Forum Guidelines: No Theology Debates

Page 12 of 19 (367 items) « First ... < Previous 10 11 12 13 14 Next > ... Last »
This post has 366 Replies | 8 Followers

Posts 26257
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 7:29 PM

Matthew C Jones:
If MJ has (already tagged resources) I would be very interested in getting that info.

I just used the figures shown on the Logos products pages.

 

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 386
MJD | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 7:42 PM

Lynden Williams:

MJD:

Lynden Williams:

Please users, lets not tie up the CEO's time with theological debates, let him focus on making the best Bible software better. 

"> Lynden why do some people feel the need to tell people how they should behave?  I don't think you need to take on the role of "mother hen"

 

No offense intended MJD. My wishes are in harmony with forum guidelines, and the passionate appeal of Bob P.

 

Lynden I didn't take offense, but thank you.  But, I feel like Bob can defend himself.  I get tired of all of the "kiss up" comments.  He is extremely bright, and he expresses himself very well in his posts.

Bob did make a mistake with a post, and many people took offense.  I understood what he was trying to say, so I just stood back and did not react immediately.  But, I must admit I tend to agree with some of the concerns.   The appointment of a Catholic Resource Manager stung some people a bit.  I know some felt like he was "selling out" from his core group, and he did it all for the sake of revenues.

However, I believe Bob is a solid "Christian man", he came back and apologized for his "jet lag" stage of mind and his flipped comments.  I do agree he gets to make the rules, that is obvious. But, many of us have made a BIG commitment to Logos and we deserve a level of mutual respect.  I for one have over $20,000 invested into Logos and I have strong interest in wanting/needing it to succeed.

In closing, I welcome all my fellow followers of Christ that are Catholics to Logos. However, I don't think there should be a special Catholic position, it just feels like we are separating them from us.

I want to follow Christ and not a denomination, are you with me?

 

Posts 297
Schezic | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 7:46 PM

MJD:
I want to follow Christ and not a denomination, are you with me?
I am...But that should be obvious. Thanks for the post.

Posts 2393
David Ames | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 7:47 PM

MJ. Smith Posted the current distribution of Logos resources – As always, thanks for the post.
I wonder, other than the slice we are in how many slices each of us know a lot about? [And is what we ‘know’ ‘factual’ as seen by members of that slice?]

As I have stated somewhere on this forum – I learn the most when I can see the entire thought process of the other slice.  Then when I can figure out where the other slice made its mistake [imho] I can then address that ‘error’. [On the other hand what I see as the ‘error’ just might be what they see as the main point of their beliefs [that is they see me going wrong at that same point I see them going wrong]]  [Others do not want to be exposed to ‘heresy’ – which maybe what I am reviewing]  With more books in their slice I might learn that what I see as ‘error’ is the key point in their system – Now I just see it as ‘error’.  If I do not know what they truly teach I cannot lead them out of their ‘error’ because they will always be able to say that that is not what they teach – And I might lose the opportunity to teach them the truth because I looked dumb the first time I tried.

My current library is lacking some slices.  For example, the religion ZZZZ; We currently have zero commentaries to explain their beliefs from their view point.  [We might have some warning us of their ‘heresies’ but those are written by their enemies]  So how do we learn to show the ‘errors’ in the ZZZZ system – other than saying that they are wrong only because we know that we are correct.  [Circular Logic at its best – The old “”A is right and B is wrong because A says so””

Next Question: Do we also get a list of which of the 14,000 resources fall into which slice?  [List needed to keep ‘heresies’ out of our library]  [Or list needed so that we can create collections for each slice – search only slice ZZZZ]  [Or is Logos going to tell us what slice the resource is in?]

Posts 5613
Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 7:50 PM

MJ. Smith:

Matthew C Jones:
If MJ has (already tagged resources) I would be very interested in getting that info.

I just used the figures shown on the Logos products pages.

 

Ah, Okay.  I'm wondering if you took into account that resources are tagged with multiple groups?

  • The Calvin and the History of Calvinism Collection is in both the Reformed and Presbyterian groups. 
  • The John Piper Manuscript Collection is in both Evangelical and Reformed groups.
  • Rick Brannan's Historic Creeds and Confessions is tagged Reformed, Orthodox, Presbyterian, Anglican, and Catholic.
  • etc..

I guess it may not matter that much, but it may have the effect of inflating certain groups (evangelical and reformed particularly) relative to the others.

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

Posts 26257
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 8:01 PM

Todd Phillips:
Ah, Okay.  I'm wondering if you took into account that resources are tagged with multiple groups?

To avoid controversy, I used the figures as Logos presents them - I simply copied them to Excel and made a chart out of it.The figures only show the top n denominations - I know, for example, that there are Restoration resources in Logos and they don't appear in the statistics.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 297
Schezic | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 8:05 PM

Todd Phillips:
I guess it may not matter that much, but it may have the effect of inflating certain groups (evangelical and reformed particularly) relative to the others.
What about the groups that consider themselves aligned with a slice...but Logos may not see it that way. None of this evaluation would be necessary Had the "us and them" division not transpired.  
MJD:
However, I don't think there should be a special Catholic position, it just feels like we are separating them from us.

Posts 493
Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:04 PM

Schezic:

Michael Anda:

What's with all the little weenies we've been seeing of late, anyway?  Geeked

I was curious as to who would respond.

 

 

 

Posts 297
Schezic | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:09 PM

 

Michael Anda:
What's with all the little weenies we've been seeing of late, anyway?
Michael Anda:
I was curious as to who would respond.
  Well, Now you know.

Bill Coley:
there are times when we need a mirror held up. This is one of those times.

 

 

Posts 1690
LogosEmployee
Bob Pritchett | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:13 PM

Schezic:
A line was crossed when a position was created just to cater to the whims of...

It might help to shed light on what we're thinking at Logos if I mention that we created around 100 product manager positions. The idea was that we'd group like resources together so that someone could develop (or bring) expertise in a content area and help select works, build relationships with publishers, understand the consumers in that category, blog and promote works within the category, and increase sales. That way, as we moved over 10,000 resources in the library, there'd be someone focused on every area, instead of one marketing team trying to do a good job for every type of book, when they might not know as much in an area.

Of course we couldn't afford to hire 100 product managers at once, and not every category warranted a full-time hire. So we put categories into hierarchies, assigned multiple categories to one person, and even created some "part time" product manager categories using people who had other "day jobs" within the company.

The idea is that as we grow, product categories become bigger and eventually there's one person for each category, and they're each doing well enough to support that person and more. (I think this is also called Business 102, though we were late to this class.)

You've already seen some of the part-time product managers at work, in blog posts like:

http://blog.logos.com/2010/06/biblical_languages_and_bible_software/

...from our "Product Manager for Systematic Theology." (Still, alas, a part-time position.)

Here's a sample of the product manager positions we created; these are all within the "Academic" hierarchy, and of course all these are handled by just a few people:

Old Testament

o   Biblical Hebrew and Aramaic

o   OT Textual Criticism

o   Septuagint

o   Scholarly OT commentaries

o   Academic Monographs

New Testament

o   NT Greek

o   NT Textual Criticism

o   Scholarly NT Commentaries

o   Academic Monographs

Apocrypha

Pseudepigrapha

Ancient Near East

o   Ugaritic

o   Hebrew and NW Semitic Inscriptions

Second Temple Judaism

o   Philo

o   Josephus

o   Dead Sea Scrolls

Rabbinica

Patristics

o   Apostolic Fathers

Church History

Theology

o   Historical Theology

o   Biblical Theology

o   Systematic Theology

o   Practical Theology

Study Helps

o   Expositional Commentaries

o   Devotional Commentaries

o   Reference Works

Academic Tools

o   Hebrew and Greek Video Tools

Journals

Classics

o   Greek Classics

o   Latin Classics

So in the future, I hope we'll grow to have a Ugaritic Product Manager. I hope he/she will know a lot about Ugaritic resources, but I imagine he/she won't actually be Ugaritic, the civilization being dead and all. But we also had a line item for Catholic Product Manager and imagined that role being shared with the roles of Liturgical, Lectionary Resources, Patristics, and Church History Product Manager.  You can see how we hired Andrew, who knows Catholic resources and is a church history scholar. Clearly we made a mistake in the way we introduced our new product manager, and even in letting him write his own introduction on the blog without having more grounding in Logos' history and perspective. This was my fault, not his. We were working our way through a list, wearing our "librarian" hat, as described in my "What kind of books..." forum post. I apologize. We're no more trying to turn our users Catholic than Ugaritic or Rabbinic; hopefully you'll meet those product managers in the future, though with different introductions! :-) We are trying to build a library. And, as I made clear in my long "What kind" post, if we want to turn our users anywhere, it's towards the Word. Everything else is just a shelf of books. -- Bob

 

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:21 PM

fwiw: This post was being composed while Bob posted his.  I was responding to MJD without benefit of Bob's post. (Thanks Bob.)

MJD:
In closing, I welcome all my fellow followers of Christ that are Catholics to Logos. However, I don't think there should be a special Catholic position, it just feels like we are separating them from us.

The last two years we had a July 4th special sale (celebrating "Independence Day" of the USA.) This year we did not. Are there overly-sensitive Logos users who take offense at  the "American" partisanship of such a sale? On the other hand, Logos asked women what could be done to address the disparity of predominantly male users versus the miniscule female user population. I heard more outcry against the "Godly Women's Collection" than I did about that survey.

If you are going to open a diner and want Catholic customers to feel welcome, you might want to add fish to the Friday menu. (Do they still observe that?Big Smile ) Nobody is forcing the Protestants or vegetarians to eat the fish. Nobody will prevent them from ordering the fish either

Logos has a track record of reaching out to meet user's needs.  I see no difference between Logos hiring a Catholic Product Manager and my church hiring a Youth Minister, a Seniors Minister and a Singles Minister. (I am not a youth, single or senior.)

It is good for Logos to

  1. have an Academic Sales department.
  2. have Joe Miller as a liaison to pastors.
  3. publish the Evangelcal Exegetical Commentary
  4. have Dr Michael Heisler & Johnny Cisneros give language instruction
  5. publish Steve Runge's discourse analysis materials
  6. bring Stephen Smith on board (Facebook Like-A-Thon & Forum Week)
  7. develop iOS & Android apps
  8. create Vyrso
  9. hire Andrew Jones as Catholic Product Manager
  10. Some would even say Logos 4 Mac is a good idea. Huh?

Each of these good moves could "alienate" someone emotionally. The intention is only to meet a need.. Not everyone has the same needs.

Back to the July 4th sale: I would welcome a sale for each & every nation's "Independence Day" Wink Don't want anyone to feel left out.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 297
Schezic | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:25 PM

Bob Pritchett:
So in the future, I hope we'll grow to have a Ugaritic Product Manager. I hope he/she will know a lot about Ugaritic resources, but I imagine he/she won't actually be Ugaritic, the civilization being dead and all. But we also had a line item for Catholic Product Manager and imagined that role being shared with the roles of Liturgical, Lectionary Resources, Patristics, and Church History Product Manager.  You can see how we hired Andrew, who knows Catholic resources and is a church history scholar. Clearly we made a mistake in the way we introduced our new product manager, and even in letting him write his own introduction on the blog without having more grounding in Logos' history and perspective. This was my fault, not his. We were working our way through a list, wearing our "librarian" hat, as described in my "What kind of books..." forum post. I apologize. We're no more trying to turn our users Catholic than Ugaritic or Rabbinic; hopefully you'll meet those product managers in the future, though with different introductions! :-) We are trying to build a library. And, as I made clear in my long "What kind" post, if we want to turn our users anywhere, it's towards the Word. Everything else is just a shelf of books. -- Bob
Now, You have gotten to the heart of the issue. I appreciate you doing so,and commend you for it. I will attempt to abstain from further comment.

 

Posts 175
Bill Coley | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:44 PM

Schezic:

Michael Anda:
What's with all the little weenies we've been seeing of late, anyway?
Michael Anda:
I was curious as to who would respond.
  Well, Now you know.

Bill Coley:
there are times when we need a mirror held up. This is one of those times.

 

Schezic - to Bob Pritchett:

I will attempt to abstain from further comment.

 

Schezic,

You have now twice paired Mr. Anda's question about "weenies" with my comment about mirrors of accountability. Let me be the first to applaud your decision to "attempt to abstain from further comment."

Bill

Posts 116
Chris Thompson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 9:52 PM

Bill Coley:
You have now twice paired Mr. Anda's question about "weenies" with my comment about mirrors
The connection certainly made sense to me.

Posts 6481
Forum MVP
Lynden Williams | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 7 2011 10:53 PM

Matthew C Jones:
Back to the July 4th sale: I would welcome a sale for each & every nation's "Independence Day" Wink Don't want anyone to feel left out.

Gee thanks Matthew, you are so gracious. Mine is on Sunday. We will be breaking ground for a new church. Unfortunately, I am tapped out to take advantage of your (Logos) generous offer it they were to implement it. Maybe next year.

Everything ever written in Religion and Theology formatted for Logos Bible Software.Logos Youtube Channel

Posts 10
Mark W. Gaither | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 8 2011 11:40 AM

Matthew C Jones:

Mark:
To be clear… I respect authority figures.  Within the church I submit to the elders, outside the church I submit to all governing authorities, just as the bible commands me to.  I seek unity around the authority of the bible, hence the reason that I have spent so much money on your software, and why I study any chance I get.  Lastly, I have never “split” a church, or caused dissention in a church.

Mark, 

If everyone were like you...

I agree with Mark. Bob can open the door wider for others without slamming our fingers in it.

Bob's post was pugnacious and offensive to the majority of Protestant Logos users. I just felt poked in the eye and now have negative, resentful feelings toward a company I like and a product I use daily. I'll let it roll off and continue as I have, but this was not good marketing.

 

Posts 10112
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 8 2011 12:01 PM

Welcome to the forum, Mark. You might be a little frustrated, but you do have to admit you have a talent for them 'fightin words' ... slamming fingers, pugnacious,   poked in the eye, and letting it 'roll off' (I assume a heavy punch). I did learn 'pugnacious' sounds canine-ish but turns out to be pugilistic. So, great addition.


Posts 2774
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 8 2011 12:12 PM

Matthew C Jones:
have Joe Miller as a liaison to pastors.
thanks Embarrassed

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 8 2011 12:23 PM

Coffee

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 10
Mark W. Gaither | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 8 2011 12:24 PM

What can 

DMB:

...but you do have to admit you have a talent for them 'fightin words' ... 

What can I say? I are a writer.

Page 12 of 19 (367 items) « First ... < Previous 10 11 12 13 14 Next > ... Last » | RSS