A sincere "thanks" for the Mac version

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This post has 11 Replies | 0 Followers

Posts 1342
Mike Tourangeau | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Jul 1 2010 5:13 PM

I want to voice my "thanks" for the hard work put into Logos 4 for mac. I have not booted into windows sine A21, I find the mac version enough for sermon prep etc. Once notes are implemented, I hope to purge my mac of any remnant of windows :)

I think Logos has been a blessing to many congregations and the full impact will only be known in eternity. Thanks again

Posts 45
Jason York | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 1 2010 8:28 PM

I agree and want to voice my own thanks. I think we are all eagerly awaiting beta and keep asking for hints as to when it will come, but at the end of the day we are all quite thankful for such a high quality software for the mac. If it wasn't for the team that is working hard day after day to build the software we would be stuck with quickverse, and other alternatives which don't compare to the highly intuitive and powerful Logos 4. 

On a random note, thanks also for your dedication to constantly updating and fixing things like typos and other issues with the actual books and resources. i know of no other company that is so complete in constantly working out bugs and typos. 

Thanks again and God bless Yes

Posts 468
Anon | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 1 2010 8:59 PM

+1 Yes

 

 

Posts 856
Michael McLane | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 1 2010 9:45 PM

I agree 110%.

But, please ... anyone, am I the only one that thinks the File Menu is just plain wrong.

First, no matter what platform you are running the File menu should NOT be a file browser. Where is the logic there? How about some form of an open dialogue box? Or some kind of a window or something. Maybe something similar to a Collections tab or a Library tab. But I do not want to browse through hundreds of files in the File menu whether they are in folders or not. I dread each moment that I have to click it, look at it and then find (get it? Find) what I am looking for.

Second, if you are going to make a Mac application at least stick to the standard form of a Mac menu, namely the File menu. Aren't there some form of human interface guidelines here?

Okay ... I'm done. Thank you for listening for the upteenth time. And please, can anyone back me up here?

Again, I love the app and am so grateful for it and appreciate the work that the Logos team is doing.

Posts 10817
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 2 2010 4:12 AM

Michael Paul:

Second, if you are going to make a Mac application at least stick to the standard form of a Mac menu, namely the File menu. Aren't there some form of human interface guidelines here?

Okay ... I'm done. Thank you for listening for the upteenth time. And please, can anyone back me up here?

Personally, I would rather have consistency across platforms. (BTW, I am not new to the Mac OS—I purchased my first Mac in 1984).

Posts 15805
Forum MVP
Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 2 2010 5:10 AM

Thanks to Logos Big Smile Appreciate cross platform usability and library licensing.

Jack Caviness:

Michael Paul:

Second, if you are going to make a Mac application at least stick to the standard form of a Mac menu, namely the File menu. Aren't there some form of human interface guidelines here?

Okay ... I'm done. Thank you for listening for the upteenth time. And please, can anyone back me up here?

Personally, I would rather have consistency across platforms. (BTW, I am not new to the Mac OS—I purchased my first Mac in 1984).

Logos 1.2.2 is Mac Only => File Menu shows 5 items - also has Help menu

Logos 4 is cross platform, with expanded File Menu (workspace => Layouts menu), but lacking Help menu:

Idea Help Menu could include links => Logos Tutorials, Wiki, Forum, Pre-Publications, ...

Observation: Layouts Menu is an improvement from Logos 1.2.2 Workspace -  thumbnail previews good Yes

By way of comparison, Open Office has hierarchical File menu items:

Personal opinion: Star for Logos 4 File menu - easy to use

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 698
LogosEmployee

This issue was raised before we released the first alpha containing a useful file menu and continues to be discussed internally. As Jack astutely points out, there are competing goals in this case--consistency across platforms vs. preferring the native idiom on the Mac.

Director of Engineering for Enterprise and Operations

Posts 3187
LogosEmployee
Thomas Ball | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 2 2010 11:51 AM

KS4J:

With reagards to the 'Help' menu missing. That is something that will be added later down the line. That is just part of the development process. So don't worry that we will ship without a Help function. 

 

Posts 856
Michael McLane | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 2 2010 11:55 AM

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :):

Personal opinion: Star for Logos 4 File menu - easy to use

Keep Smiling Smile

But it is really two menus in one and a file browser all in one and is cumbersome to use with many, many files, with or without search. Even a hierarchical menu would be more logical and intuitive.

Cameron Watters:
consistency across platforms vs. preferring the native idiom on the Mac.

Do both. Even on the Windows side the File menu seems to break interface convention and standards.

Posts 13
Victor Gutierrez | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 2 2010 7:31 PM

To the "Logos 4 Mac" team...

Thanks!!

Posts 15805
Forum MVP
Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 3 2010 12:42 AM

Michael Paul:

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :):

Personal opinion: Star for Logos 4 File menu - easy to use

Keep Smiling Smile

But it is really two menus in one and a file browser all in one and is cumbersome to use with many, many files, with or without search. Even a hierarchical menu would be more logical and intuitive.

Cameron Watters:
consistency across platforms vs. preferring the native idiom on the Mac.

Do both. Even on the Windows side the File menu seems to break interface convention and standards.

Observation: Layouts menu also has split personality Star - named and scrollable history

On Windows, Microsoft Office Ribbon - already changing interface convention and standards - Edit menu no longer exists (paste now in Home ribbon).

Both Numbers and Pages have Template Choosers - floating panel with many choices and filtering options.

Idea Wonder if collections metaphor could be extended to File - use notebooks to group various items - option to expand/collapse contents.

Microsoft Word 2008 File menu has Project Gallery pop-up with many items:

Possible model for Logos cross platform file with notebook organizers.  Show: All Logos (Reading Plans, Notes, Clippings, ...)

Thanks for Help menu planned addition - perhaps added in a Beta or Release Candidate ?

Keep Smiling Smile

 

Posts 11
Paul Backhurst | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jul 3 2010 11:38 AM

With regards to Cross-Platform consistency and the Mac Idiom my opinion is do whatever works for a programme like Logos, with a deferential nod to, in this case, Macs GUI guidelines, but not to be held in digital bondage to it. Logos's (Logos' Confused) needs are different from other programmes, whether Mac or PC. For example, look at the context menu we use when examining a word or wishing to copy a Bible text? I've never seen such a menu before on a Mac programme - two columns, etc, but it's essential because of the complexity of options needed to be given to the user, whether enthusiastic Bible reader, Divinity Student or Bible Scholar. 

I am a daily user of Photoshop for my work and have followed the GUI developments and arguments since version CS2. They've gone in a different direction with using compressed and dynamic palettes instead of the screen-real-estate-stealing dialog-boxes. They've chosen what fits their incredibly broad and deep programme so that IT WORKS optimally - not just keep the GUI-fanatics happy.

Also, as a few examples show by other posters, even Apple and Microsoft don't limit themselves to a sterile drop-down menu if they need something more extensive.

To sum up, my opinion, for what it's worth, is keep to the Apple GUI guidelines because aesthetically they are great,  but don't be limited by them. Do whatever is needed to make a great programme greatly useable, without having to drill down level after level after dialog box after dialog box (think NeoOffice/OpenOffice) just to use the programme.

Regards, Paul

MacBook Pro 13.3 inch • 2.26 GHz • Intel Core 2 Duo • 8GB Memory • Snow Leopard 10.6.3 • 1 TB HDD

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