L3 and L4

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Mark | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Nov 2 2009 11:56 AM

My computer is running out of space as I download this monster.  That brings me to my question:

Why do we still have L3 in addition to L4?  Is there a reason to keep L3 before and/or after installation of L4?

Once we switch to L4, how do we install or transfer L4 on a new computer (I plan to purchase a new computer soon)?

Posts 2753
DominicM | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 11:58 AM

mark, see http://community.logos.com/forums/t/3193.aspx second post for your how to guide without requiring a total re-download, only updates will be required.

if your not gonna miss anything on this list http://www.logos.com/4/missingfeatures I see no reason to leave v3 on your machine, you will be able to remove v3 resources as well once L4 is fully installed, they go in the install directory in L4

Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:01 PM

Mark

V4 doesn't need v3 for anything. you can dump it unless there is something that it does that you cannot live without...

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 726
Chris Elford | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:02 PM

MarkSwaim:

My computer is running out of space as I download this monster.  That brings me to my question:

Why do we still have L3 in addition to L4?  Is there a reason to keep L3 before and/or after installation of L4?

Once we switch to L4, how do we install or transfer L4 on a new computer (I plan to purchase a new computer soon)?

Mark,

Yes, you still have L3. L4 installs separately and updates resouces to benefit from its power/features. L3 is likely still useful for a while until all the development features are implemented in L4 See: http://www.logos.com/4/missingfeatures for a list of what and when. If you don't use any of those, you could delete L3 and its resouces.

When you get a new computer, you install the L4 engine from the website (the link is posted in several threads here) and then login to your account and everything will be installed from Logos' server. They keep everything current there (licenses and resources) and you get to download what you own. Because it is all done through the Internet, you can have it on several of your machines then the synchronization process keeps the customizations you do the same on all computers.

Chris

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:03 PM

MarkSwaim:

My computer is running out of space as I download this monster.  That brings me to my question:

Why do we still have L3 in addition to L4?  Is there a reason to keep L3 before and/or after installation of L4?

Once we switch to L4, how do we install or transfer L4 on a new computer (I plan to purchase a new computer soon)?

Yes, L4 will duplicate all your L3 resources into its own folder.

There are a few reasons to retain L3 yet. If you have the sermon addin, you won't be able to add any sermons until sometime in 2010, when that functionality is added. If you have extensive notes, they will have to be transferred sometime soon to L4, but we don't know how that will work (if it requires a new export function from L3, you'd be out of luck). If you require an PBB's for your regular work, those won't be available to L4 for a while yet either. Finally, if you need smart tags, or automate copy/paste of Bible verses, that functionality is not available in L4 (at least not yet).

Once L4 installs and copies resources to it's folder, you could add the L4 folder to L3's resource path, have it scan, then delete duplicates, or at least files you don't need in L3 to save some disk space.

Transferring to a new computer will be a breeze with L4. Just download the program and log in to your user account. Everything will download automatically. And by everything I mean all your resources, any document or collection you created with your old computer, and a few other things as well. Very cool!

 

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 1777
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:04 PM

For better or worse, Logos is designed for today's massive hard drives.  In the end, I think it is worth it.

1) Why keep L3?

a)  There are some features which have not been converted over yet

b)  L4 should find your L3 installation and copy over up to date resources, which should mitigate a bit of your DL time

2) Transfer L4?

a) All you have to do is run the short installation exe file.  Logos 4 will DL the rest.  You do not need to hunt down your DVD's and CD's

b) If you want to be fancy, you can fool it by puting a copy of resources on a removeable drive, interrupting the installation and finally telling Logos 4 to scan the removeable drive so you don't have to DL everything again, but this is getting into power user stuff no one NEEDS to do.  The above will work, assuming your internet connection will let you.

 

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:04 PM

MarkSwaim:
Why do we still have L3 in addition to L4? 

You can remove L3, but whether you want to or not depends on what you have used it for in the past. For instance, if you are a fan of smart tags, they currently only work with three. If you use verse lists, or the prayer add-in, you might want to hang in there as well. I'm not sure about smart tags but the rest will be added in the upcoming months. However even if you do keep three, I imagine you may be able to remove all but the Bible's you use for verse lists, for example. that could free up some room.

I have been a beta tester and the only things I now use 3 for are prayer lists and smart tags. the prayer lists I need to move away from now as I have excel reading the XML file it creates, which I'm sure won't be the same precedure in 4 when it is implemented. For what I do with smart tags, I can't replace the function, so I'm hangin on to 3 for now. However I may delete all the resource except a couple translations.

MarkSwaim:
Once we switch to L4, how do we install or transfer L4 on a new computer (I plan to purchase a new computer soon)?

run the installer for L4. Sign in with your username. Logos will determine what you need and send it your way :-)

Posts 726
Chris Elford | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:10 PM

What you see here is a case of beta testers fighting each other to answer questions!

The answer sounds different, but it really is the same. Smile

Chris

Posts 2126
Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 12:59 PM

Richard DeRuiter:
L4 will duplicate all your L3 resources into its own folder.

Thanks everyone for the help.  Another question.  What if I did a clean install of L4 on a new computer...will ALL my resources minus PBB be downloaded from Logos' servers (old E4 files, Galaxie file and files from other companies whose resources I own)?

 

If I install L4 on my computer which contains L3, Rich, you indicate that all resources I have will be duplicated.  Does that mean in the future they are stored in some kind of cloud bearing my name so I dont have to worry about losing resources?

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Bob Pritchett | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 1:11 PM

MarkSwaim:
What if I did a clean install of L4 on a new computer...will ALL my resources minus PBB be downloaded from Logos' servers (old E4 files, Galaxie file and files from other companies whose resources I own)?

Our resource server should have (almost) every book in existence on it, including those produced by our partners.

Posts 1777
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 1:15 PM

MarkSwaim:

Thanks everyone for the help.  Another question.  What if I did a clean install of L4 on a new computer...will ALL my resources minus PBB be downloaded from Logos' servers (old E4 files, Galaxie file and files from other companies whose resources I own)?

Logos says that is the goal.  Logos 4 will find the file and send it your way as long as Logos (the company) has permission to do so, and they seem to have the permission to do so for just about everything.

MarkSwaim:

If I install L4 on my computer which contains L3, Rich, you indicate that all resources I have will be duplicated.  Does that mean in the future they are stored in some kind of cloud bearing my name so I dont have to worry about losing resources?

Your license has been on the cloud since at least synchronize licenses came out in LDLS 3.0.  Now Logos 4 will take that license and make sure you have the most recent version of all your resources, unless you tell L4 to hide a resource you do not wish to use.

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

Posts 2744
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 2 2009 1:23 PM

MarkSwaim:
Does that mean in the future they are stored in some kind of cloud bearing my name so I dont have to worry about losing resources?

We have resources on our hard drives but Logos is taking care of us having the right versions of the resources. So Logos maintains your library, however you have it on the drive to be able to access your library while being off line. Good stuff.

Bohuslav

Posts 2126
Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 9:43 AM

Bob Pritchett:
Our resource server should have (almost) every book in existence on it, including those produced by our partners.

Ok.  L4 has basically crashed my Thinkpad presumably due to lack of space.  The indexing caused an error and stopped working and I kept having problems with the updating causing my computer to go into the famous forever sleep mode for which it never wakes up (I think this is caused by overheating due to indexing as one website suggested).

I have thus uninstalled L4 because now I am worried about losing data on my laptop. It looks as if eventually I need to reformat the harddrive and start from scratch, a long process to get back up into working mode.  If I had known that L4 was going to be such a major change and require so much redownload and time, I would have done this at a more convenient time, and after I had secured everything on my computer.  I am not aware of any place on the website that makes it clear, what is required...and if it is there, I would suggest a very easily seeable advert that all can find and see to know exactly what will happen when this upgrade starts.

Now my questions:

1.  If I save the L4 folder onto an external Harddrive, would it be possible to put it back where I found it after a reformat of the computer and then run the L4 updater...would it save me time in downloading all the resources or at least the ones that were downloaded?

2.  If I install L4 on a new computer that does not contain my L3, would I get my entire library (minus PBB) after the installation is finished?

3.  What about favorites we have in L3?  Will they show up in L4?  Or do we have to start a new Favorites list?  

 

I think that is all for now

Logos, I have heard great things about L4 and am looking forward to it.  But I think there should be very clear instructions in a place easy to find (such as the beginning of the install with an option to cancel to do later if we realize this is not something we want to deal with right now and also to make sure we have space on the computer to actually do this install) would be helpful and save alot of questions and phone calls, frustration etc.  I suspect many of the crashes that have happened to others is due to the two issues I have had...not enough space or memory, or a hot machine.

Mark

Posts 8660
TCBlack | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 9:52 AM

Bob Pritchett:
Our resource server should have (almost) every book in existence on it, including those produced by our partners.

I only ask because it's the most obscure resource I own....

Does it have the atlas model railroad stuff?

Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 10:15 AM

MarkSwaim:
Ok.  L4 has basically crashed my Thinkpad presumably due to lack of space.

According to http://www.logos.com/support/faq Logos4 needs at least 12GB of free space to install. Do you have that?

MarkSwaim:
1.  If I save the L4 folder onto an external Harddrive, would it be possible to put it back where I found it after a reformat of the computer and then run the L4 updater...would it save me time in downloading all the resources or at least the ones that were downloaded?

I don't know if anyone has tried it yet. It's possible, but the way indexing works, it might not give reliable results. A L4 programmer would have to answer that question.

MarkSwaim:
2.  If I install L4 on a new computer that does not contain my L3, would I get my entire library (minus PBB) after the installation is finished?

Yes. L4 phones home, discovers your licenses and downloads all your resources for you. (Very cool!)

MarkSwaim:
What about favorites we have in L3?  Will they show up in L4?  Or do we have to start a new Favorites list?  

Favorites are not carried over. If you want a favorites list in L4, you'll have to create one from scratch. I never worked with favorites, so it's possible there are some ways to make the transition less painful.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 2126
Mark | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 3:34 PM

Thanks Rich.  I guess I fell 2 GB short of the free space needed to install.  I wish the program would have told me that before I continued installing.  Now I have a messed up computer

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:07 PM

MarkSwaim:
 I wish the program would have told me that before I continued installing.

Yeah, I know. I've gotten into the habit of always looking for system spec's before an install, but programmers shouldn't expect that of end-users.

MarkSwaim:
 Now I have a messed up compute

I couldn't tell you how to fix it, but it should be fixable with certain hard drive utilities, maybe even Windows own CHKDSK. You never know, sometimes a couple hours invested in fixing it, could save 10's of hours reinstalling data and programs. Some computer repair places can do this for you, a few will even do it over the phone (for a fee, of course, and you have to give them temporary control over your computer).

Sorry this happened to you. I wish there was a quick fix.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 29
Matt Rees | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:20 PM

Kenneth McGuire:
The above will work, assuming your internet connection will let you.

 

This could be the sticking point: I know of missionaries who've chosen a laptop and software as a more portable solution than paper books, some of these may not have the kind of access that allows for 12GB downloads.

 

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 3 2009 4:26 PM

Matt Rees:
This could be the sticking point: I know of missionaries who've chosen a laptop and software as a more portable solution than paper books, some of these may not have the kind of access that allows for 12GB downloads.

The download isn't 12GB. The installation requires 12GB of free space.

As a former missionary, I'm aware of some of the problems. Many may want to stay with L3 until they can get their systems replaced. But missionaries are used to making do with what they have, and being behind the shifts in technology and culture from their home countries. Often, it's not even a big deal to them. Thankfully, L3 is going to be around for a long time yet, and will always work, as long as there's an OS to run it. So, while something might not be gained, nothing is actually lost.

I hope I'm not sounding dismissive, just trying to bring some perspective.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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