About a marriage issue.

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Posts 3141
Tes | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Jun 28 2010 4:46 AM

Is there a resource in logos about marriage issue.who is allowed to marry or not to marry after devorce,basing on the scripture.

A married couple , disagreed ,they were living speparated in different rooms in the same  house , after some  years the woman ,decided to live with another man,so now after waiting some years ,now the man(x-man) is on the way to marry a girl.The eleders of the church have said ,said that OK,  we will not carry out the wedding ceremony ,but we are going to bless you, assuming that the man has ones made commitment with his X-wife ,now it is not possible to make commitment with the girl.For me it is a paradox,I couldn’t understand it ,because on the one hand the elders are recognizing them ,on the other hand they let them to live without commitment to one another.my understanding is even though they could have serious problems in their marraiage ,it is the woman who broke the commitment ,since the commitment is made by two parties,if the one fails to hold his Commitment ,then it is no more valid.So accorsing to my understanding  the man is free to marry and the elders have to carry out the ceremonial marriage.I understand this has to do with a church doctrine,but we Christains have our one Bible and we have to interprate it as it is.Please help me to understand this.in any means. My e-mail address is:Gtesfai AT Web Dot de.

 

Blessings in Christ.

Posts 3163
Dominick Sela | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 5:07 AM

If you are interested in Christ's teachings on divorce, there are some Gospel verses to read, study, and pray about:

Matt 5:31-32

Matt 19:3-9

Mark 10:2-12

Luke 16:18

You can also search in your entire library for any commentaries, articles etc. on these Gospel verses by searching for example for <Matt 19:3-9>  with the brackets, then any text that references any or all of these verses will come up.

 

Posts 3141
Tes | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 5:40 AM

Dominick Sela:

If you are interested in Christ's teachings on divorce, there are some Gospel verses to read, study, and pray about:

Matt 5:31-32

Matt 19:3-9

Mark 10:2-12

Luke 16:18

You can also search in your entire library for any commentaries, articles etc. on these Gospel verses by searching for example for <Matt 19:3-9>  with the brackets, then any text that references any or all of these verses will come up.

 

It is difficult to understand my question based on these verses,I need an adequate interpretation.

 

Blessings in Christ.

Posts 184
lostlogik | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 6:05 AM

Post edited/deleted to stay away from theological discussion..

Posts 611
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 6:32 AM

Tes:
It is difficult to understand my question based on these verses,I need an adequate interpretation.

The scriptures quoted and others will have been used to inform your Church's position on this I am not aware of a specific resource that addresses the issue that you have outlined specifically. A search for "divorce AND marriage" should find some articles in your Logos Library that might help.

Whilst not unique, the situation you outline is reasonably complex as clearly both parties were active in the failure of the marriage as evidenced by the decision to live apart under the same roof. We then have the destructive act of one partner moving further and establishing a new (adulterous) relationship. At this point the possibility of redemption and restoration of the relationship become limited and the likelihood of divorce increased.

No matter what the rights and wrongs of the situation prior to the adultery once adultery occurs Matthew 5:31-32 would become applicable i.e. the non adulterous partner has the right to a divorce.

Do you have a specific concern with the approach taken by your Church?

God Bless

Graham

Pastor - NTCOG Basingstoke

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:00 AM

It's not a Logos resource, but here's a blog post I wrote as part of my prep for a sermon on marriage and divorce:

http://www.seektheholy.com/2009/12/30/christians-and-divorce/

Posts 184
lostlogik | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:31 AM

Chris Roberts:

It's not a Logos resource, but here's a blog post I wrote as part of my prep for a sermon on marriage and divorce:

http://www.seektheholy.com/2009/12/30/christians-and-divorce/

A nice sermon, which puts across very well what I was trying to say in 10 words. (I've downloaded the pdf)

Posts 3163
Dominick Sela | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:44 AM

I just posted the Bible verses because there are any number of interpretations as to what Jesus taught.  Christians believe everything from absolutely no divorce, as it would appear Jesus was questioned as to how he meant this given what Moses said, to divorce is ok. And people believe all levels.  So unfortunately your only course of action is to either read, pray and discern, and decide for yourself, or decide on an authority, whether a person or a church or a web site, whose opinion you agree with, and follow that. There is no definitive answer to your questions, only opinions as to what Jesus taught.

We are also under forum guidelines to stay away from theological discussion because the opinions on truth are so widely varying, it gets into a potentially contentious situation. Let's hope this thread does not degrade into that!

Posts 8660
TCBlack | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:58 AM

Thank you for including your email Tes.  It is my hope that you will gain some great responses.

The Given list of Bible verses, including 1 Corinthians 7 would be a great set of passages to study.

Dominick Sela:
We are also under forum guidelines to stay away from theological discussion because the opinions on truth are so widely varying, it gets into a potentially contentious situation. Let's hope this thread does not degrade into that!

I have not read the following Logos resources but they may be helpful in clarifying scriptural teaching on the issues you raise.

McGee, J. Vernon. Marriage & Divorce. electronic ed. Nashville: Thomas Nelson Publishers, 2001.

Sproul, R.C. (Robert Charles). The Intimate Marriage : A Practical Guide to Building a Great Marriage. Wheaton, IL: Tyndale House Publishers, 1975.

 

Both of them contain chapters on Divorce issues. 

Of course I would encourage you first to do some exegesis on the references already given and to follow any trails of thought.

Within the confines of this forum's regulations I can go no farther than this.

Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

Posts 184
lostlogik | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 8:12 AM

Dominick Sela:

We are also under forum guidelines to stay away from theological discussion 

Oops. Wasn't aware of that but can fully understand.

Posts 5337
Kevin Becker | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 9:47 AM

Tes, in addition to all these fine suggestions I would do a library search with the word "remarriage" it seems to be the most important word that will bring up discussions of this theological issue.

I also searched Logos.com for remarriage and noted a couple of small collections that looked like they would contain good resources on this topic if you are interested in spending some money.

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 9:47 AM

Tes:
The eleders of the church have said ,said that OK,  we will not carry out the wedding ceremony ,but we are going to bless you,

There are a number of books that deal with divorce and re-marriage. But they appear to be part of big collections.
(I guess you can buy all of them. Idea )
Christian Focus Marriage and Family Collection (7 Vols.) http://www.logos.com/products/details/5667
Tony Evans Collection (16 Vols.) http://www.logos.com/products/details/4243
B&H Marriage and Family Collection (19 Vols.) http://www.logos.com/products/details/4135
Loraine Boettner Collection (8 Vols.) http://www.logos.com/products/details/4725
And still in Pre-Pub: Hope for the Heart Biblical Counseling Library (100 Vols.) http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/5265
****************************************************
EDITED to remove my comments (after reading Michael Halpern's post)
I replaced it with an interesting take from Jon Courson  http://www.logos.com/products/details/6455

 "But if I marry her, I fear we’ll be living in adultery all of our lives.”
“I can’t tell you what to do,” I said. “But I do know this: I’m a bride and I have failed greatly. But my Bridegroom, Jesus Christ, was willing to absorb my pollution and iniquity to bring me into His love and into His family. Therefore, I do not believe it is against the heart of God for you to enter into a relationship to redeem that mother and child—even if it means absorbing pollution and bearing iniquity—because that’s exactly what Jesus did for me.”

I take time to address this issue because I believe it is important. On one hand, people are taking divorce far too lightly because they fail to realize its seriousness. On the other hand, the church too often mistakenly stands ready to judge and condemn couples who have admittedly failed, but who have sought the Lord and are now starting a new life together. There needs to be a balance in this very sober and serious matter of divorce."

-- Courson, J. (2003). Jon Courson's Application Commentary (149). Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 691
Frank Sauer | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 10:09 AM

Matthew C Jones:

I think it is damaging to allow a divorced/re-married person to give a "testimony" before the church saying, "I was married to a horrible spouse, I dumped them, then God blessed me with this new spouse and everything is fine now, praise God!" This tells other struggling couples to achieve happiness they just need to jettison their loser spouse for the shiny, new spouse.

YesYesYes

Posts 264
Michael G. Halpern | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 11:26 AM

Just a word of caution:  Forum rules prohibit theological discussions!  Our opinions as to what Scripture says/doesn't say is just that (at least on these forums)...just opinions; not to be discussed!  Please adhere to the rules as to be the respectful Christians we desire to be and if you wish to provide OP w/additional information beyond her request for resources, she has provided you with an email address to do so.  Thank you...Michael

Posts 8967
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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 12:13 PM

Dominick Sela:
I just posted the Bible verses because there are any number of interpretations as to what Jesus taught.

Good move.

"Meanwhile, people in deteriorating marriages and in the churches that stand alongside them are frustrated. Does the Bible have a clear word or does it not? Any struggling couple can easily find a biblical scholar, a book, a therapist, a pastor, and/or a Christian congregation to support any position they themselves have reached (or want to reach) on the question of divorce and remarriage. In the end those in struggling marriages would probably benefit more by focusing on “marriage texts” than on “divorce texts,” which is exactly what Jesus modeled in Mark 10:5–9."

Geddert, T. J. (2001). Mark. Believers Church Bible Commentary (240). Scottdale, Pa.: Herald Press.

This is from a Logos resource available in the Platinum & Portfolio Edition packages.
Available separately: Believers Church Bible Commentary (19 Vols) http://www.logos.com/products/details/2080

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 3141
Tes | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 1:13 PM

Graham Owen:
Do you have a specific concern with the approach taken by your Church?

Thank you Graham.(I want to avoid the avoid the quotation..

What ever the case may be ,I am speaking about reallity.about what has taken place.Yesterday I have discussed with my frined.he put his anchor on one statement again  and again ,''The man has a right to dovorce here as long as she committed adultery,but he doesn't have to marry'',my position is first even they had disagreement it was the womans who broke the committment ,for this reason he can marry another one,here is the paradox''the elders of the church allowed him to marry ,but they would not make the ceremonial committment,instead they would bless them.That means they don't have committment ,so that makes them free to devorce.for me as long as they have allowed them to marry,what forbides them to make  a committment?

please send your comments to my e-mail  Gtesfai AT web.de

Blessings in Christ.

Posts 110
Ron Cook | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 3:19 PM

Not available in Logos to my knowledge but a resource that I use in my Christian Counseling practice is "Marriage, Divorce, and Remarriage in the Bible" by Jay Adams.  

Samsung Series 7; Windows 8 64 bit; Intel Core i7-3635QM @2.4GHz; 8 GB RAM; 1 GB NVIDIA GeForce GT640M

Posts 3730
BillS | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 4:40 PM

You might check the references on Marriage for any of the topical Bibles in Logos. I regularly use all of them:

NASB Topical Index
Nelson's Topical Bible Index
New Topical Textbook
Topical Analyis of the Bible
The Thematic Bible: Topical Analysis
Collins Thesaurus of the Bible

Below is a list of references from Nave's Topical BIble in Logos, for example. As you can see, each topic will have suggestions that lead to other topics & Scriptures that may be helpful.

MARRIAGE. In family blood lines, Abraham and Sarah, Gen. 11:29; 12:13; 20:3, 9–16. Isaac and Rebekah, Gen. 24:3, 4, 67; 28:2. Jacob and his wives, Gen. 29:15–30; see below, in the elaborated text. Levirate (the brother required to marry a brother’s widow), Gen. 38:8, 11; Deut. 25:5–10; Ruth 4:5; Matt. 22:24; Mark 12:19–23; Luke 20:28. Parents contract for their children: Hagar selects a wife for Ishmael, Gen. 21:21; Abraham for Isaac, Gen. 24; Laban arranges for his daughters’ marriage, Gen. 29; Samson asks his parents to procure him a wife, Judg. 14:2. Parents’ consent required in the Mosaic law, Ex. 22:17. Presents given to parents to secure their favor, Gen. 24:53; 34:12; Deut. 22:29; 1 Sam. 18:25; Hos. 3:2. Marriage feasts, Gen. 29:22; Judg. 14:12; Esth. 2:18; Matt. 22:11, 12. Jesus present at, John 2:1–5. Ceremony attested by witnesses, Ruth 4:1–11; Isa. 8:1–3. Bridegroom exempt one year from military duty, Deut. 24:5. Bridal ornaments, Isa. 49:18; Jer. 2:32. Bridal presents, Gen. 24:53; Psa. 45:12. Herald preceded the bridegroom, Matt. 25:6. Wedding robes adorned with jewels, Isa. 61:10. Wives obtained by purchase, Gen. 29:20; Ruth 4:10; Hos. 3:2; 12:12; by kidnapping, Judg. 21:21–23. Given by Kings, 1 Sam. 17:25; 18:17, 21. Daughters given in, as rewards of valor, Judg. 1:12; 1 Sam. 17:25; 18:27. Wives taken by edict, Esth. 2:2–4, 8–14. David gave one hundred Philistine foreskins for a wife, 2 Sam. 3:14. Wives among the Israelites must be Israelites, Ex. 34:16; Deut. 7:3, 4; 1 Chr. 23:22; Ezra 9:1, 2, 12; Neh. 10:30; 13:26, 27; Mal. 2:11; 1 Cor. 7:39; 2 Cor. 6:14. Betrothal a quasi-marriage, Matt. 1:18; Luke 1:27. Betrothal made with the spirit, Ezek. 16:8. Celibacy deplored, Judg. 11:38; Isa. 4:1; Jer. 16:9; advised, 1 Cor. 7:7, 8, 24–40. Obligations under, inferior to duty to God, Deut. 13:6–10; Matt. 19:29; Luke 14:26. Not binding after death, Matt. 22:29, 30; Mark 12:24, 25. See Bride; Bridegroom.

Unclassified Scriptures Relating to:

Gen. 2:23, 24 1 Cor. 6:16. Ex. 22:16, 17; Lev. 18:6–8 [Deut. 22:30.] Lev. 18:9–18; Lev. 20:14, 17, 19–21; Lev. 21:1, 7, 13–15; Num. 36:8; Deut. 21:10–14; Deut. 24:1–5; Prov. 18:22; Prov. 21:9, 19; Jer. 29:6; Hos. 2:19, 20; Mal. 2:13–16; Matt. 5:31, 32; Mark 6:17, 18; Mark 10:2–12 Matt. 19:2–9. Luke 16:18; Rom. 7:1–3; 1 Cor. 7:1–40; 1 Cor. 9:5; 1 Cor. 11:11, 12; 1 Tim. 3:2, 12; 1 Tim. 4:1, 3; 1 Tim. 5:14; Heb. 13:4

 

Figurative:

Isa. 54:5; 62:4, 5; Jer. 3:14; 31:32; Hos. 1:2; 2:19, 20; Eph. 5:30–32; Rev. 19:7–9. Parables from, Matt. 22:2; 25:1–10. See Divorce; Husband; Wife.

 

Grace & Peace,
Bill


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Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 6:54 PM

John Piper's What Jesus Demands from the World has a few chapters on divorce and remarriage that are pretty good: http://www.logos.com/ebooks/details/WHATJESDEM You can also get that book for free in pdf format http://www.desiringgod.org/media/pdf/books_bwjd/books_bwjd.pdf

There are some others as well. 

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

Posts 493
Brian W. Davidson | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jun 28 2010 7:56 PM

Tes, as someone who has gone through a marriage, divorce, and remarriage I highly recommend two resources (I don't know if they are in Logos or not). Both argue that divorce is acceptable in certain circumstances and in those circumstances remarriage is acceptable as well:

Andreas Kostenberger, God, Marriage, and Family

http://amzn.to/a8Emgr

David Instone-Brewer, Divorce and Remarriage in the Bible

http://amzn.to/djyglG

 

For the other side of the coin:

William Heth and Gordon Wenham, Jesus and Divorce (These guys strongly shaped Piper's conclusions. At the time of the writing of the original edition of this book both authors believed divorce was acceptable in limited circumstances, but remarriage was never OK)

http://amzn.to/aJtfjO

One of the authors, Heth, has changed his mind and talks about it in the article below (after clicking the link, click download on the page that it takes you to). He now thinks similarly to Kostenberger and Instone-Brewer.

"Jesus on Divorce: How My Mind Has Changed"

http://bit.ly/9RIlzp

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