Any idea when the prayer list feature will be done?
Would a possible option be to not just have a prayer list, but a prayer journaling option. Although I guess you could do that with notes and not anchor it to a resource.
Just as a privacy option, will prayer lists be synchronized with the Logos server? I would hope not and that this type of personal information would be housed and kept locally. Thoughts?
Robin
@Robin - yes the Prayer List is in the Cloud, you can see a debate in the thread about Cloud computing..
Just as a privacy option, will prayer lists be synchronized with the Logos server? I would hope not and that this type of personal information would be housed and kept locally. Thoughts? Robin
Ok - It not being in the Alpha yet - can somebody explain to me how prayer lists fit in with the concept of L4
To this 'bear of little brain' the idea seems a bit disconnected.
How do our prayer lists link with the resources that Logos is there to drive?
As an aside, your UK brothers would have a problem placing personalised data on any computer let alone one synced to a cloud unless it was pre-encrypted and unavailable to the managers of the cloud.
Tootle pip
Mike
Ok - It not being in the Alpha yet - can somebody explain to me how prayer lists fit in with the concept of L4 To this 'bear of little brain' the idea seems a bit disconnected. How do our prayer lists link with the resources that Logos is there to drive?
They don't. This was a little quickie feature that Logos threw in because they thought it might be useful to people. Now look at all the flak they've been getting about the fact that prayer lists sync to the cloud, and people wanting to be able to control this. Bob said at one point in frustration that they'd rather rip the feature out than implement iron-clad security for it.
Maybe Bob should just offer a little stand alone prayer journal app that has nothing connected at all to Logos 4. (Kinda like the little sticky notes app he wrote.)
Yes, that would be a good idea. Then it doesn't need to mess with syncing to the cloud at all. It would just keep its data locally. I'm sure the sticky notes app doesn't sync between your PC and your iPhone, and yet it is what it is and some people find it useful.
rather rip the feature out than implement iron-clad security for it.
Yes I have seen the mountain of posts that heap up on this subject and (again without experience of the usefulness of this facility) I have no desire to see it implemented.
And if people are really using it to record serious and identifiable personal information they could well be falling foul of the law at least int he UK.
There are better things that the Development team could be concentrating on.
In my (not all that) humble opinion.
tootle pip
Maybe Bob should just offer a little stand alone prayer journal app that has nothing connected at all to Logos 4. (Kinda like the little sticky notes app he wrote.) Yes, that would be a good idea. Then it doesn't need to mess with syncing to the cloud at all. It would just keep its data locally. I'm sure the sticky notes app doesn't sync between your PC and your iPhone, and yet it is what it is and some people find it useful.
Rosie
I agree with you that a little stand-alone journal would be a good answer. However, I wonder if some people would then want it to sync so that they could have their prayer lists on their iPhone/iPad when they were away from their computers. I can just hear the howls of protest, if Bob disconnected it from the main app.
Also, Mike, in the original thread I raised the very point of falling foul of the Data Protection Act in the UK, if we used synced Prayer Lists with personal data in them. Speaking personally, I keep that kind of data in a mobile, rather erratic through secure, data store with rather slow, built-in computing facilities – my head! But I can live with the data loss. [:S]
Every blessing
Alan
Rosie I agree with you that a little stand-alone journal would be a good answer. However, I wonder if some people would then want it to sync so that they could have their prayer lists on their iPhone/iPad when they were away from their computers. I can just hear the howls of protest, if Bob disconnected it from the main app.
Yup, you're right. It's not something I'd use anyway, I was just giving Matthew an encouraging response, but it was his suggestion in the first place, not mine.
I would not use it either. I was just trying to make the anti-cloud users happy. (Probably an impossible task.)
I personally like the idea of having a prayer list in Logos. I don't need another application that I have to run to check my prayer list. As for syncing to the cloud, I personally like the idea. I would love to be able to see my prayer list on my iPone (or iPad when I get one) so that I always have it with me. As for personal information I don't need detailed personal information, just reminders i.e. healing, Janes mother has cancer. I'm not in the UK so I don't know about your laws. As for me it would be a very useful tool. If you have issues with using it and personal information the just don't use it, but don't take it away from thoose of that use/would use it and find it a useful tool.[:P]
Just my two cents
God bless
Stephen
I agree with Stephen. (Although this might only be worth one penny...)[:)]
I don't need another application that I have to run to check my prayer list.
But - and I come back to my main point - why would you naturally 'run to' Logos for a prayer list?
It seems to me like using your pliers to knock nails in - possible but not really appropriate!
why would you naturally 'run to' Logos for a prayer list?
Mike,
I just don't want to have to run another program to do a prayer list if I've already got that functionality in Logos. It would be great it I could put scripture links in my prayer list so that when I'm going through it I can just pull up the scriptures in Logos or hover over them and have the scripture display in a pop-up. I'd rather see it more like a prayer journal and have an ability to like to resources like Prayer that Avail Much or the Scripture Quick Reference Guide for Counseling so when I have a subject I'm praying for I can select a key word like "marriage" or "deliverance" it will give me a list of related scriptures that I can pray for that situation. I know I could already do a search for these scriptures in Logos but many times I get a lot scriptures that aren't relevant. So of the Prayer/scripture reference guides have already done this. It would be nice to have this ability to do it quickly in Logos (sorry I'm still working on memorizing the whole Bible), and to have that on my iPhone so it's always with me is awesome so when I'm sitting on the training I can read my prayer list and prayer for the 30 minute train ride.
I already have a prayer list app on my iPhone but to get it on my computer I have to retype it or email the list to myself which makes it a text file and then I can't edit it and send it back. All I'm asking is that they just make it easy for me and that it work. After all I use a Mac and not windowz [:D]
God Bless
to have that on my iPhone so it's always with me is awesome so when I'm sitting on the training I can read my prayer list and prayer for the 30 minute train ride
You could use something like Things for a prayer list for use on the train. It's designed as a task manager, but is versatile enough for almost any list you need. It syncs between Mac and iPhone (or iPad) ... without troubling 'the cloud' and associated issues regarding data security.
I've thought about using Things before but that's another $60 for the Mac and iPhone version. I have Bento 3 for both and am starting to use it more and that's also a possibility. I'd like to have it in Logos so that I can use the resources/Bible I have. Being able to "tag" a prayer with related scriptures would be great. I don't put personal information beside a persons first name in my prayer list. If we worry about security so much, everything has vulnerabilities, even a paper based journal/planner can get lost. The only way we can make sure nothing get lost or compromised is to not record it anywhere besides our memory and that defeats the whole purpose of writing stuff down so we don't forget it[:D]
It boils down to the fact that I don't want another application for prayer lists. While there are alternatives I want it in Logos and would use it extensively if it were in the Mac version.
It's a personal choice and mine is to have a prayer list or journal in Logos.
I use Omnifocus for my prayer list and other tasks, preferring it over Things because of the limitations in Things synchronization. I've played with the Logos prayer list but it's a little more limited than what I want, and I don't really want to fire up Logos to look at my prayer requests.
I would agree, there are lots of other prayer list tools. I want notes avail via cloud w/inductive icons.
back to my main point - why would you naturally 'run to' Logos for a prayer list? It seems to me like using your pliers to knock nails in - possible but not really appropriate!
back to my main point - why would you naturally 'run to' Logos for a prayer list?
LOL!
Mike - I disagree with you, but you are hilarious! I know this is an old thread, but I was searching the forums for info on the prayer list and ran across this one.
First, let me stress that I have read enough of Bob's posts to know that he doesn't want Logos to become a word processor. However, that doesn't mean it is a bad idea. Logos is designed to study the Bible, but who studies the Bible in a bubble? People use Logos to study the Bible... so that they can 1) write a sermon 2) write a paper 3) prepare a lecture and yes, 4) to grow spiritually. Keeping track of prayers, writing journal entries, and working on research projects are all a natural outflow of using Logos... so why not have that functionality within the program?
I know that Logos is working on some of these features (i.e. PBB), but I hope Bob's view will continue move in this direction.
tootle pip [:D]
I know this is an old thread,
It may be old - and I have changed my mind about some of the things that I thought were superfluous when I started using the program but the prayer list is not one of them.
so why not have that functionality within the program?
But why - the Mac OS gives us the chance to open a separate utility just by clicking on an icon in the tray below - what is the difference between that and clicking on an icon in the program.
I guess there is a reason that Bob doesn't go to the 'Evernote' people and say - get these note takers off my back - I'll give you some hooks into the program please will you bring out a Bible enhanced version.
I am almost sure that a standalone prayer list with some hooks into Logos would be much better as a dedicated utility than it will be cluttering up the code of a research tool.
But then again I am often wrong - so this time is probably no exception.
"But why?" because I don't want to have another app that I have to use to track things with. I use the Logos app on my iPad and iPhone and would like to have my prayer lists with me. Some don't want to sync to the cloud because of privacy concerns but I don't get specific enough for that to be an issue. I don't want to use another separate app. i already have my reading plans and hopefully soon notes. Yes I can use another program like omnifocus (which I use for work) or MacJournal (which I use for taking sermon/Bible study notes and journaling). I don't want to keep having to use separate apps for everything. I am not a theologian but Logos does help me grown in my walk by enabling me to better study the scriptures. I also use it for a lot of reading as I have a fairly good size resource library. Iw ant to be able to go to Logos for this as my life is already busy enough and I don't want to use a task management or note taking app for my prayer lists. I know there are prayer list apps available but Logos would allow me to keep it synced between all my devices and be in software that I already use. Many of us that use Logos are not in full time ministry but Logos does help us in our walk, so why shouldn't Logos be my go to place for all these things?[;)]
"But why?" because I don't want to have another app that I have to use to track things with.
Many of us that use Logos are not in full time ministry but Logos does help us in our walk, so why shouldn't Logos be my go to place for all these things?
So just explain to me what the big difference is between tapping the Logos screen and selecting Prayer List and tapping the home button and selecting Logos Prayer App.
In the 80's the move was towards ubiquitous all singing and all dancing suites of programs because that was the only way that the various elements had of communicating with each other. Modern devices make it much easier for elements to 'talk to each other'. Shoehorning a Prayer List specific operating environment into the Logos program seems silly to me.
If your reason for not wanting another app, is cultural, emotional or just preferential then that is fine but it seems to me that it is not logical.
explain to me what the big difference is between tapping the Logos screen and selecting Prayer List and tapping the home button and selecting Logos Prayer App.
Believe it or not Mike, but some people like to have apps that check email AND keep addresses. As for "shoehorning," I wish apple would get over the ridiculous idea that calendar, email, & contacts should be three separate apps!
The difference is that I want my prayer guide right beside my bible.
Modern devices make it much easier for elements to 'talk to each other'.
If I could have a separate app which could "talk to logos," I would be happy. This will never be the case, however.
Shoehorning a Prayer List specific operating environment into the Logos program seems silly to me.
What about notes? People can just open up another app if they want to! Is that shoehorning? Does prayer AND devotional reading together really sound silly to you? I can't believe that you think that. If I understand where you are coming from, you think having the two in the same app is "silly." My point is, that it is not "silly" to want to have a good app for devotional reading and prayer. In my mind, the logical choice is the app I am paying hundreds (or thousands) of dollars to buy resources for.
By the way, do you know of ANY good prayer app? If so, please share!
Mike -
I created a "suggestion" with a screen shot of two ways it could be improved.
I guess this shows that we have two different ways of looking at things. I am content with Calendar, Email and Contacts being separate apps so long as they talk to each other. This they seem to do quite adequately. If I want to sit them side by side on my desktop machine then I can and if I want them in different spaces then I can - lump them together and you just restrict the choice of how they are laid out. They are, after all, only a click away.
And with a standalone app you can have it beside your bible, under your bible, over your bible, on a second monitor or in a separate space. Lump them together and you just restrict the choice of how they are laid out.
I don't see why not! if I were Bob this is the way I would go. It would surely make maintenance so much easier.
All the above applies to notes.
To my mind it seems that Logos is a Text manipulation tool. Notes is a word-processing tool and Prayer Lists are a database tool. For the sake of the sanity of the programmers I would think that making them separate applications or programs would be the logical way to go PROVIDING there are adequate links between the three applications.
But then again I loath the Logos Box all my layouts break things up into floating windows which I spread over two monitors and four spaces. Having it all squashed into one screen seems a total waste of the Mac OX environment.
Maybe I am just odd?
By the way I like your suggestions - it would make a great standalone app :-)
If I could have a separate app which could "talk to logos," I would be happy. This will never be the case, however. I don't see why not! if I were Bob this is the way I would go. It would surely make maintenance so much easier.
I could handle a standalone app. However, I think it unlikely that Logos would ever make such a thing. Logos is not so much in the "App selling business" as in the "resource selling business." Even their new presentation software is designed to sell more resources, is it not? It would seem to me that a separate "prayer app" would be outside of Logos's "bread and butter." When these features are connected to the main program, however, it becomes a "selling point" and would drive more resource sales.
If Logos doesn't do it, I hope someone else does!
There are any number of prayer list apps out there. What's missing from them that you would want to see?
No offense - can you name one (or two or three?). If you have one you use, I will take a look. My preference, however, is for it to be integrated with Logos!
It occurs to me I failed to double-check what device or platform we are talking about. I checked the iOS app store and quickly found several apps that provide ability to manage prayer lists. The Mac App store didn't have any listings, but I'm sure a Google search would turn up apps available for PC or Mac.
I'm sure a Google search would turn up apps available for PC or Mac.
Again - no offense - but it doesn't. At least not any good ones.
What's missing from them that you would want to see?
First, I would want something that is accessible/syncs with all my macs, iPad, and (future)iPhone.
Second, I would want my "preferred" Logos Bible, along with its named highlighters, available alongside.
Third, I would want grouping & hierarchy.
Fourth, I would want advanced scheduling features & reminders.
Is that a good start?
"But why?" because I don't want to have another app that I have to use to track things with. Many of us that use Logos are not in full time ministry but Logos does help us in our walk, so why shouldn't Logos be my go to place for all these things? So just explain to me what the big difference is between tapping the Logos screen and selecting Prayer List and tapping the home button and selecting Logos Prayer App. In the 80's the move was towards ubiquitous all singing and all dancing suites of programs because that was the only way that the various elements had of communicating with each other. Modern devices make it much easier for elements to 'talk to each other'. Shoehorning a Prayer List specific operating environment into the Logos program seems silly to me. If your reason for not wanting another app, is cultural, emotional or just preferential then that is fine but it seems to me that it is not logical.
Mike, I already have prayer lists on L4M and the will sync with windows (If I used windows) and my reading lists sync to my iPhone/iPad so why can't prayer lists. I have several lists and I group them by topic i.e Ministry, Healing, Salvation, personal. Why should I have to use a separate app on my iPhone/iPad for prayer lists when L4M already has them. I use the reading lists quite a bit and like they way they sync between my devices. I would like prayer lists to do the same so wether I'm looking at my iPhone, iPad or on my Mac they are all the same. I would also like to be able to link resources(Bibles) so that when I select a link it would open the resource.
A separate app would work but why make a separate app just for prayer lists? They don't have a separate app for reading lists. If they started making everything a separate app pretty soon we could have 5, 6 or even more separate apps for Logos.
Just my two cents. I would like to have it included in the Logos app the same as it's in L4M. That's my preference.
What would be the role of Bible and highlighters in a prayer list app?
[^o)] Hmmmmmmmmm [^o)]
To read the Bible while you pray. I know that is a novel suggestion. [:)]
To read the Bible while you pray.
First, I'm asking as someone looking for app ideas. I've got one iOS app in the wild (P2R), and I'm about ready to write another one. A prayer list app tickles my fancy, but with several already out there, I'd need something that would set it apart. A few of your suggestions give me ideas of how it could be set apart.
Second, this is in the realm of more personal curiosity, what role does Bible reading play in the midst of praying for specific requests? I'm familiar with the practice of praying the Scriptures, but I don't know that I've heard of a similar practice while praying for specific requests and concerns.
First, I'm asking as someone looking for app ideas. I've got one iOS app in the wild (P2R), and I'm about ready to write another one. A prayer list app tickles my fancy, but with several already out there, I'd need something that would set it apart. A few of your suggestions give me ideas of how it could be set apart. Second, this is in the realm of more personal curiosity, what role does Bible reading play in the midst of praying for specific requests? I'm familiar with the practice of praying the Scriptures, but I don't know that I've heard of a similar practice while praying for specific requests and concerns.
Chris -
The only iOS apps I have seen were gaudy and designed for the iPhone / iPod Touch. For such an app, having the Bible added would have to be on a different screen. If you were to design an iPad app, that would open up "real estate" to add both.
As for the role of Bible reading with prayer... I see the two as synergistic. My reading can inform my prayers - my prayers can inform my reading. BTW, a reading app doesn't just have to be about "requests." It would be nice to have prayer plans or templates to assist people. In those areas of prayer, Bible reading is very important.
PS - I edited my previous post to be more friendly sounding [[:)]]. My humor probably didn't come across in the post.
PPS - I have P2R on my iPad. I have not really begun to use it (the iPad is primarily my wife's), but it is elegant in its simplicity. It is something even Mike could appreciate [:P]
To read the Bible while you pray. First, I'm asking as someone looking for app ideas. I've got one iOS app in the wild (P2R), and I'm about ready to write another one. A prayer list app tickles my fancy, but with several already out there, I'd need something that would set it apart. A few of your suggestions give me ideas of how it could be set apart. Second, this is in the realm of more personal curiosity, what role does Bible reading play in the midst of praying for specific requests? I'm familiar with the practice of praying the Scriptures, but I don't know that I've heard of a similar practice while praying for specific requests and concerns.
Chris, I like to "pray the Word' There are scriptures that address certain issue, healing, salvation, wisdom are a few. When praying I like to pray the word along with the specific item I am praying. I would like to be able to"click a link" and have the Bible open to that verse that I've put int he prayer request.
It would be nice to have prayer plans or templates to assist people. In those areas of prayer, Bible reading is very important.
I would like to be able to"click a link" and have the Bible open to that verse that I've put int he prayer request.
And this is where I could see using it in Logos or another Bible-focused app. Including a smaller selection of passages isn't a problem, most translations offer fairly generous usage terms. But including large chunks of text require a license. I was able to get a license for use of the ESV in P2R, but it took a lot of time and a little expense. Trying to include the whole Bible in multiple translations for a prayer app is pretty much out of the question unless the developer had standing agreements with publishers, something available to Logos and others.
The most someone like me could do, aside from passage snippets, is link to Bible passages in external sites, perhaps even embedding a web browser in the app, but it would require web access which would limit offline use.
Hi Chris
No doubt nobody on this thread will be surprised that I would encourage you to go down the app development route.
The idea of sitting the prayer list side by side with an open Bible on the iphone doesn't seem particularly attractive to me and my eyesight is only slightly failing!
Even on the ipad the available real estate may be limiting? But in landscape mode it might be ok.
For me the ideal app would be one that focuses on prayers in the way that Alabama indicates but which would open Logos to a preset Layout and synced with the Bible reference that called it from the prayer app.
iOS5 has the ability to 'five finger swipe' between running applications so although you might not be able to view both screens simultaneously they would only be a gesture apart.
If your app synced its prayer elements using say DropBox or iCloud between iphone and ipad I could cope with it not being on the desktop at all. If it could be adapted to sync with Lion then all the better for those of us with a laptop etc.
Most likely it would need to be a custom sync. Set up an account on a website and use that account to keep the app in sync. The Dropbox API is for syncing files, not discrete data objects, and while a method could be created to use Dropbox, it would be pretty clunky.
Similar with iCloud, though details here remain a little sketchy. I know Apple will open iCloud to devs for some synchronization, but I think the sync will be more along the lines of what Dropbox offers. File sync, maybe some application data, but I don't know if it will sync much in the way of data objects. And even if it does, conflict resolution would be a challenge.
So it seems to me that the best way to handle this would be with a custom sync server.
but which would open Logos to a preset Layout and synced with the Bible reference that called it from the prayer app.
I wonder if Logos has written the app to respond to custom URL's. If so, it would be relatively easy to have a prayer app open Bible passages in Logos. If not, then it's really not possible. I know the desktop versions of Logos are written to respond to custom links (so, for instance, Reftagger can add a link to a Bible passage to open the passage in Logos), but I don't think the iOS app has that capability. I'll have to ask.
I, so agree with Stephen. It diff is a useful tool and I hope it stays in Logosl. All this stuff about privacy, for pete's sake, common sense dictates to not use private info. Like Stephen said, just a note to remind, a "jot and tittle", if you will. I came to this thread looking for info how to better utilize it, like how to back up the dates to todays date after I accidently changed it and all I found was complaints about too many other things. Really? Any tool that helps us be all that Jesus would have us be is good!
Hi Brenda - and welcome to the forums
You are replying to a very old note and not many people may see it (not a lot of people look at the Logos 4 forums these days as many have upgraded to Logos 5)
I suggest that if you have a specific question about the use of Prayer Lists you start a new thread and explain clearly what you are looking for.
If still running Logos 4 then post in this forum - if you are running Logos 5 please use http://community.logos.com/forums/109.aspx
Graham
