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Posts 1
Pastor Matthew Hardaway | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Oct 23 2009 9:29 AM

Is it possible to view the textual apparatus of the Nestle-Aland within Logos?  It is great to have the text available in class, but frustrating to not have access to the apparatus.  Thanks in advance for any advice!

 

Matthew

Posts 5615
Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 23 2009 9:34 AM

I believe you'll need to get the SESB package to get the apparatus:

http://www.logos.com/products/details/3005

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

Posts 767
Alan Charles Gielczyk | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 23 2009 9:35 AM

Yes, you have to purchase SESB. It is spendy, but well worth it. You get NA27 and UBS4 apparatus, and the BHS apparatus along with many other language tools. If you are in seminary, as I am and you said something about class, it is very worth having.

Posts 5615
Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 23 2009 9:41 AM

Alan Charles Gielczyk:

Yes, you have to purchase SESB. It is spendy, but well worth it. You get NA27 and UBS4 apparatus, and the BHS apparatus along with many other language tools. If you are in seminary, as I am and you said something about class, it is very worth having.

BTW there are two versions of the SESB 3.0.  The version I linked to is a scaled back version that has the NA27 apparatus but the not UBS4 apparatus.  The version Alan linked to has the UBS apparatus and a lot more stuff, but if you only want the NA27 apparatus it may be overkill.

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

Posts 399
Wilson Hines | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 27 2009 12:37 PM

Quite frankly, the difference between having and not having the SESB and not having it is like studying in a dimly lit room with sunglasses (w/out the SESB) and then having somebody turn the light on and take your sunglasses away.  I can't imagine Logos without the SESB.

Wilson Hines

Posts 596
LaRosa Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 27 2009 12:41 PM

i just got my copy a few weeks ago, and i'm starting to feel the same way!

lj.

Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com 
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Posts 493
Brian W. Davidson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 27 2009 2:52 PM

I will add my voice to the others. I have used SESB for over a year now and do not regret spending the extra money at all! I upgraded to 3.0 as soon as it came out. If you have the cash, get SESB 3.0.

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 27 2009 5:48 PM

Wilson Hines:

Quite frankly, the difference between having and not having the SESB and not having it is like studying in a dimly lit room with sunglasses (w/out the SESB) and then having somebody turn the light on and take your sunglasses away.  I can't imagine Logos without the SESB.

You can take off the sunglasses now, brother.  Cool

All double-negative joking aside, Thanks for the recommendation.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 399
Wilson Hines | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 28 2009 3:37 AM

Haha, in two hundred years or so text critics would have a ball with the quoting system in forums! LOL.  I really slung that one out, didn't I?

Wilson Hines

Posts 62
Mike T | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 3:24 PM

Wilson Hines:

Quite frankly, the difference between having and not having the SESB and not having it is like studying in a dimly lit room with sunglasses (w/out the SESB) and then having somebody turn the light on and take your sunglasses away.  I can't imagine Logos without the SESB.

That is quite a statement...  Could you (or anyone else that uses SESB) please explain to me what features of the SESB that you appreciate so much?  Are there search features that are unique to SESB?  Secondarily, I have been comparing the SESB and SESB for Logos Users versions.  Given that I plan to upgrade to L4 Platinum, I will already have the Apostolic Fathers in Greek, BDAG, etc.  Is the full-blown SESB still worth the difference in price?

Thanks for your help!

 

Posts 2744
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 3:40 PM

Michael:

That is quite a statement...  Could you (or anyone else that uses SESB) please explain to me what features of the SESB that you appreciate so much?  Are there search features that are unique to SESB?  Secondarily, I have been comparing the SESB and SESB for Logos Users versions.  Given that I plan to upgrade to L4 Platinum, I will already have the Apostolic Fathers in Greek, BDAG, etc.  Is the full-blown SESB still worth the difference in price?

Thanks for your help!

It is exactly my question also. I have Platinum. What can I get more from the SESB except the Aparatuses? I would really like to see the possibility to buy just Aparatuses separately through Logos by download.

Bohuslav

Posts 2212
Damian McGrath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 3:48 PM

Bohuslav Wojnar:

It is exactly my question also. I have Platinum. What can I get more from the SESB except the Aparatuses? I would really like to see the possibility to buy just Aparatuses separately through Logos by download.

Bohuslav, have you looked at the 52 volumes in SESB 3.0

The apparatus are separate resources from the actual BHS and NA27 - so you need all 4 of them. And I can't go back to reading any other NA27 or BHS after having ones that replicate perfectly my printed editions.

You also have available many fascicles from the developinhg BHQ.

Plus, apparatus for LXX, Vulgate, UBS4

 

All of these make even a $300 price seem very reasonable.

Posts 2744
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 3:54 PM

Damian McGrath:

Bohuslav Wojnar:

It is exactly my question also. I have Platinum. What can I get more from the SESB except the Aparatuses? I would really like to see the possibility to buy just Aparatuses separately through Logos by download.

Bohuslav, have you looked at the 52 volumes in SESB 3.0

The apparatus are separate resources from the actual BHS and NA27 - so you need all 4 of them. And I can't go back to reading any other NA27 or BHS after having ones that replicate perfectly my printed editions.

You also have available many fascicles from the developinhg BHQ.

Plus, apparatus for LXX, Vulgate, UBS4

 

All of these make even a $300 price seem very reasonable.

So you mean NA27 and BHS of SESB is different than what we have in Logos? I was actually commenting the lighter version of SESB. I like very much the full European version also for all the European languages and many other tools. You are right.

Bohuslav

Posts 2212
Damian McGrath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:24 PM

Bohuslav Wojnar:

So you mean NA27 and BHS of SESB is different than what we have in Logos? I was actually commenting the lighter version of SESB. I like very much the full European version also for all the European languages and many other tools. You are right.

Well, they are different in as much as they have all the sigla for textual variants present:

 

My complaint from Beta testing still stands - the variant markings are very hard to read in v4.0 because of the use of dark blue as the colour (in v3.0) they were red!

 

Hovering in NA27 provides this:

 

That's a good start. The hover is not as helpful in the BHS - it simply tells you that there's apparatus for that verse. 

But, you can use the Information Tool or Open the Apparatus  resource. A hover over the sigla will tell you what they are. Wonderful!

 

Similarly NA27:

 

And, for about $150 if I remember correctly, I believe even the limited version is of great value. These are very expensive resources providing a huge amount of information.

Posts 2744
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:29 PM

Damian McGrath:
And, for about $150 if I remember correctly, I believe even the limited version is of great value. These are very expensive resources providing a huge amount of information.

Thank you Damian for all  that info. I am starting to understand the difference. I always thought my BHS and NA27 is the same (made in Stuttgart) as the SESB ones. I appreciate your explanation. Thanks.

Bohuslav

Posts 2212
Damian McGrath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:46 PM

Bohuslav,

The hover over word information is also different.

BHS WIVU gives you this:

 

BHS SESB gives you this:

Posts 399
Wilson Hines | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 5:57 PM

Since the others responded to the challenge, and responded quite well, with screen shots and such, I think I can practically just add a couple comments.  First off, one of the most used/greatest tools in my library is the critical app along with the the text of the NA27.  Between my printed version of the NA27 and my digital version, I use it more than I use my English text.  What I was saying in my comment was if I didn't have a critical apparatus I would feel like one of my eyes were covered or I was reading in the dark with sunglasses on.  

Another fantastic resource I use is the Apostolic Fathers.  I have a first edition printing of Bishop Lightfoot's Apostolic Fathers in Greek and English .  The use of this in Logos is greatly appreciated, yet I don't know why they produced this title in an interlinear style, as the Lightfoot edition has the Greek first and then the English.  

Oh well, I couldn't get along without my SESB now that I have the SESB!

Wilson Hines

Posts 2212
Damian McGrath | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 6:11 PM

Wilson Hines:

First off, one of the most used/greatest tools in my library is the critical app along with the the text of the NA27.  Between my printed version of the NA27 and my digital version, I use it more than I use my English text.  What I was saying in my comment was if I didn't have a critical apparatus I would feel like one of my eyes were covered or I was reading in the dark with sunglasses on.  

Wilson,

I couldn't agree more with this sentiment.

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