Question for a Faithlife Employee about Tradition Base Packages

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This post has 28 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 155
Nick Highland | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Mar 1 2018 6:11 PM

I'm curious if you can disclose which tradition's base packages sell the best (including Verbum).

My observation has been that the March Madness votes tend to favor Reformed theologians (and now commentaries, presumably).  I would also presume that Faithlife's largest market is from Reformed traditions - so I'm curious to see if that assumption is correct.

Posts 5215
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 1 2018 6:58 PM

This is going to be by a likely slight bias towards reformed resources since As I understand it Bob and many FL employees are of the Reformed tradition. That is not to say they do not do good work with other traditions just that there is at least the slightest bias. One would guess for example that they pushed into their faith community to show the value of Logos software. Possibly given at least a slight edge to numbers of user from that tradition.  One would also suspect that Reform products would be important for Bob to want to get for personal reasons And the possible larger reform base would mean they have a better chance of them making it into production. I do half way suspect the largest group is Evangelicals but I am curious about the numbers too. 

-dan 

Posts 33
Joseph Sollenberger | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 1 2018 7:11 PM

I don't expect Anabaptist or Pietistic traditions will have a high representation, though I did see a few titles from those two traditions in the March Madness choices. ;-)

—Joe

Joseph F. Sollenberger, Jr.

Posts 1042
Sean | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 1 2018 7:29 PM

Nick:
My observation has been that the March Madness votes tend to favor Reformed theologians (and now commentaries, presumably).  I would also presume that Faithlife's largest market is from Reformed traditions - so I'm curious to see if that assumption is correct.

One thing you have to keep in mind is that the reformed tradition is very prolific in writing, especially academic writing. Any large enough collection of protestant scholarship is going to lean in that direction. I'm a systematic theologian but not reformed. I'd estimate, though, that >80% of my theology collection is reformed simply because they write the most books (and often very good ones, too).

 Logos Now Subscriber -- 22/2/2018

Posts 943
Everett Headley | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 1 2018 7:32 PM

Sean:

One thing you have to keep in mind is that the reformed tradition is very prolific in writing, especially academic writing. Any large enough collection of protestant scholarship is going to lean in that direction. I'm a systematic theologian but not reformed. I'd estimate, though, that >80% of my theology collection is reformed simply because they write the most books (and often very good ones, too).

This is what I would say, I would hazard a guess that 2/3 of the writings of the past 200 years are of that tradition or close to it.

As Reformed myself, I noticed long ago how Logos leaned that way.

Posts 155
Nick Highland | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 1 2018 8:44 PM

I suspect that the largest American market would be Reformed anyway.  I am a Wesleyan, and I find that among laity in many Wesleyan congregations, Reformed ideas and theologies are very prevalent.  The SBC and their stores and publishing are also very influential culturally.  Most radio stations lean toward Reformed theologies.  American Christianity, by my observation, leans toward Reformed theologies.

In those observations - which may well be wrong - I don't intend to express an opinion (and I don't have a negative one anyway).  I don't want to be misread as somehow being negative.

Posts 3937
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 10:56 AM

Nick:

I suspect that the largest American market would be Reformed anyway.  I am a Wesleyan, and I find that among laity in many Wesleyan congregations, Reformed ideas and theologies are very prevalent.  The SBC and their stores and publishing are also very influential culturally.  Most radio stations lean toward Reformed theologies.  American Christianity, by my observation, leans toward Reformed theologies.

In those observations - which may well be wrong - I don't intend to express an opinion (and I don't have a negative one anyway).  I don't want to be misread as somehow being negative.



Increasingly so in the last few years. It seems to have come (more?) into vogue.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 1:06 PM

Nick:
I'm curious if you can disclose which tradition's base packages sell the best (including Verbum).

User observation is Logos.com can sort Base Packages by Bestselling => https://www.logos.com/products/search?Status=Live&pageSize=60&Product+Type=Base+Packages (Logos 7 Gold is # 1 Best Seller, but not know time criteria for Bestselling)

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 986
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 1:06 PM

Everett Headley:

This is what I would say, I would hazard a guess that 2/3 of the writings of the past 200 years are of that tradition or close to it.

I suspect that may be part of the DNA of the Reformed tradition.  Different traditions stress different things - which is perhaps not surprising, since none of us are able to perfectly reflect the fullness of God.  But to be crass about it, I grew up in a fellowship that has a tendency to seek salvation not by works, but by doctrinal correctness.  Don't get me wrong - I don't intend to minimize the importance of good doctrine.  But if that's your mindset, it's going to affect what you think about and write about.  My impression is that the Reformed tradition has a "tradition" of emphasizing theology.

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 1:54 PM

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :):
User observation is Logos.com can sort Base Packages by Bestselling

Well, that can't be right. P&C Gold is the top selling tradition after Standard packages and that's without the Fire Bible. Wink (At least that's what  shows when I click the link.)

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 2:11 PM

Nick:
I'm curious if you can disclose which tradition's base packages sell the best (including Verbum).

That information isn't secret. My guess at an approximate 'league table' would be:

  1. Standard
  2. Reformed
  3. Pentecostal & Charismatic
  4. Methodist & Wesleyan
  5. Baptist
  6. SDA
  7. Verbum
  8. Orthodox
  9. Lutheran
  10. Anglican
Posts 13015
Forum MVP
Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 2:14 PM

Matthew Cillo:
P&C Gold is the top selling tradition after Standard packages

That's mostly because P&C only goes up to Gold. To do a fair comparison, you'd have to add in the Platinum and Portfolio sales from the other traditions.

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 3:20 PM

Mark Barnes:
That's mostly because P&C only goes up to Gold. To do a fair comparison, you'd have to add in the Platinum and Portfolio sales from the other traditions.

I know, which is why I added Gold and didn't just say that P&C was the best selling tradition, which looking back looks like I implied. It looks like I forgot to add the word "package." It was a tongue-in-cheek comment about what most P&Cers have been waiting for and I couldn't resist.

I think your line up for tradition totals is probably accurate, which is surprising. I honestly didn't expect P&C to be ranked so high.

Posts 5215
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 4:43 PM

Oh my didn't know anglican was bottom of the barrel.... Hope I am not the only one who bought Anglican Portfolio.

-dan

Posts 2751
Erwin Stull, Sr. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 5:22 PM

Mark Barnes:

Matthew Cillo:
P&C Gold is the top selling tradition after Standard packages

That's mostly because P&C only goes up to Gold. To do a fair comparison, you'd have to add in the Platinum and Portfolio sales from the other traditions.

Side note/reply off topic. - Hi Mark, your "Buyers Guide" and instructional videos were really nice, I hope that you update both. Smile

Posts 2863
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 5:34 PM

Matthew Cillo:
I think your line up for tradition totals is probably accurate, which is surprising. I honestly didn't expect P&C to be ranked so high.

I would actually guess that P&C and Methodist/Wesleyan may be lower than Mark thinks because they have fewer offerings for customers to choose between.

Posts 155
Nick Highland | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 6:19 PM

Dan Francis:

Oh my didn't know anglican was bottom of the barrel.... Hope I am not the only one who bought Anglican Portfolio.

-dan

I haven't invested that much (yet?) but I have Anglican Bronze and Methodist/Wesleyan Gold.  Maybe I'll work my way up there eventually :)

Posts 221
Gary Osborne | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 7:16 PM

abondservant:

Nick:

I suspect that the largest American market would be Reformed anyway.  I am a Wesleyan, and I find that among laity in many Wesleyan congregations, Reformed ideas and theologies are very prevalent.  The SBC and their stores and publishing are also very influential culturally.  Most radio stations lean toward Reformed theologies.  American Christianity, by my observation, leans toward Reformed theologies.

In those observations - which may well be wrong - I don't intend to express an opinion (and I don't have a negative one anyway).  I don't want to be misread as somehow being negative.



Increasingly so in the last few years. It seems to have come (more?) into vogue.

The uptick and big "push" (for lack of a better word) of Reformed Theology in America began about 20 years ago.  It was very noticeable to me (as a non-Reformed minister) back then, and the trending of Logos has been noticeable as well in recent years.

Posts 3937
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 7:29 PM

Gosh I guess it has been twenty years.

When I started bible college (2000) there were only one or two very vocal reformed guys, by graduation most in my circles were macarthurian leaky dispensationalists, with piper as a heavy influence.

Started seminary in 2012, by then, everyone seemed to be covenant/reformed.

I made the switch (was amyraldian at the start, went to a CMA bible college) on a missions trip. Spent a good part of 2002 working with a reformed pastor/church planter in Michagin. took him and his bible a good six months, but I finally became convinced.

L2 lvl4, L3 Scholars, L4 Scholars, L5 Platinum,  L6 Collectors. L7 Baptist Portfolio. L8 Baptist Platinum.

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 8:05 PM

SineNomine:
I would actually guess that P&C and Methodist/Wesleyan may be lower than Mark thinks because they have fewer offerings for customers to choose between.

Maybe 1 or 2, but I think they are probably pretty close to that. Even though they have less products, they are much higher in the charts than others like SDA that have similar offerings. That P&C Gold and P&C Bronze seem to be outselling all the individual Reformed packages would indicate a fairly large number are interested in those sets. M/W should probably be lower than Baptist, though. It would be interesting to see the tradition spread of the Logos users and it is encouraging to see so many traditions gathered around Bible software. 

I'm new here, as I'm sure you can tell. But if I recall from the P&C boards, their packages are relatively new compared to the others, so I imagine they got a little boost from that. (Having no idea how far back the bestseller list tracks... and I'm sure what people already owned affected what Logos 7 base package(s) they bought.)

In the end, this all speculation based off a bestseller list that aggregates from unknown data points.

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