that drop down list for which the NABRE is the top bible instead of just one. I've had to drag and drop the NABRE over to the sidebar 4 times, 3 times for each individual resource for which I want it to be the top bible, and then once for where I want it prioritized among my top 5 bibles. This should be easier.

Posts 5
Br Damien-Joseph OSB | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 10:04 AM

Hey Phil how's it going,

What would be incredible would be a Documentary Source visual filter for the Pentateuch. Basically, a filter that allows you to toggle between texts, so that different authors can either be marked by icons or else drop out of view entirely. The goal is to be able to read all of, for example, the Yahwist's passages consecutively. One would be able see what the general consensus is on authorship and read the story via a single author's viewpoint, perhaps picking up certain patterns in the text. One would have to be careful about the tool fueling a person's confirmation bias about the text and about the text only reinforcing one way of thinking about the text (tools aren't meant to reinforce truth, only to allow us to play with the text). Of course, there are places in the text where authorship gets ugly (cf. Gen 7-8) but there are plenty of other places where this would be an amazing tool. To boot, if icons were used as separation markers between source texts, the programmer could hyperlink various resources that argue for/against the source authorship of that passage.

Make sense? I know that this could be a somewhat hairy issue (though some of the hair could be resolved by including links to resources that offer different technical perspectives on the texts). I'm not gonna lie, I basically want Logos Bible Software to do my homework for me. :) It's probably too late to get this this semester though, but maybe others would find this tool useful.

Thanks.

Br. Damien-Joseph (Brandon) Rappuhn OSB

Posts 1493
Forum MVP
Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 12:29 PM

Hey Brandon, I mean Br Damien-Jospeh! Smile I hope you are well!

I'm guessing you know about the Visual Filter for the AFAT Bible that will display different colors based on Eissfeldt's classification. It's available here: https://faithlife.com/logos-visual-filters/documents. It will at least do part of what you are asking, only in that Bible though.

Posts 108
Darryl Burling | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 4:01 PM

Not in order of priority...

1. A way to finally combine note files nicely

2. Dark mode for OSX Mojave

3. I'd like to see a way of visualizing collections and being able to quickly access books within a collection. Perhaps the ability to drag and drop a collection to the toolbar and then click on it to see the books and click on one to open it? 

Posts 5
Br Damien-Joseph OSB | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 7:24 PM

Fr Devin Roza:

Hey Brandon, I mean Br Damien-Jospeh! Smile I hope you are well!

I'm guessing you know about the Visual Filter for the AFAT Bible that will display different colors based on Eissfeldt's classification. It's available here: https://faithlife.com/logos-visual-filters/documents. It will at least do part of what you are asking, only in that Bible though.

Thanks Fr. Devin! It's good to hear from you, I am doing well. I did not know about that visual filter. Thankfully I have the resource and was able to find the filter so I can use this resource to partly achieve my goals. But for what I need, it may just be easier for me to copy and paste together my own J source composite text...

Posts 3936
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 7:37 PM

LimJK:

Phil,

I wish to see Logos 8 for Mac not to switch to discrete GPU for stuffs that is really not graphically intensive. However, If you do need to switch to discrete GPU it will be nice to switch it back to built-in GPU.

I recalled raising this in Logos 4 in 2012 ... and somewhere along the way in one of Logos 5, 6 or 7 it was fixed.  Unfortunately, this issue reappeared in the recent update(s). Thank you for your consideration.

See issue raised here:

https://community.logos.com/forums/t/172048.aspx 



I'm ok with the program using as much of my systems resources as it wants. frequently (but not always) more resources is better.

I wonder if the GPU can index faster than the CPU?

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 1163
LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 8:21 PM

abondservant:

I'm ok with the program using as much of my systems resources as it wants. frequently (but not always) more resources is better.

I wonder if the GPU can index faster than the CPU?

Hi abondservant,

I can understand your point of view if you are at home or in office and have AC power on all the time with multiple screens. For some of us, where we depend on battery for a good part of day out of office or home. Halving of our battery life for us is a challenge Sad the point is that it was fixed for a while ... the bug came back only recently. I also noted that some of the panels that triggered switching to discrete GPU are really not graphically challenging like the home page, Psalm Explorer, etc.

I am merely expressing my wish for Logos to fixed this problem Smile

I am not sure if Logos uses Graphics GPU for faster indexingSurprise

JK

MacBookPro Retina 15" Mid 2014 2.5GHz RAM:16GB SSD:512GB macOS Mojave 10.14.1 | iPhone X iOS 12.1

Posts 3936
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 2 2018 8:45 PM

I understand your point, yes I am on AC power almost all the time, I do have and use a laptop. BUT i let it do the heavy lifting while plugged in.

I wasn't speaking to the bug so much as my desire for the software to make use of ALL my resources to the extent it can. I'm sure there could be check done at start - is this device on battery? if so be gentle. If not, use as much as is available to get that indexing or search done.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 1477
Forum MVP
Reuben Helmuth | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 3 2018 6:34 AM

Darryl Burling:
A way to finally combine note files nicely

Darryl, perhaps you're not aware that Notes are being totally redone (Note Files/Documents are going bye-bye!). You can try out the beta by joining this Faithlife Group.

Posts 234
Mikko Paavola | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Oct 13 2018 11:16 AM

This one is must for Logos 8 Lutheran Base packages at least:

https://www.logos.com/product/42072/kretzmanns-popular-bible-commentary

Faithlife Connect + several Base Packages + Luther's Works, etc.
Lenovo ThinkPad Yoga 260, Win 10 Pro, Intel Core i7-6500U, 16GB RAM, 256GB SSD, Intel HD Graphics 520.
iPhone 7 Plus.

Posts 4603
David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 15 2018 7:39 AM

Since I'm not sure if my comments from a different thread will be seen in regard to this topic, I'm posting a link here.

Posts 4823
doc | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 17 2018 12:33 AM

Reuben Helmuth:

Darryl Burling:
A way to finally combine note files nicely

Darryl, perhaps you're not aware that Notes are being totally redone (Note Files/Documents are going bye-bye!). You can try out the beta by joining this Faithlife Group.

Is this is incorrect information being communicated?  

From what I have heard and what I see in the web app is that notebooks are not going “bye-bye!”. They simply will not be required for notetaking but will continue to exist as an option for those that want to make use of them.

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