Bob: The mistake of bloat v real value increases

Page 2 of 4 (75 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 Next >
This post has 74 Replies | 6 Followers

Posts 809
Cynthia in Florida | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 2:53 PM

Little old me...making a suggestion from the ignorant department.

I know part of the area of concern is income, because as mentioned in Bob's thread, many of us have the majority of the resources we need/want, and aren't making the big purchases anymore.

Here's my suggestion.

I have tried introducing this software to my classes over the years.  I teach inductive studies to very large classes filled with women who are constantly asking me how I got "all this information."  I tell them about it.  I even held a very beginner workshop just to show them how to use it for VERY basic Bible study. You know how many ladies in all my years have actually purchased it?  Probably 5 (that I know of.)  But because packages are expensive and the learning curve is so overwhelming, those who showed a pretty good interest decided against it.  They commented that its just easier to do a google search.

Well, my thinking is that regarding Logos, I started very basic, as most of us did (okay, maybe just me.)  I started with a basic library--a couple hundred bucks.  However, because I'm tenacious, (and help from Mark's unofficial Logos 4 videos), I stuck with figuring it out a bit and finally learned how to use a Bible with a word study dictionary and a concordance and a commentary all on the same screen! Big Smile Since then, I've spent more time and money than I care to share, as I've grown my library and learned new features.

I REALLY believe, and I've said this many times before, that until they make it where the lay person with little computer knowledge can figure out how to use the program without having to have a PhD, they will miss out on an entire market of people who are looking for something like this but don't have the time to invest in figuring it out.  It's so focused on the pastor and teacher that it fails to market to the lay person. 

"And that's what I've got to say about that!"

Cynthia

Romans 8:28-38

Posts 563
Scott E. Mahle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 3:02 PM

Cynthia in Florida:

I REALLY believe, and I've said this many times before, that until they make it where the lay person with little computer knowledge can figure out how to use the program without having to have a PhD, they will miss out on an entire market of people who are looking for something like this but don't have the time to invest in figuring it out.  It's so focused on the pastor and teacher that it fails to market to the lay person. 

"And that's what I've got to say about that!"

Hopefully Faithlife hears and understands what you have written. I completely agree! Yes

Logos Series X Pastor’s Library | Logos 3 Leader’s Library | Logos 4 Portfolio | Logos 5 Platinum | Logos 6 Feature Crossgrade | Logos 7 Essential Upgrade - Large | Logos 8 Methodist & Wesleyan Platinum and Academic Professional

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 4:46 PM

Scott E. Mahle:
Hopefully Faithlife hears and understands what you have written. I completely agree! Yes

Agree. Especially with the low price point of the FC (or is it FLC?) , the market could really expand if certain components of the program were more apparent.

However, considering the amount of capabilities, I am not entirely sure how to make it simpler without removing functionality. Maybe a way to hide "advanced" functionality so the menus appear simpler...

Posts 592
Ted Weis | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 5:31 PM

Cynthia in Florida:
I know part of the area of concern is income, because as mentioned in Bob's thread, many of us have the majority of the resources we need/want, and aren't making the big purchases anymore.

You've summed up myself. That's one reason why I never felt the need to jump onto Logos Now. I'm fully vested in Logos, use it daily, but the enthusiasm wore off sometime ago. I do pray for the company's continued vitality. But I have no interest in a subscription model. I want to own my resources and features, period. As for the bloatware, I agree with what many have said here. I'm busy with my own stuff and don't care about the superfluous stuff. I just want well tagged resources and more available books.

Posts 2305
Beloved | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 5:50 PM

Ted Weis:
I'm busy with my own stuff and don't care about the superfluous stuff. I just want well tagged resources and more available books.

You have spurred me to reassess my perceived need for the latest feature as soon as it is developed rather than waiting until it is released for full ownership. I agree with the rest of your argument totally and judge that it describes where I reside along the continuum of users. Perhaps Verbum Now isn't the most realistic option for me to exercise. Thanks for your post, Ted. 

Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.

International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.

Posts 1107
Sean | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 6:08 PM

Ted Weis:
You've summed up myself. That's one reason why I never felt the need to jump onto Logos Now. I'm fully vested in Logos, use it daily, but the enthusiasm wore off sometime ago. I do pray for the company's continued vitality. But I have no interest in a subscription model. I want to own my resources and features, period. As for the bloatware, I agree with what many have said here. I'm busy with my own stuff and don't care about the superfluous stuff. I just want well tagged resources and more available books.

+1. I never wanted to go subscription either but felt kind of forced to as it was absolutely the only way I could get the systematic theology tool. (I'm a systematic theologian. I was excited that they finally came out with something for me. I wanted this tool.) At first it grated a little to be forced to subscribe to get what I wanted, but I came to enjoy other aspects and benefits of Now. Disappointment comes from some of those benefits being taken away (not every perk of Now has carried over, not even at the higher tiers), the abruptness of it, and the outrageous* rate of the hike.

At this point I'm trying to think of it simply as a return to the status quo ante--I only buy, I don't rent. I'm less enthusiastic about Logos, pay less attention to its news and development, and consequently spend a lot less.

*Those of you who don't think it's outrageous--name one other service or product that could be hiked 140% overnight that the average person wouldn't consider outrageous.

Posts 6411
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 7:52 PM

FL TV sucks and it’s totally worthless, IMHO. I wouldn’t even take it for free. Mobile Ed I only buy what I need and if it’s cheap. I barely use what little I have anyway. And Logos 8 features with Logos Now were supposed to roll out ever 6 weeks if I’m not mistaken, but it never happened that way either.

So it’s only buy what I need from now on. Sorry Logos, you did this to yourself. Too many greedy projects and spending money FL really didn’t have is my guess of the why these things are happening.

No wonder Accordance is offering a deep discount for those who want to switch. Rumors are spreading and I really don’t want to know about them.

DAL

Posts 128
Andrew116 | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:13 PM

Lol at the title of this article on a competitor's website - DAL's post led me there.

[redacted]

It’s a brilliant piece of writing really. Perfectly picks up all the things that frustrate Logos users. 

Things we have been saying here on the forums for years without anyone listening. 

Posts 1107
Sean | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:27 PM

Although I've been rather pointed in my criticism of FaithLife over the years, I've always thought it indecorous to bring up their competitors on their own forum.

It's still not something I would do, but since 22 Feb. 2018, I'm rather more indifferent to the practice.

Posts 1426
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:41 PM

Andrew116:

Lol at the title of this article

......

It’s a brilliant piece of writing really. Perfectly picks up all the things that frustrate Logos users. 

Things we have been saying here on the forums for years without anyone listening. 

Andrew, it is not ethical during hard time which Faithlife goes through, to come here and push competitor. It’s against the guidelines, ethics, and Christian morals. You should really be ashamed of yourself. 

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 6411
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:43 PM

Andrew116:

Lol at the title of this article

https://www.accordancebible.com/Accordance-Lifeboat

It’s a brilliant piece of writing really. Perfectly picks up all the things that frustrate Logos users. 

Things we have been saying here on the forums for years without anyone listening. 

The rumors are growing and trust me, the life boat is no coincidence nor everything mentioned in the article. I literally make my coffee and have my toast before I can actually start doing something. It doesn’t happen all the time, but it’s happened one too many times, unfortunately!

DAL

Posts 6411
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:56 PM

Wild Eagle:

Andrew116:

Lol at the title of this article

......

It’s a brilliant piece of writing really. Perfectly picks up all the things that frustrate Logos users. 

Things we have been saying here on the forums for years without anyone listening. 

Andrew, it is not ethical during hard time which Faithlife goes through, to come here and push competitor. It’s against the guidelines, ethics, and Christian morals. You should really be ashamed of yourself. 

Wild Eagle, unfortunately, you’re the one who’s being unethical by admitting to something not even Faithlife has admitted! You’re saying FL is going through hard time and that’s gossip right there pal. Bob himself has stated in the past that FL is doing well and that there’s no need to worry about FL going bankrupt or selling. So unless you know something we don’t know, then I suggest you stop spreading the gossip that FL is indeed going through hard time, because according to Bob they are not.

I’ve heard rumors, but you don’t see me spreading any specific ones, because they’re just rumors.

DAL

Posts 10178
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 8:57 PM

I think, if I could start over, I‘d do what I did.  Even Molassas4 on a netbook, believe it or not.

Faithlife frustrates me, but I’d bet it’s cultural. I remember them saying you had to run with the big dogs. Arf, arf!

I was called a jackass for criticizing unfair use of the forum. Everyone knows it should have been a jenny.


Posts 1426
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:06 PM

Dal, if you miss understood me, then maybe it’s wiser to clarify instead of just bashing it out. To say “hard time” I didn’t mean financially. Looking at these forum posts and see so many users complaining, of course is not an easy time for Faithlife. So stop gossiping yourself and defend the ones who are promoting here other competitors. I don’t see logos users going there and advertising logos like accordance users 

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 6411
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:07 PM

Denise:

I think, if I could start over, I‘d do what I did.  Even Molassas4 on a netbook, believe it or not.

Faithlife frustrates me, but I’d bet it’s cultural. I remember them saying you had to run with the big dogs. Arf, arf!

I was called a jackass for criticizing unfair use of the forum. Everyone knows it should have been a jenny.

Sad to admit this, but if I could start over I’d keep e-sword and WS and get my money back. But...learn and live!

DAL

Posts 128
Andrew116 | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:08 PM

I have 95% of my $$ invested in Logos and do 95% of my work there too. I have every interest in seeing it succeed, in fact that is why I started this thread. You will notice that in the first post of this thread I did not even name the competitor. Another commenter told me it was ok to.

But I'm not pushing the competitor, in fact last week I wrote a blog for the younger students at my Bible college that convinced a large proportion to buy Logos instead of Accordance.

In this thread and in sharing that link, my only goal is to (hopefully) help FL see what is required to continue to push Logos forwards. I believe Logos is the best in the business and I want to see it succeed. But if they are in trouble, which no one except you is saying, it is 100% of their own making and facing up to the facts about how they got here and what is required to turn it around can only be a good thing. 

Posts 1426
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:20 PM

Andrew116:

But I'm not pushing the competitor, 

Andrew, actions speak louder than the words. You posted a link to a competitor where it gives discounts to the ones who switch the programs and saying that you are not pushing? 🤔

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 128
Andrew116 | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:24 PM

Yes, that's what I'm saying. Where is the blog post you have written and shared with college students promoting Logos? 

Posts 1426
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:26 PM

Andrew, Your first post was indeed constructive criticism, where you gave good points which Faithlife should consider. But, you crossed the line when you gave the link of promotion 

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 128
Andrew116 | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Feb 25 2018 9:28 PM

I have edited the post. But FL employees would do well to read the recent blogs of competitors and try to identify why it is that they market themselves that way vis a vis Logos. They are picking up on real things which, if attention were given to them, would make a difference. They are things people have been saying on the forums for a long time now too. 

Page 2 of 4 (75 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 Next > | RSS