8.3 B1: Test on Hidden Resources

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Feb 4 2019 12:33 AM

I had earlier removed two permanent Anglican resources ---> "Not on This device"

Test 1:

Auto Download New = No

Auto Download Updates = No

  1. Unhide Armana Letters
  2. Treated as "Not on This device"
  3. No notifications

Comment: I expected it to be downloaded and indexed as per current practice.

Test 2:

Auto Download New = No

Auto Download Updates = Yes

  1. Armana Letters is finally downloaded and indexed
  2. Get "Updated" notice and then hide it
  3. The Anglican resources remain "Not on This device". Why?

Comment: Why are the Anglican resources treated differently to the unhidden resource?

Test 3:

Auto Download New = Yes ---> not expecting anything from this

Auto Download Updates = Yes

  1. The Anglican resources are not affected (as Test 2. above)
  2. Unhide a lexicon
  3. Lexicon is downloaded and indexed
  4. Get "Updated" notice for it + Armana Letters

Comment: "Updated" notices for a resource re-appear after being hidden.

Re-hiding the two resources works as expected, but Library count takes some time to decrease after the Catalog update message disappears.

6116.Logos (2).zip

Dave
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Adam Borries (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 5 2019 8:56 AM

Dave, I think this is all working as expected. 

Here's some more background that might help inform your underlying assumptions: 

  1. Resources that were hidden pre-8.3 will be treated as "cloud" when unhidden. (Rationale: It's more likely for a user to change their mind about hiding a resource based on space constraints than if they hid it based on content.)
  2. Resources that are hidden in 8.3+ will remember and respect the preference for cloud/local for the current machine.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 5 2019 12:24 PM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Dave, I think this is all working as expected. 

Could you explain the rationale for the Test 2 results with the "removed" resources, and the repeated "Updated" notice from Test 3.

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Resources that are hidden in 8.3+ will remember and respect the preference for cloud/local for the current machine.

How do you determine the preference for "cloud" e.g. when I remove a couple of resources?

Adam Borries (Faithlife):
Resources that were hidden pre-8.3 will be treated as "cloud" when unhidden

The hidden resource in Test 3 was not treated as "cloud"?

Dave
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Adam Borries (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 5 2019 4:07 PM

 

Dave Hooton:
How do you determine the preference for "cloud" e.g. when I remove a couple of resources?

Just for clarity's sake, I want to define terms.

A resource can be marked as: 

  • either downloaded or removed/cloud (affects this device)
  • either hidden or unhidden (across your account)

Changing one of these preferences does not affect the other. That is, marking a resource as Removed (aka, making it a "Cloud" resource) is independent of marking it as Hidden.

Dave Hooton:
Could you explain the rationale for the Test 2 results

You had "removed" Anglican resources, then hid them. When you unhid them, they where still removed/not on this device, since you explicitly marked them so. 

Dave Hooton:
The hidden resource in Test 3 was not treated as "cloud"?

 

Test 3:

...

2. Unhide a lexicon

3. Lexicon is downloaded and indexed

Your steps didn't specify when you hid this lexicon. My guess is that this was a local resource in 8.3 when it was hidden, and therefore was re-instated as local when it was unhidden. If it was hidden pre-8.3, this is unexpected, as per my previous post. 

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 6 2019 2:30 AM

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

Dave Hooton:
Could you explain the rationale for the Test 2 results

You had "removed" Anglican resources, then hid them. When you unhid them, they where still removed/not on this device, since you explicitly marked them so. 

The 2x Anglican resources were never "hidden", just "removed". The Amarna Letters was hidden pre-8.3.

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

 

Test 3:

...

2. Unhide a lexicon

3. Lexicon is downloaded and indexed

Your steps didn't specify when you hid this lexicon. My guess is that this was a local resource in 8.3 when it was hidden, and therefore was re-instated as local when it was unhidden. If it was hidden pre-8.3, this is unexpected, as per my previous post. 

The lexicon was hidden pre 8.3.

Adam Borries (Faithlife):

Just for clarity's sake, I want to define terms.

A resource can be marked as: 

  • either downloaded or removed/cloud (affects this device)
  • either hidden or unhidden (across your account)

Changing one of these preferences does not affect the other. That is, marking a resource as Removed (aka, making it a "Cloud" resource) is independent of marking it as Hidden.

You should document the whole "Cloud" process for clarity, and make specific recommendations for setting the Auto Download options. It is not straightforward any longer.

Dave
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I suspect that we are finding your descriptions confusing because you have some assumptions about how things work that don't match ours. Let me see if I can clarify some things and hopefully help us determine whether or not you are encountering any actual bugs.

There are two auto-download settings now.

The setting for new resources indicates what should happen when a new resource is added to your account (whether from a temporary license or a permanent purchase). Depending on your setting, the resource will either be marked as a Local resource, and will automatically download, or will be marked as a Cloud resource, and will not be downloaded.

The setting for updating resources affects all of your Local resources. If turned on, then any updates to your Local resources will be automatically downloaded and applied. If turned off, then when updates are available to your local resources, you will get a notification prompting you to download the updates.

Changes to the either of the auto-download settings will not cause any of your existing resources to change from a Local resource to a Cloud resource (or from a Cloud resource to a Local resource). Although turning on the auto-download of updates can start downloading any pending updates that you had to resources that are already Local.

When you "Remove" a resource, this transitions it from a Local resource to a Cloud resource. It will be displayed in your library, but can not be opened or used by most of the rest of the application. The only way this resource can change back to a Local resource is if you explicitly "Download" it in your library (or from the resource preview page if you attempt to open it).

When you "Download" a resource, this transitions it from a Cloud resource to a Local resource. It will be indexed, and can be used by the rest of the application. The only way it can change back to a Cloud resources is to explicitly "Remove" it in the library.

Hidden resources should never be displayed in the library, and should generally be treated in the application as if you did not own the resource. If you hide a Local resource, then when you unhide it, it will still be considered a Local resource, and will be downloaded again. If you hide a Cloud resource, then when you unhide it, it will still be considered a Cloud resource, but will show up in your library.

Hopefully that explanation makes sense. If not, please ask questions so Adam or I can clarify. If it does make sense, can you reevaluate what you've reported and see if there is an area where things are not matching up with the expectations explained here?

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 6 2019 1:58 PM

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):
I suspect that we are finding your descriptions confusing because you have some assumptions about how things work that don't match ours.

If I have assumptions, they are reflected by the composition of the test and my comments/queries that follow.

If I had hidden a resource for the test (i.e. in 8.3), I would have stated that. So if a resource was un-hidden, it was already hidden (pre-8.3), and the Anglican resources were local ones that I removed. When I re-hid two resources after Test 3, they were the ones that had been un-hidden in Test 1 and Test 3 (I could have been more explicit, but didn't think it necessary).

From Test 1, it appears that the Amarna Letters were treated correctly based on Adam's earlier statement.

For Test 2, I changed Auto Download Updates from No to YES, to see what might happen:

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):
Changes to the either of the auto-download settings will not cause any of your existing resources to change from a Local resource to a Cloud resource (or from a Cloud resource to a Local resource). Although turning on the auto-download of updates can start downloading any pending updates that you had to resources that are already Local.

Therefore the Amarna Letters should not have been made local, and the Anglican resources were treated correctly.

From Test 3, the lexicon should not have been "downloaded", again from Adam's earlier statement.

Your clarification, and Adam's, are helpful, and I trust that they will be documented for the sake of other users.

Dave
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