Announcing Evangelical Exegetical Commentary Payment Plans

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Posts 97
Al | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 2:34 PM

I'm with David and the others. I've subscribed, but I'm very wary about a series that I basically know nothing about.

I'm a strong supporter of Logos, but not being an evangelical - at least in the usual definition in these forums - I'm leaning towards canceling, even with the attractive offer of the payment plans,.

Posts 9946
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 4:02 PM

Jayson Bradley:

Announcing Evangelical Exegetical Commentary Payment Plans

Let us know what you think of our special EEC payment plans.

The plans are fine, but I have no idea what kind of commentary this is to be.  Some indication of its layout, etc would be helpful.  E.g., does it intend to deal with the original language?  For what audience is it intended?  Without some idea of its nature other than that stated on the product page (hype), I wouldn't be interested.  It's buying a pig in a poke.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 120
Steve Robinson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 4:10 PM

Dan -

THANK YOU!!! (...for being responsive to some of the concerns and requests that were made in other previous posts regarding the cost of the EEC.)

While it makes the decision a little more difficult for me now that there are more affordable payment plan options, between this action and the opportunity to change my mind after seeing samples of the work before it's published and my credit card is charged, I don't know more what I could (or would) ask on a project like this.

Thanks, again and enjoy the day!

Very sincerely,

Steve R.

Posts 102
Donn Heinrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 4:10 PM

Any chance we can have a sample chapter or section before the prepub price goes up?

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Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 4:22 PM

I know a large number of the contributors. I have been excited about this commentary series since the beginning. Barrick's Genesis commentary is incentive enough for me to jump in. I've been in since the very beginning and am cancelling my original order and replacing it with the 12 month financing. Thanks, Logos, for being willing to spread that out.

I'm grateful that such a series is being made

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

Posts 5250
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 4:26 PM

I am going for it. I am not worried as Logos has great customer service. If after seeing the first volume it is clearly not for me I think there is likely not going to be any issue getting a refund. I would like to see 2 volumes before making that decision but I am happy to judge basing on the one volume if that is all I can do.

-Dan

Posts 3663
Floyd Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 5:35 PM

Dan Francis:

I am going for it. I am not worried as Logos has great customer service. If after seeing the first volume it is clearly not for me I think there is likely not going to be any issue getting a refund. I would like to see 2 volumes before making that decision but I am happy to judge basing on the one volume if that is all I can do.

-Dan

I was going to say this - but you beat me to it.  This way I have locked in the price but can return within 30 days.

 

Blessings,
Floyd

Pastor-Patrick.blogspot.com

Posts 1355
Edwin Bowden | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 5:58 PM

A couple of previous posts express some of my concerns (which have been posted several times on the forum after the initial announcement of the series).

Joe:

Overall, I'm excited about the series and will buy it sometime...but here are some of my humble thoughts that come to mind....

1.  It would be nice to be able to see the first volume in June in it's completed form first and still be able to opt-in to a plan after it is released.

2.  Since the entire set won't be done until 2019.... There are only two volumes that will be released in 2011 and three in 2012, so in 2 years, we'll only have 5 of the 44 volumes.

4.  Cancellation / refund?  What's that policy going to be?  With the last release date of Oct 2017 (6.5 years from now) a lot can happen.

Dollar-wise, it seems that I have a choice: for a $50 savings ($750 over $700) invest now or wait and invest my dollars elsewhere until more than a few volumes are released.  Maybe if it were even cheaper (i.e. $499) and the difference were greater then I'd be more apt to put my dollars down early.

Confused

Another post:

How long will that $749.95 price be good for? E.g., what if I opt out and decide in 3 years after some volumes have been released and commented on by users re: value/usefulness, etc., to buy the set? E.g., can I get it in 2015 for $749.95? I might be willing to pay an extra $50 just to be able see if it's something I'll want, rather than have to pay $700 or $750 now sight-unseen.

Also: If we see a preview volume before June 1, and decide - Nope, I don't need/want this - when is the last date to cancel one's purchase? IIRC, we were told we'd see a preview or preview volume before being charged for the set so we could better make up our minds.

 

I was in Christian publishing for over 20 years. I know that a lot can (and does) go wrong on a project of this magnitude. I noticed that 10 volumes (almost one-fourth of the set) don't even have estimated publication dates.

Many requests have been made for more info about the style, content, approach, target audience, etc. Logos has not responded.

If the first volume is going to be ready in June, there should be sufficient material available now to give us a preview.

It seems like Logos is trying to get customers to buy in hopes of saving about $1 per volume by commiting to the set completely sight unseen. I will be well into my seventies by the time the series is finished (if I'm lucky), but Logos will have my money well before then.

I would have never been able to sell this kind of deal to any book buyer--whether a store buyer or a retail customer.

I have confidence in the intentions of Logos. I don't have a lot of confidence that they understand what they're getting into. From the press release, the reason that it is now a Logos project is because an experienced publisher bailed out on the project. 

Logos doesn't have any experience with this kind of project. No one has ever done anything like this before.

I just went back and reread the forum posts from 7 months ago about the EEC.

The only question that has been answered by Logos since then is providing a payment plan. We still don't have any more info about the actual material than we did then.

The new question since then:  How many other publication dates on this series are going to slide?

Until more questions are answered, I'm going to be on the sidelines.

Posts 102
Donn Heinrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 6:48 PM

I don't really understand the benefit for Logos to sell these 44 volumes for $16/volume when the "retail" value is $50/volume. Maybe Logos should break up the set and make a bigger profit. Just a thought.

Posts 54
(na) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 7:17 PM

From what I've read, I really do like what I see. It's just a shame that they're asking for so much up front. From the perspective of a student and techno-lover like me who appreciates what Logos are trying to do, I just have a few qualms.

1)I wish there was the option to get the $699 price, volume by volume as each are released. I would have no problems setting up a direct debit or something to avoid credit card fees on their end.

2)If I did pay $700 for this, only for it to become part of a base package and upgrade costing half the price with two hundred other books... well, I'd be furious!

3)As others have said, preview material would be great. While we're not charged at the minute, we are still being given a discount for a bit of a leap of faith.

I may still preorder it, even though I don't really have the intention of actually keeping my preorder at the minute. I would still like the option, though. Would there be a student discount on this?

 

Edit: Preordered it, but there's no option of a payment plan. Will delete and re-preorder when I can get the 12-month plan.

Posts 1
Sir Rick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 7:58 PM

CAUTION:

SCAM would be an interesting word if another business asked for me to send them $700 for a product that 1) does not exist, 2) will not exist for possibly the next 10 years, 3) and they will only charge me $300 if I wish to finance it over 3 years.

While I realize we are Christians, there are some basic "check's and balances" that need to be in place.  Therefore, Please USE EXTREME CAUTION.

(If Logos is reading this, I realize you need the money to fund this project, but to ask ministers/Christian leaders to "invest" in a program in advance is financially wreckless!! I question the legality/ethics of a program where you such a financial scheme is made. I would not put up with this type scheme in the "world", and I highly object to this in the Christian world. I feel that Logos is greatly taking advantage of Chrisian's trust. Do you honestly think that Thomas Nelson/Word/any other print publisher would even think of such a scheme? NO!!

Please rethink this type of offer!)

I realize this is harsh, but I have been around several times where large projects are started and require upfront promises/trust. This is close to a 10 year project.

I could add much more, but I'll end with three words:
USE EXTREME CAUTION!

Posts 54
(na) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 8:09 PM

While visually loud, your criticism is appreciated.

I was looking at the page again - how can they have a "savings off the retail price" if it's never going to hit retail in its present form, only in a cheaper abridged form? Also, I honestly believe that the pre-pub price should be far more aggressive; especially considering the high likelyhood of this set being included in a future base package.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 8:33 PM

Sir Rick:
Please rethink this type of offer!)

Welcome to the forums Sir Rick.

This is a case where I would consider my investment to be more like venture capital than like a scam. The terms are laid out without deception - it remains the responsibility of the investor to determine if the deal works for them.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 386
MJD | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 8:37 PM

This is a very BOLD post, but I do believe you have some merit in your post. However, the word scam is a bit harsh... but I can understand your perspective.

 

Mike

 

Sir Rick:

CAUTION:

SCAM would be an interesting word if another business asked for me to send them $700 for a product that 1) does not exist, 2) will not exist for possibly the next 10 years, 3) and they will only charge me $300 if I wish to finance it over 3 years.

While I realize we are Christians, there are some basic "check's and balances" that need to be in place.  Therefore, Please USE EXTREME CAUTION.

(If Logos is reading this, I realize you need the money to fund this project, but to ask ministers/Christian leaders to "invest" in a program in advance is financially wreckless!! I question the legality/ethics of a program where you such a financial scheme is made. I would not put up with this type scheme in the "world", and I highly object to this in the Christian world. I feel that Logos is greatly taking advantage of Chrisian's trust. Do you honestly think that Thomas Nelson/Word/any other print publisher would even think of such a scheme? NO!!

Please rethink this type of offer!)

I realize this is harsh, but I have been around several times where large projects are started and require upfront promises/trust. This is close to a 10 year project.

I could add much more, but I'll end with three words:
USE EXTREME CAUTION!

 

Posts 118
Nicholas van Oudtshoorn | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 9:56 PM

I'm with MJ - this is more a "venture capital" thing... Having said that, a preview would have been nice... (But, then again it hasn't stopped me putting in a pre-order!)

Posts 118
Nicholas van Oudtshoorn | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 10:00 PM

Brilliant!

Just a question - will it be available on biblia? (I use Linux, and prefer not to boot up a Windows machine to see my resources).

I'm a bit confused, because the EEC page at logos doesn't bear the usual iOS icon, but the press release says it *will* be available on biblia....

Posts 9946
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 15 2011 10:01 PM

Nicholas van Oudtshoorn:

I'm with MJ - this is more a "venture capital" thing... Having said that, a preview would have been nice... (But, then again it hasn't stopped me putting in a pre-order!)

I would likewise view it as venture capital if I decided to get it.  The problem is that there are all sorts of commentaries.  I wouldn't care to buy a commentary set and find out that it's something like Harry Ironside.  If it doesn't deal with the original languages and isn't more academic, I'm not interested.  I'm still thinking about that one.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 16 2011 4:40 AM

Thomas Yassine Bourega:
especially considering the high likelyhood of this set being included in a future base package.

That is extremely doubtful. Hermenia, WBC, NICOT/NT have never be part of any base package. Why would you think this one would be?

Posts 10554
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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 16 2011 4:44 AM

George Somsel:
I'm still thinking about that one.

Since I already know how you feel about Dispensationalism, you might want to consider this thread http://community.logos.com/forums/t/31098.aspx

Posts 54
(na) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 16 2011 4:47 AM

Because Logos own it, they would only be negotiating a deal with themselves, and that if it turns out as good as it looks like it's going to be, it would be a great incentive if it was added to a higher base package?

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