Jesus in every book...but not Satan.

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Nov 6 2019 8:39 AM

Received an email from Logos that had this blurb.

Granted, this is more of a theological assertion than a scholarly assertion (though surely these two can overlap?), but even among many with a theological proclivity, it has become passé...or even a sign of provincial naiveté...to insist that hassaataan is to be found in Genesis. I wonder why that is?

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DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 8:51 AM

Because they’ll have another sale on Satan later 😂 It’s just business 👍😁👌

DAL

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 11:19 AM

Just find it odd that there are people who seem willing to say, "The serpent in Genesis...is just a snake, but the seed of the woman...that's JESUS!!!"

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 11:50 AM

Just as odd is the claim Jesus is on every page, in every single story. You need to read things into the text that are not there to make those sort of claims. But don’t let that get in the way of a ‘good’ marketing blurb, especially when you use a popular children’s bible story book to back up your claim. FL seem a bit confused as to who their market is when they come up with stuff like this advertisement.

Agreed David people are willing to say odd things.

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J. Remington Bowling | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 1:01 PM

When will FL realize their market is pretentious academics keeping up with the most enlightened opinions of their colleagues and who don't say embarrassing stuff that sounds as though God might have had some coherent plan spanning the entirety of human history? 

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 2:35 PM

J. Remington Bowling:
When will FL realize their market is pretentious academics

I hope that you are wrong ... but some academics are better trained than others. Your characterization is a gross misrepresentation of my hugely insignificant sample of 3 Biblical academics that I have known well enough to make an informed judgment.

However, I am often tempted to suggest that FL takes their market to be sloppy academics when I see how many errors are not reported and corrected. Note while I get very annoyed at the error rate in Logos, the error rate is actually quite low for the industry. But if users paid attention and reported errors, we could get it even lower.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 2:38 PM

DIsciple II:
Just as odd is the claim Jesus is on every page, in every single story

What? I thought you'd have been one of the first to pick up on the red Jesus watermark behind every FL screen Geeked

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 2:39 PM

J. Remington Bowling:
spanning the entirety of human history? 

Pretentious, enlightened-opinions, embarrassing, sounds-as-though. That'd be a neat crossword. Those same academics portray the Navajo 4th level origin story as untrue, maybe copied. But that's just their opinion. How could they know? What's not there might be there.

"I didn't know God made honky tonk angels."

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 2:49 PM

MJ. Smith:

DIsciple II:
Just as odd is the claim Jesus is on every page, in every single story

What? I thought you'd have been one of the first to pick up on the red Jesus watermark behind every FL screen Geeked

What? I thought that was an errant visual filter which I was yet to find the source so I could remove it. Now I understand... Cool

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Eduardo Fergusson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 5:02 PM

I don't understand the nature of this thread, there are scholars who believe that Jesus is seen in Genesis, so is more of a theological position, maybe FL is not aiming at you with this publicity...

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 6 2019 7:08 PM

Eduardo Fergusson:
there are scholars who believe that Jesus is seen in Genesis

For myself, I complain when FL is anachronistic in their tagging to put the Holy Spirit into the first chapter of Genesis. However, I also hold with Fr. Alexander Schemann that Christians rightly read the Old Testament through the lens of the Cross - a view obviously not available to the author or intended audience of the OT scripture. There is also the question of "all scripture points to" can either mean all scripture collectively or it may mean some minimum size of text - a jot? a tiddle? five verses? If I were creating an ad campaign, I'd stress the recent studies on the topic and suggest the buyer might want to learn why it is such a hot topic. That way I don't push a particular theological perspective or get myself in tangles with the theological perspective of other ads.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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James Chandler | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 7 2019 7:35 AM

J. Remington Bowling:

When will FL realize their market is pretentious academics 

I may be pretentious, but I don't consider myself an academic.  I got my Master's only because it was necessary to move into ministry.

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David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 7 2019 7:53 AM

Interesting that at the same moment David Paul initiated this thread I was listening to a podcast by Logos author Andreas Kostenberger about the different approaches to Biblical Theology. They had 2 episodes (15 minutes each) with Jason DeRouchie about approaches of Biblical Theology in the OT. For those who prefer text over audio, there is also a blog on the subject.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 7:51 AM

1. The genealogy of Jesus given in Luke traces back to (and through) Adam, who shows up in Genesis.

2. The Gospel of John is generally understood by scholars (and everyone else) to be teaching that Jesus is the Logos through whom God created the world. Genesis begins with two accounts of God creating the world.

FL's marketing in the highlighted line isn't necessarily a "theological assertion".

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 4:11 PM

Isn't your proof, proof of the Christian reading of the OT rather than proof that the plain meaning of the OT contains Jesus? Admittedly, I have no horse in this race but should we ever gain a significant Jewish market we should remember that there is a distinction.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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MWW | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 4:25 PM

As a Christian I found Faithlife's advertisement for "Christ in the Old Testament" something that caught my attention and drew my interest. I think that is what they were hoping for. I also hope they don't worry too much about being PC. Smile

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Allen Browne | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 5:28 PM

David Paul:
Granted, this is more of a theological assertion than a scholarly assertion (though surely these two can overlap?), but even among many with a theological proclivity, it has become passé...or even a sign of provincial naiveté...to insist that hassaataan is to be found in Genesis. I wonder why that is?

Perhaps it's because Rev 12:9 identifies the "ancient serpent" as Satan.

What I do is to encourage readers to hear the Genesis story in its own setting first, before trying to make sense of it in canonical context.

To use an analogy, a good spy novel might contain a murder in the first chapter. Later in the book it's revealed as an assassination by a foreign power, but we don't have that information up front: we're meant to hear the opening chapter as the story that leads us into a greater conflict. So, we need to start by reading Genesis 3 as a collusion between humans (agents/images of the heavenly king and guards of his garden) and a lower animal (one they're meant to manage), leading to rebellion against earth's true sovereign, a grasping for power that results in all the relational strife/conflict we experience.

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 6:45 PM

Allen Browne:

What I do is to encourage readers to hear the Genesis story in its own setting first, before trying to make sense of it in canonical context.

Totally agreed.

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Reuben Helmuth | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 8 2019 11:04 PM

MWW:
I also hope they don't worry too much about being PC.

Agreed. I'd prefer they were a little more Mac. 😜

P.S. I do also agree with your intended meaning!

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 9 2019 12:09 AM

Allen Browne:
What I do is to encourage readers to hear the Genesis story in its own setting first, before trying to make sense of it in canonical context.

Agreed

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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