High Definition Commentary Series - No More Graphics :(

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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2020 7:23 AM

The introductions are a pretty quick read and can be helpful in grasping the various discourse features. Things opened up for me once I continued to review the various features. Then, some became more important to me and I could adjust what was visible in the visual filter.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2020 11:29 AM

Let me add to John's analysis by being rather harsh about the Logos approach to linguistics:

  1. First layer: the parts-of-speech and morphology remain firmly entrenched in the 1800's with no recognition of the more recent work that sorts out the odd-balls and ambiguities. This appears to be true of the language textbooks as well which gives Logos a shaky platform on which to build.
  2.  Second layer: for many users, it seems to still be Kellogg-Reed which was designed for English not Greek or Latin. The visualizations are solid work but it is not easy to see the overall structure in the horizontal, top-loaded format. A tree visualization taking advantage of current computer capabilities would both move linguistic understanding forward and allow for a tree-drawing feature more equal with the online freebies.
  3. The vocabulary layer: The Bible sense lexicon is a solid start but more relationships need to be added/identified and the vocabulary broaden - Bible words weren't created specifically for the Bible.
  4. The case frame layer: The data is present but next to impossible to see in a usable format -- especially with a malfunctioning Clause search.
  5. So from this rickety structure you expect the next linguistic level that the user will find useful is discourse analysis? That they suddenly have mastered semantics and semiotics? That they will not just nod their head sagely at this neat new tool while never really seeing what it brings to the table that they didn't have before?

Don't get me wrong - I have deliberately pointed out the weaknesses and omitted the strengths of the Logos linguistic tools. But I have done so with a purpose: to show that Logos dove into discourse analysis without first analyzing whether they had prepared their user base for it  Do that prep work so that Discourse Analysis is the obvious next step in linguistic analysis and I suspect that the commentaries will have a reasonable market.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 28 2020 7:31 PM

No dog in this fight but agreeing with what MJ said above.

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Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 29 2020 5:29 AM

I'm a lot less erudite and complex than John and MJ. I have a rudimentary understanding of DA, so in itself it is not really something I stand or fall on, just one more way to examine the Biblical text to me. What interested me in the series were the graphics as a helpful means of understanding and conveying meaning to others, especially in a teaching or preaching format. Secondarily, I have respect for Dr. Runge's scholarship, which gave me confidence that the series would be well thought out and researched. I just have not taken the time post seminary and post church preaching/teaching ministry to learn DA.  

So, for me, quite simply, when the graphics are gone, it took away a huge draw. I can't explain why the overall interest seemed to wane.

Dr. Runge, I appreciate that you named part of your very real world context related to your caring for your parents. I'm sorry you've had to go through that--not that you were seeking that, I just appreciate that all of this stuff we consume and crave from Logos is created by people with real life burdens. As one whose parents are aging and the spectre of care needs loom, I at least have an inkling of what you were juggling on so many levels.  Peace to you, and renewal.

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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 29 2020 6:18 AM

 

Dr. Steven E. Runge (Logos):

Thanks for taking the time to convey these thoughts, John. I completely agree about the need for videos and the fact that the products have fallen off the radar. Hoping that my FB live efforts are a move in the right direction. 

I do not use FB so I cannot say if it will be helpful. What about Faithlife groups or even posting a link to the videos some place on the Logos.com site which is where most of your existing and new clients will be accessible. I really hope these get traction again as they are excellent resources.

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Mattillo | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 29 2020 9:20 AM

John Fidel:

 

Dr. Steven E. Runge (Logos):

Thanks for taking the time to convey these thoughts, John. I completely agree about the need for videos and the fact that the products have fallen off the radar. Hoping that my FB live efforts are a move in the right direction. 

I do not use FB so I cannot say if it will be helpful. What about Faithlife groups or even posting a link to the videos some place on the Logos.com site which is where most of your existing and new clients will be accessible. I really hope these get traction again as they are excellent resources.

This would be a good spot for Faithlife TV content.  Dr. Runge could make his own channel on there and post all of his videos for us to watch.  I don't use FB much.  It also hard for me to attend these as they are usually in the daytime.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jun 2 2020 4:34 PM

FWIW:

In this series, I have only HDC: Philippians. (I don't remember when or how I acquired it, whether as part of some bundle or as a freebie.)

I just opened it up for what I think is the first time. I've now done a mixture of reading and skimming through the first chapter. I appreciate its readability. Honestly, so far I wish it had no graphics at all. They break the text up without adding value for me. I would prefer more discourse analysis and less personal flavouring and external theology. That said, I definitely won't avoid this commentary whenever I next run a Passage Guide on some part of Philippians.

"The saints are the true interpreters of Holy Scripture. The meaning of a given passage of the Bible becomes most intelligible in those human beings who have been totally transfixed by it and have lived it out." - Pope Benedict XVI

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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 3 2020 5:44 AM

SineNomine:

Honestly, so far I wish it had no graphics at all. They break the text up without adding value for me. I would prefer more discourse analysis and less personal flavouring and external theology. That said, I definitely won't avoid this commentary whenever I next run a Passage Guide on some part of Philippians.

Just started going through Galatians, that does not have the graphics, and for me, I agree about the graphics. I do not teach or preach, so that may impact my  preference. I hope the series continues to be published as there are a few in Prepub currently.

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