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Mark Stevens | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Oct 29 2009 1:12 AM

I am in the process of replacing my Mac-Book and am trying to decide whether to stay Mac or return to PC. Logos is the program I use the most (after Word) primarily for sermon prep. I am well aware of the differences between the two engines but I wondered if anyone could tell of there experience of going from mac to pc (in regards to Logos) or vice versa. For instance; did you miss anything from the PC version that much? Did you find going from Mac to PC to be frustrating etc etc.

 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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John Fidel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 2:23 AM

I have both on the same Macbook Pro using Parallels 3. You can also, and probably should consider VMware instead. The books can be shared across both operating systems in a common folder and the windows version of libronix is a free download. The windows version has many more features that I would miss if I was only using the Mac version. 

As to whether to go back to a PC, that is up to you. I use a PC at work and it is not a problem for me to switch back and forth. Windows 7 may even make the switch easier.

Posts 1928
Donovan R. Palmer | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 5:41 AM

MarkStevens:
I am in the process of replacing my Mac-Book and am trying to decide whether to stay Mac or return to PC. Logos is the program I use the most (after Word) primarily for sermon prep. I am well aware of the differences between the two engines but I wondered if anyone could tell of there experience of going from mac to pc (in regards to Logos) or vice versa. For instance; did you miss anything from the PC version that much? Did you find going from Mac to PC to be frustrating etc etc.

After 15 years of Windows, I made the switch last year and haven't regretted it one minute. In fact, I counted up the other day that I have 16 friends that have changed to the Apple computers in the last two years. They were all long term windows users.  All have been very happy that they made the shift. 

When it comes to Logos for Mac, you can search these forums and find plenty of feedback on version 1. It's in its infancy, but for a lot of my basic research it works fine. If I need to really do some heavy lifting exegetically, I have to boot up the Windows version or draw on another Bible programme. But in general I can do 80% of what I need with the Mac programme. This is of course based on the fact that I don't use the note taking feature and a few other bits in the Windows one anyhow.

The good news is that things are hopefully only going to continue to improve from here on out. Logos for Mac has been out for nearly a year now and has gone through a couple of updates. A lot of us are hoping that the next major release really begins to close the gap on the Windows version.

 

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J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 9:20 AM

I agree with Donovan.  

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 9:47 AM

Mark, I think I can state with almost absolute certainty that the Mac version will always lag behind, if not be inferior to, the PC version. The program will continue to be designed for the Windows environment and ports to Mac will be a secondary consideration. Macs still only represent 10% of all personal computer sales.

If your primary reason for upgrading your machine is to run Logos better, there's no question that you should go with a PC. If your primary reason for upgrading is customer service for your machine, right now, Mac is king.

I've not considered a Mac, for lots of reasons, but one important one is Logos. While it can be run through an emulator, emulators are not the same as the real thing. And if you're not running through an emulator, see what I wrote about the Mac version above.

Basic advice for anyone buying a computer has always been this: choose your software, then choose your hardware to run it; or decide what you want to do with your computer, then decide which computer meets that need best.

You want to primarily run Logos and MSWord. Both are designed to run in Windows and ported to Mac. Seems to me, you're not primarily running software designed 'from the ground up' for Mac. Save yourself some money, do a little homework and get a good PC (HP and Dell are rated at the top by Consumer Reports these days).

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 10:18 AM

Richard DeRuiter:
Mark, I think I can state with almost absolute certainty that the Mac version will always lag behind, if not be inferior to, the PC version. The program will continue to be designed for the Windows environment and ports to Mac will be a secondary consideration. Macs still only represent 10% of all personal computer sales.
Richard, I can state with ABSOLUTE certainty that you are incorrect.  The windows version is not being (nor has it been) ported to Mac.  The program is written from the ground up and it will have parity with the Windows version.  

That is all I am at liberty to say for now Wink

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

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David Mitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 11:07 AM

Richard DeRuiter:

Mark, I think I can state with almost absolute certainty that the Mac version will always lag behind, if not be inferior to, the PC version.

While it may be technically accurate to say, "the Mac version will always lag behind," it's more important to consider the time frame involved in this lag. A few months? A few weeks? A few hours?

I can state with absolute certainty (no almost about it!) that the Mac version is catching up with the Windows version, and it is doing so quickly. We've released a number of new features in the past year, and even bigger updates are in the pipeline.

Our Mac team has seen considerable growth over the last year, putting us in a much better position to keep pace with our Windows product. The Macintosh is and will continue to be an important platform to us.

Pick whichever platform you like best, be it Macintosh or Windows. Our mission is to provide the best Bible study experience, no matter which device you're using.

David Mitchell
Development Lead
Faithlife

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 11:17 AM

Joe Miller:
The windows version is not being (nor has it been) ported to Mac.

Perhaps 'ported' is the wrong technical term. What I meant to say is that the Logos program design and development is for Windows. After the Windows version is written/established, a Mac version is written. The Mac version will eventually do what the PC version will do, but normally this will be after the program design is solidified in Windows.This is what I mean by 'lag behind.' Logos may choose to release future updates to it's program and modules simultaneously for Windows and Mac, but they haven't so far.

You may have reason to be more confident than I am in how this will work and how quickly. And the Mac OS and the Windows OS, despite what's 'under the hood,' are becoming more and more similar all the time. On the other hand MS and Apple are competitors that seem to want to maintain their distinctiveness.Parity may be harder (or easier) to achieve in the future.

But let me say this one more time: if you are considering an Apple because it can now run programs that run in Windows, why not just buy a PC? PC's cost less for the same hardware spec's and are less costly to upgrade.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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RichGrif | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 11:34 AM

I have both versions as do many others contributing to this Forum.  I rarely use the Mac version because as it turns out the many features it is missing are the ones I cannot live without.  Several others have posted in the past that the missing features are not a big issue to them.  So, I think you have two issues to pursue.  First, how important are those missing features to you.  Second, take a guess as to the timing of future upgrades to the Mac product.  I do not believe Logos has been much help in revealing what specific improvements we can expect and when.  For sure, the Mac version will eventually have the missing items although for one I would have expected more development to have occurred by now.

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J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 12:09 PM

Richard DeRuiter:
Perhaps 'ported' is the wrong technical term.
Not "perhaps"... it is the wrong term.

Richard DeRuiter:
What I meant to say is that the Logos program design and development is for Windows
That also is incorrect.  Please see the comment above from one of the Mac developers.  

Richard DeRuiter:
You may have reason to be more confident than I am in how this will work and how quickly.
I do, and that is why I know your post is incorrect and misleading.  You can still change words to refine it, but fundamentally your primary assertion is incorrect.

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

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Mark Stevens | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 1:33 PM

David that is very good to know so thank you for clarifying!

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 1:36 PM

Joe Miller:
Richard DeRuiter:
What I meant to say is that the Logos program design and development is for Windows
That also is incorrect.  Please see the comment above from one of the Mac developers.

I don't really want to debate this any further, so let me try to succinctly restate what I intended to communicate. The developer said that the Mac version is "catching up with" and is positioning itself "to keep pace with" Logos for Windows. That seems to affirm my belief that the Windows version is the standard that the Mac version tries to duplicate.They probably are doing so in very well -- Logos (the company) would have it no other way.

So, to my way of thinking, this settles the question of whether to go Mac or PC, if using Logos is the deciding factor in buying a new computer.I give this advice for two reasons: 1) Logos usage benefits from faster, bigger, better, and more computing power. Comparing spec's to spec's PC's are less expensive to buy and to upgrade. 2) Logos' Windows version is the standard that the Mac version duplicates. So the Mac version will probably always be behind playing catch up and keeping pace with the Windows program. It's likely that by being behind, updates/upgrades will be released in the Windows version first.

There are lots of good reasons to consider a Mac over a PC, which Mark is probably also taking into consideration. But if the deciding factor is Logos, my advice without hesitation, is to go PC. I don't have any problem with you or Mark disagreeing with my advice. My kids do it all the time and I still love them the same. But Mark asked for advice and I gave it.

(BTW, I didn't know the term 'port' was such a sensitive term for Mac users.)

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 1:48 PM

Joe Miller:

Richard DeRuiter:
Mark, I think I can state with almost absolute certainty that the Mac version will always lag behind, if not be inferior to, the PC version. The program will continue to be designed for the Windows environment and ports to Mac will be a secondary consideration. Macs still only represent 10% of all personal computer sales.
Richard, I can state with ABSOLUTE certainty that you are incorrect.  The windows version is not being (nor has it been) ported to Mac.  The program is written from the ground up and it will have parity with the Windows version.  

That is all I am at liberty to say for now Wink

Well in response to a bout of frustration I did hear that the new version being developed for the mac will be more in line with the Windows version. Lectionary addin and notes/hi-lites are all i really miss. I doubt they will ever be identical but all in all the mac version is great, except i wish i could use my oxford commentary but since it is an old logos file they are not allowed to update I am ok without it. I just hope the new beta starts soon. I can hardly  wait to use some more features.That said if those 3 items are not ion I will run it under windows when i get a macbook....but then that will be several months off.

-Dan

Posts 439
Mark Stevens | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 1:49 PM

Joe, it was interesting to read this. Thank you very much for posting this. I had no idea it was built from teh ground up. It has encouraged me to strongly consider staying MAc!

Posts 232
Charles | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 2:16 PM

Hi Mark:

Stick with Mac.  There are other reasons for not "devolving" back to the world of the PC.  I just loaded Win 7 on our MacBook in dual boot fashion using Boot Camp.  After working with the Mac for the past two years I forgot about malware, spyware, virus infections, and what a headache it was dealing with Microsoft.  Win 7 has brought those memories back.  Don't know how long I'll keep it on the MacBook... 

I primarily (like most others) use Logos for sermon preparation and Bible study.  That and MS Office 2008 for Mac get the most usage.  Logos Mac works great as far as I'm concerned, does all that I need it to do.  The old Logos Library system got me through seminary years ago, so I'm a great fan of Logos and have the utmost confidence in their future development of the Mac version.

In Christ, Charles

 

2017 27" iMac 5K, Mojave, 10.5" iPad Pro, iPhone 7+, iPhone 8, iOS 12.0, Catalina beta, iPadOS Beta  

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Ross Strader | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 3:01 PM

Actually... MS Office is a better program on Mac than on PC... I'm just saying - it is.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 5:52 PM

MarkStevens:

Joe, it was interesting to read this. Thank you very much for posting this. I had no idea it was built from teh ground up. It has encouraged me to strongly consider staying MAc!

Mark

I would most definitely stick with the Mac for all the reasons Joe and Donavan stated so well. Also, the comment by Charles is well worth consideration. I use Windows for one critical application that is not available on the Mac, and I would have no inclination to switch down.

Jack

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Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 6:47 PM

holy moley. 

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

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spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Oct 29 2009 6:50 PM

RossStrader:

Actually... MS Office is a better program on Mac than on PC... I'm just saying - it is.

I'll take your word for it since I haven't messed with Mac Office too much. However, I am very excited about the 2010 PC version coming out.

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Oct 30 2009 8:35 AM

Ross,

I prefer Office for PC. Office for Mac loads quite slow (MS can't benefit by building components into the OS) and still doesn't work as well with Spaces as I'd like. Plus I like the ribbon on the PC version and while the toolbox is nice, the ribbon it ain't.

These days I've stopped using Office at all and use iWork. It lacks a few things present in Office but it works quick and suits my needs.

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