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This post has 145 Replies | 9 Followers

Posts 287
Jerry Walker | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 9:11 AM

Some of the things that were promised in v3 were pronunciation, notes, and highlighting and others. Those things were promised in v3 for Mac and we never received them AT ALL!!!! Now are these features going to be or in v4 for Mac?

Posts 4
Bryan Heller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 9:14 AM

Does anyone know how to access the resources from the new V4 Alpha release for use in Logos 3 Mac (v 1.2.2) ?  I want to use some of the new books in the old version of Logos Mac. It appears that most of them have a new file extension of (.logos4).  I am not sure if there is a way to transfer those resources to my old resource folder and have V 1.2.2 recognize them.  If not, I will just patiently wait for Logos 4 Mac to push toward Beta stability and then the official release.

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 9:17 AM

Jerry,

The features you list will be present in version 4. I do not know if pronunciation will require additional resources to work, but notes and highlighting will work for everyone that uses the Logos 4 engine for Mac.

But where were we promised that all of these features would someday be present in the Libronix 1 engine? The promise was that the feature set would catch up when Logos released the future version for Mac that matched the future version for Windows. That is happening now.

Bryan,

At present at least it seems the books formatted for Logos 4 cannot be opened in older versions. I haven't seen anything saying whether or not Logos plans to release an update to Libronix 3 for pc or 1 for Mac enabling them to open the new book format, we will just have to wait and see.

Posts 287
Jerry Walker | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 9:21 AM

Thanks Chris!!!! What part of the Country do you live? (were do you live)?

Posts 838
Dewayne Davis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 9:24 AM

Chris Roberts:

 

Mac users are not going to suddenly get favored treatment and receive lots of free stuff everyone else has to pay for.

As a Mac user I am not expecting favored treatment and lots of free stuff that PC users pay for. In fact, as Mac users, we paid for what PC users never had to, knowingly and willingly. I have used a PC for years, long before series X was even started, and all version changes were free until I switched to Mac. And I was happy to do it. But... I must admit that I had expected that eventually that investment would have brought forth more features than it did, probably because I read more into Logos comments than were promised. You know how it is when you tell a child that it would be cool to go fishing on Saturday, and if you don't do it, they feel like you let them down... But if I had to do it over again, I would, because I think that had I and others not invested, it would have become vaporware that never moved forward.

“... every day in which I do not penetrate more deeply into the knowledge of God’s Word in Holy Scripture is a lost day for me. I can only move forward with certainty upon the firm ground of the Word of God.”

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 10:32 AM

Br. Raymond Minot:
The promise was when the software was purchased. Well, the discussions leading up to it. And, perhaps also what was available on the web. These features are available in the Windows version. From what I can tell by the Windows installation I did, it's version 3.0e and you can find Biblical People under Tools->Bible Data-> Biblical People. 
I think this is a very legitimate complaint.

Granted, some of the details may be incorrect, but the complaint is real. 

Those of us who purchased Mac 1.0 were led to believe this version would be brought up to speed with Windows 3.0.  Now, development is in Alpha for the L4mac version which means this is going to replace development for mac1.0.  So, it seems that people have already paid once for a Mac version and asking them to pay another &70 for the "new" engine is not right when the promise was never fuflilled (and I assume never will be) that Mac 1.0 will reach parity with Win 3.0 version.

The water is mirky here, so let me ask, am I stating this fairly? 

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 14
Br. Raymond Minot | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 10:47 AM

Joe, you're right on! Exactly. At long last, I've succeeded in being clear about what the issue is. Thank you for understanding.

As Chris pointed out, I too have difficulty with so many people not understanding the limited functionality of the Mac 1.2.2. There were no misleading details about how limited it was. And, in response to Chris, I have no desire to obtain something for free... just looking to get what I paid for.

Plus, I think it is important to be clear that any further development (so far as I can see) on v.1.2.2 is pointless. From all that I've been able to understand, Logos has poured its limited Mac resources into getting Logos 4 out... that's happening. It certainly doesn't seem feasible that they can also make updates to 1.2.2 at the same time.

So now Joe... if I remember, you're in some testing group right? Does this mean you've got some "inside" pull regardless how small? If so, do you think it's possible to funnel this issue where it needs to go? Then again, perhaps you're already doing so!

God bless!

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 11:37 AM

Joe Miller:
Now, development is in Alpha for the L4mac version which means this is going to replace development for mac1.0.  So, it seems that people have already paid once for a Mac version and asking them to pay another &70 for the "new" engine is not right when the promise was never fuflilled (and I assume never will be) that Mac 1.0 will reach parity with Win 3.0 version.

So, are these true statements?

I guess that was the crux of what I was asking...are these "fears of what may happen" or did Logos say; "..we are abandoning Mac v1 and Mac v4 is going to replace it"

 

?

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 8
Wes Porter | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 11:54 AM

Joe Miller:

Br. Raymond Minot:
The promise was when the software was purchased. Well, the discussions leading up to it. And, perhaps also what was available on the web. These features are available in the Windows version. From what I can tell by the Windows installation I did, it's version 3.0e and you can find Biblical People under Tools->Bible Data-> Biblical People. 
I think this is a very legitimate complaint.

Granted, some of the details may be incorrect, but the complaint is real. 

Those of us who purchased Mac 1.0 were led to believe this version would be brought up to speed with Windows 3.0.  Now, development is in Alpha for the L4mac version which means this is going to replace development for mac1.0.  So, it seems that people have already paid once for a Mac version and asking them to pay another &70 for the "new" engine is not right when the promise was never fuflilled (and I assume never will be) that Mac 1.0 will reach parity with Win 3.0 version.

The water is mirky here, so let me ask, am I stating this fairly? 

I should have had a v8. This is my original complaint! You articulated it much better, but this is it.

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 12:22 PM

Robert, 

I think my summary is accurate, but I am willing to be persuaded by Logos that I have misunderstood something.

We,

Yep... we are on the same page.  Like I said above, if we are wrong, it would be nice to get an official correction rather than let the confusion fester.

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 12:42 PM

It would be nice if someone would clarify this...it's a widely held understanding as far as I can see..

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 1
Matthew Barefoot | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 12:48 PM

Yeah try this one out:

A few months ago I was at a conference and I discussed Logos for Mac 1.2 with a sales representative.  He guaranteed me that in a few short months my Mac version would equal that of the Windows 3 version.  So I have been patiently waiting for the updates to make the Mac version work the same way the windows version already works.

Imagine my surprise when I find out that my Mac version will never equal that of the windows version.  In fact there is a new Version 4 that is replacing both.  

I am excited about the new version but I pretty much feel like I got shafted since I paid a great deal of money for the Silver Library with the promise that the Mac version would be improved and now I find out I am out of luck.  I should not have to pay for another product because a good sales person would have told me "Wait it out a few months and get Version 4 for your Mac..."

This is false advertising at its best (or worst)...

MB

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 1:40 PM

Joseph, although we need to hear from Logos, I doubt there was any sinister intent to mislead just to make a sale.  Mistakes?  Yes.  But once Bob P has time to digest this news, I am confident he will make this right for you and all other users.  

I am disappointed, but hopeful brother :-)

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 1416
Wes Saad | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 3:58 PM

Joe Miller:
So, it seems that people have already paid once for a Mac version and asking them to pay another &70 for the "new" engine is not right when the promise was never fuflilled

To harp again on what I keep harping on, the price paid is not for the engine. The engine is free. You can use the version 4 engine, even after it is out of beta and the finished product is released, without paying a dime. However, some of the new features will not work without the associated resources. You will be paying for the resources, not the engine.

Biblical People is probably the only thing that was in v3 that will not work in v4 without paying something. The other things that will be missing if you do not pay for the new resources are things that were not in v3 anyway.

Posts 4
Todd Bowditch | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 4:03 PM

Hi Bob, I've been using it a little...it's def. still an alpha-version.  It shows a lot of promise.  It still crashes quite a bit, so I'm still using 1.2.2. most of the time.

Posts 222
Bob Turner | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 4:16 PM

doesn't work for me at all.  i've tried and it crashes constantly.

River of Life Church: http://LifeOverflowing.org

Visit my blog: http://LifeOverflowing.org/pastor

 

Posts 838
Dewayne Davis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 4:47 PM

Chris Roberts:

Biblical People is probably the only thing that was in v3 that will not work in v4 without paying something. The other things that will be missing if you do not pay for the new resources are things that were not in v3 anyway.

You know guys, this is a good point. When all is said and done, we will have a better product if it follows L4 as opposed to L3. We paid 70 bucks because we wanted a mac version. We are getting that. In fact, things are going so well for the project that those who are coming on board to the Mac version now won't even have to pay the 70. Now it is free. I'm thinking that our early support played a big factor in their decision to continue this direction.

“... every day in which I do not penetrate more deeply into the knowledge of God’s Word in Holy Scripture is a lost day for me. I can only move forward with certainty upon the firm ground of the Word of God.”

Posts 222
Bob Turner | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 4:56 PM

Dewayne Davis:
You know guys, this is a good point. When all is said and done, we will have a better product if it follows L4 as opposed to L3. We paid 70 bucks because we wanted a mac version. We are getting that. In fact, things are going so well for the project that those who are coming on board to the Mac version now won't even have to pay the 70. Now it is free. I'm thinking that our early support played a big factor in their decision to continue this direction.

 

yeah but lets not give away any Nobel Peace Prizes away until after we have seen all of this done first.  Smile

River of Life Church: http://LifeOverflowing.org

Visit my blog: http://LifeOverflowing.org/pastor

 

Posts 2778
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 5 2009 4:57 PM

Chris Roberts:
To harp again on what I keep harping on, the price paid is not for the engine. The engine is free. You can use the version 4 engine, even after it is out of beta and the finished product is released, without paying a dime.
Hi Chris, while that is true for Windows users, there is a unique situation here that Logos needs to address.  L1mac will never be a fully functioning piece of software like L3windows.  People paid to get the Mac engine that will not be finished.  That creates an odd circumstance then that is different from what the users of L3win to L4win will experience.  

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 14
Br. Raymond Minot | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 6 2009 12:28 AM

Chris,

To add to what Joe just said, he's right. Those of us who bought the original Mac version did so under the guise that it was going to be brought up to speed. This is NOT a simple situation of paying to receive the Mac engine; at least certainly not in my case. I bought this software instead of another because it ran on a Mac, as I'm sure many others did. So I did not pay $70, I paid hundreds... the same exact price that a Windows user paid, and did so because eventually it was supposed to work the same way.

That eventual time has now arrived with version 4. So, if you think about it, a Mac user has already paid for what version 4 is, just never had. Now, had the Mac version been cheaper, I would not say anything.

Putting in Windows terms... let's reverse the roles here. Image that Logos was essentially Mac based. You've never used it before because it didn't exist on Windows. Logos makes a Windows version, but it's not up to speed; it's limited. However, they promise that it will be. So you go ahead and make a $700 purchase (seven hundred). You wait patiently... finally the day arrives when you have a fully functional version... only you have to pay more to get it. Doesn't make sense.

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