Don't know Latin? It's time you learned. Here are six reasons why.

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This post has 39 Replies | 2 Followers

Posts 771
Bill Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 1:01 PM

That's my MDiv. diploma from Westminster Theological Seminary in CA. 

Posts 1241
HJ. van der Wal | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 1:40 PM

David Staveley:

Not to rain on your parade but as of today, a standard requirement for all doctoral students of biblical studies is a mastery of the following languages: Biblical Hebrew, Koine Greek, for obvious reasons; and German and French, because all of the major secondary literature is in either German or French (particularly true for the study of the DSS where French is the primary language used to discuss scrolls research). I personally found no need to learn Latin, and it certainly wasn't ever required of me.

Having said that, a generation ago, they also required doctoral students of biblical studies to also have a mastery of Latin. This was because most of the classic commentaries (e.g. Bengel, Meyer, Alford, etc) were either written entirely in Latin, or they quoted Latin authors extensively with no complementary English translation parallel to the quotes. But as I said, because the world has moved on, this is no longer a requirement. Almost no one nowadays quotes authors in Latin.

All in all, I would say if you want to study Patristics seriously, or want to seriously study one of the deuterocanonical or pseudepigraphic books which have been preserved primary in Latin (e.g. 5-6 Ezra or the Latin Vision of Ezra), then Latin is obviously a must-have. Other than that, I really don't see the point of learning it. The time spent learning Latin could be better spent learning other more useful things, such as for example, Aramaic, or Ethiopic (or to give it its correct name: Ge'er, as the most important deuterocanonical or pseudepigraphic books such as 1 Enoch or Jubilees have been principally preserved in Ethiopic).

Less than 15 years ago Latin and Greek were required subjects at secondary school if you wanted to go to university and study theology in the Netherlands. In my experience Latin was helpful (although not really necessary) during the classes on reformed theology.  

Posts 781
scooter | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 3:09 PM

Bill Anderson:

That's my MDiv. diploma from Westminster Theological Seminary in CA. 

Excellent!  And thank you, Bill.

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 10:08 PM

You’ve all missed the point of the post, it’s about getting you to sign up for the Oxford Latin Dictionary. The discussion about why you should learn Latin is just the pretext. Unfortunately I think it’s the wrong pretext to try and sell an academic dictionary on Latin. If it was a latin learning grammar along with supporting material which FL was trying to sell then the pretext presented would have more relevance IMHO. But enjoyed the article and banter here on forum all the same so thanks for the article.

I’d prefer not to have the pop-ups but I just dismiss them and move on, there are much more significant things in life that pop-up out of nowhere to be concerned about than a website pop-up, but that’s me.

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 10:11 PM

Yes

scooter:

Bill Anderson:

That's my MDiv. diploma from Westminster Theological Seminary in CA. 

Excellent!  And thank you, Bill.

Posts 89
David Staveley | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 28 2018 10:42 PM

Disciple of Christ (doc):

I’d prefer not to have the pop-ups but I just dismiss them and move on, there are much more significant things in life that pop-up out of nowhere to be concerned about than a website pop-up, but that’s me.

I got so sick of ads in my life (on TV, on the internet, on Youtube) that 3 years ago I decided enough was enough and so I went Ad-free in my life. I gave up watching live TV and now only stream Netflix and Amazon Prime. That got rid of the Ads on TV. I then installed an ad-blocker, and when the anti-adblocker web scripts started appearing, trying to force you to turn off your ad-blocker, I installed a good Anti-adblocker Killer (tempermonkey) to stop those measures dead in the water. That got rid of the Ads on websites. And I am so glad I did all this! I was not aware of it until it was all over, that my hatred for Ads was making me physically ill. I was really stressed out about them. Once I went ad-free, I discovered a relatively stress free life, and I now feel emotionally and spiritually more relaxed and happy. I would encourage others to do the same if the Ads drive them potty like they used to do to me. 

Having said that, I am acutely aware that the vast majority of people do not share my rabid hatred of Ads. Most people take them in their stride, but for me it became a real bugbear. I don't know what that says about me, but there it is. It could be because I am a bit of a control freak, and having Ads invade my life as they do, I became aware of how powerless I was over them. Now, however, I control everything I watch. I watch what I like, when I like. No more being made a hostage to TV scheduling in order to follow my favourite programs. And, of course, no more pesky Ads to invade my viewing space every 5 minutes. 

Dr David Staveley Professor of New Testament. Specializing in the Pauline Epistles, Apocalyptic Judaism, and the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Posts 877
Paul Caneparo | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 5:57 AM

Do ad blockers stop you seeing free book offers such as the ones on

https://blog.lexhampress.com

Posts 89
David Staveley | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 7:27 AM

Paul Caneparo:

Do ad blockers stop you seeing free book offers such as the ones on

https://blog.lexhampress.com

Nope. Ads are coded differently than to things like free book offers.And its the type of code that Ads use that ad-blockers detect and "hide" from your view.

Dr David Staveley Professor of New Testament. Specializing in the Pauline Epistles, Apocalyptic Judaism, and the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Posts 394
Jordan Litchfield | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 9:31 AM

Disciple of Christ (doc):
You’ve all missed the point of the post, it’s about getting you to sign up for the Oxford Latin Dictionary. The discussion about why you should learn Latin is just the pretext. Unfortunately I think it’s the wrong pretext to try and sell an academic dictionary on Latin. If it was a latin learning grammar along with supporting material which FL was trying to sell then the pretext presented would have more relevance IMHO.

Maybe we are forgetting the that blog is entitled: The Logos Academic Blog (emphasis on the academic). So of course Tavis and FL are going to be pushing more heavy-weight products.

Posts 10037
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 10:47 AM

Disciple of Christ (doc):

You’ve all missed the point of the post, it’s about getting you to sign up for the Oxford Latin Dictionary. The discussion about why you should learn Latin is just the pretext. 

Well, no offense, doc, but are you serious? As I understand the book business, and Logos in particular, the Oxford volume would have high royalties, and low demand. Tavis' selection merits him an 'F' on profit making. I'd bet Marketing folks were not happy campers. Maybe the old ICC volumes, but even they aren't likely big volume drivers.

The other curiousity (this thread) is (1) the studied indifference to Catholic customers, and (2) the studied avoidance of protestant recognition of the latin fathers, from whense protestant creedal foundations arrived.


Posts 1005
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 10:55 AM

Actually, I thought it was a pretty good pitch.  I have a full-time (non-academic) job and I'm struggling to keep my Greek and Hebrew skills alive, so it's likely a bridge too far for me.  But it did make me wish I had the time and opportunity to "pick up" Latin.

Posts 188
Matt Hamrick | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 12:28 PM

Awesome, I have learning Latin on my long term to do list. Not worried about learning it today, but down the road I will take it up.

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 4:11 PM

Jordan Litchfield:

Disciple of Christ (doc):
You’ve all missed the point of the post, it’s about getting you to sign up for the Oxford Latin Dictionary. The discussion about why you should learn Latin is just the pretext. Unfortunately I think it’s the wrong pretext to try and sell an academic dictionary on Latin. If it was a latin learning grammar along with supporting material which FL was trying to sell then the pretext presented would have more relevance IMHO.

Maybe we are forgetting the that blog is entitled: The Logos Academic Blog (emphasis on the academic). So of course Tavis and FL are going to be pushing more heavy-weight products.

Not forgotten at all Jordan. I had no concern with the product being advertised, I just think the article did not match up with the fact it’s a heavy-weight product. All I’m saying is If you are going to sell a heavy-weight product use a hook that is relative to the audience that is most likely to purchase said product.

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 4:38 PM

No offence taken Denise, but I am serious. It you go fishing you have to use the right hook. Fishing is not always about the size of the catch, and when it comes to the book family of fish profits are pretty low in general according to Captain Pritchett of the good ship Logos. In this case fisherman Travis is doing the right thing by his fishing partners at Oxford in promoting this particular fish. I just think on this occasion the hook chosen is not the right one. Fact is even when it comes to seasoned fisherman on the odd Occassion they can use the wrong hook.

The other curiosities you raise are well worth raising. 

Denise:

Disciple of Christ (doc):

You’ve all missed the point of the post, it’s about getting you to sign up for the Oxford Latin Dictionary. The discussion about why you should learn Latin is just the pretext. 

Well, no offense, doc, but are you serious? As I understand the book business, and Logos in particular, the Oxford volume would have high royalties, and low demand. Tavis' selection merits him an 'F' on profit making. I'd bet Marketing folks were not happy campers. Maybe the old ICC volumes, but even they aren't likely big volume drivers.

The other curiousity (this thread) is (1) the studied indifference to Catholic customers, and (2) the studied avoidance of protestant recognition of the latin fathers, from whense protestant creedal foundations arrived.

Posts 924
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 4:51 PM

Good article and comments at the bottom.

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 4:55 PM

EastTN:

Actually, I thought it was a pretty good pitch.  I have a full-time (non-academic) job and I'm struggling to keep my Greek and Hebrew skills alive, so it's likely a bridge too far for me.  But it did make me wish I had the time and opportunity to "pick up" Latin.

i had no concern about the quality of the pitch, I just think if you want to sell a heavy-weight academic dictionary write for the audience that is likely to buy that product. Someone with little or no Latin is more likely to purchase a learners Latin Grammer.

Posts 781
scooter | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 5:02 PM

Disciple of Christ (doc):
i had no concern about the quality of the pitch, I just think if you want to sell a heavy-weight academic dictionary write for the audience that is likely to buy that product. Someone with little or no Latin is more likely to purchase a learners Latin Grammer.

I saw this product + its price + gulped.  I fall into doc's ''little or no'' category, + have a few E-Z Latin dictionaries, = enough.

Posts 924
Deacon Steve | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 5:13 PM

Bruce Dunning:

By the way, this is the resource I'm using to learn Latin. What are others using?

I use these to help me with the Latin resources I have in my Library.  I really need some classroom work to help with the process.  

https://www.logos.com/product/3504/collins-latin-dictionary-and-grammar

https://www.logos.com/product/15716/dictionary-of-latin-forms

https://www.logos.com/product/29161/liturgical-press-reference-collection#003

https://www.logos.com/product/16014/lewis-and-shorts-latin-dictionary

Posts 4877
DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 29 2018 5:30 PM

Udemy and Great Courses (only purchase when on sale)  offer some classroom type options. mEd via community pricing would be nice if it could get off the ground.

Steve:

Bruce Dunning:

By the way, this is the resource I'm using to learn Latin. What are others using?

I use these to help me with the Latin resources I have in my Library.  I really need some classroom work to help with the process.  

https://www.logos.com/product/3504/collins-latin-dictionary-and-grammar

https://www.logos.com/product/15716/dictionary-of-latin-forms

https://www.logos.com/product/29161/liturgical-press-reference-collection#003

https://www.logos.com/product/16014/lewis-and-shorts-latin-dictionary

Yes

Posts 3007
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 30 2018 7:04 PM

Denise:
The other curiousity (this thread) is (1) the studied indifference to Catholic customers, and (2) the studied avoidance of protestant recognition of the latin fathers, from whense protestant creedal foundations arrived.

Indeed.

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