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This post has 16 Replies | 5 Followers

Posts 5
James F. Kubecki | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Nov 4 2009 7:32 AM

I installed the core engine upgrade for Logos 4, but have not purchased an upgrade or crossgrade library. It seems that I am unable to sync my library, then, with my iPhone - i.e., it shows I have 504 books in my Logos 4 on my desktop (titles I have purchased previously), but only the standard "free" ones on the iPhone.

1. Is my understanding correct, that I cannot get access to my paid library without paying an upgrade cost, even though I have 4.0 installed and have purchased these titles?

2. Doesn't this run counter to Logos' traditional licensing stand, that once you buy the book, you own the book?

I am really impressed with the 4.0 software, and the iPhone app, but I'm having a very hard time to not feel disappointed and feel like Logos is significantly changing, for the worse, their business models and policies regarding upgrades, content licensing, and usage.

Posts 1663
LogosEmployee
Bob Pritchett | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 4 2009 9:55 AM

Yes, iPhone synchronization is a feature of the paid upgrades to Logos 4. It's designed to work with Logos 4's synchronization framework, and will eventually feature notes and more.

I'm sorry you're disappointed, but I don't think we're changing our model. We've promised you won't have to buy your books again, and that they would work on future versions of Windows. We've kept that promise; you don't have to pay to keep using your books. (You don't even need 4.0 to keep using your books. We're even doing maintenance releases on 3.0, and it should run for many years to come.)

We never promised -- and can't promise -- that you'll get the fruit of all our coding labor for free, in perpetuity. Because that's just not a viable business model.

I think that our app for the iPhone offers a lot of value and usefulness for free. It even gives you 30+ books. I know for a fact that it cost a lot to build, and we're giving it away, without breaking our promise to you one bit.

I think it's reasonable, though, for us to want some compensation when we go above and beyond our promise: when we build a completely new application, or support an alternate device that didn't even exist when many users bought their book licenses, etc. As it is, where we bundle incredible free content a few million dollars of software development into a $69.95 minimal cross grade, plus incredible iPhone functionality... all while not doing anything to your ability to continue to use (and get free support for) the version you bought... I think that's a pretty fair deal!

(For what's it's worth: the iPhone app actually increases our costs significantly; synchronization and web serving of users individual libraries, etc. requires large investments in bandwidth, computing power, and IT support. We keep increasing our costs while offering more free service...)

Posts 2733
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 4 2009 10:15 AM

Bob Pritchett:
I think that's a pretty fair deal!

It is more than that and I thank you for doing it. I am really excited about the iPhone project. It is better I ever imagined. I see a great potential in that application. Thank you again and God bless you.

Bohuslav

Posts 5
Tyler Wallick | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 4 2009 10:19 AM

I may have misunderstood something I thought I understood - I thought I only needed to upgrade the engine to 4.0 in order to have my 3.0 resources show up on my iphone. After reading this, do I need at least the crossgrade to enable that? All of my resources are from the MacArthur CD's and last I read, these were still in negotiations for the iphone so I was not concerned.

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LogosEmployee

Tyler Wallick:

I may have misunderstood something I thought I understood - I thought I only needed to upgrade the engine to 4.0 in order to have my 3.0 resources show up on my iphone. After reading this, do I need at least the crossgrade to enable that? 

Access to all iPhone-supported books (that you have purchased for your desktop software) is only enabled in the iPhone application if you have purchased a Logos 4 ("LE") package, crossgrade, or the "minimal crossgrade".

 

Posts 5
James F. Kubecki | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 6 2009 10:38 AM

Bob, thank you for your thorough response. I think that a large part of my frustration initially was that with the initial announcements and blog postings, the exact availability of an engine-only upgrade and the availability of iPhone sync was not at all clear. I follow the Logos blog and Twitter feeds closely, and this thread was probably the first place I saw it explained succinctly. (Even the "minimal crossgrade" option on the Logos 4 product comparison page is easy to miss...)

I agree that the viability of free upgrades in perpetuity by itself would not be a viable business model. I just always assumed (perhaps wrongly) that Logos operated more off the "Gilette" model - sell the razor at a loss and make the money off of the blades. Or, in this case, give away Libronix and make money off of the content.

I'll be considering buying the minimal crossgrade or regular Logos 4 upgrade in the days to come. I just need to figure out if it will really add that much value for primarily the iPhone app, especially considering that my regular platform for Logos is a highly portable netbook.

Thanks again!

Posts 258
Greg Corbin | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 14 2009 7:27 PM

I got the iphone app four days ago. Got an upgrade to Logos 4 Silver downloaded and going strong today. However, the books on my iphone app are not syncing as I believe they are supposed to. They show up, and I can read them. However, if I understand correctly, the books I have open on my computer should be open when I open the iphone app and that isn't happening - even with just a Bible.  Logos 4 is GREAT. Love it already and love the iphone app. Just trying to get the bugs worked out!

Posts 376
Dan Sheppard | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 15 2009 5:46 PM

Greg-

Please see the note from Bob Pritchett, above.

It has to do with receiving authorization by Logos, from the publishers of the individual books.  Even though you have the book in your Logos 4, you (or me) do not yet have the authorization to use that book on our iPhone.

 

But that is what they are working toward.  So I watch my computer and iPhone, just like watching my mailbox for some fan mail.

And watching, and watching, and watching.......

 

Dan

Posts 2733
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 16 2009 2:08 AM

Dan Sheppard:

But that is what they are working toward.  So I watch my computer and iPhone, just like watching my mailbox for some fan mail.

And watching, and watching, and watching.......

The same here Smile

Bohuslav

Posts 2733
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 16 2009 2:12 AM

Greg Corbin:

I got the iphone app four days ago. Got an upgrade to Logos 4 Silver downloaded and going strong today. However, the books on my iphone app are not syncing as I believe they are supposed to. They show up, and I can read them. However, if I understand correctly, the books I have open on my computer should be open when I open the iphone app and that isn't happening - even with just a Bible.  Logos 4 is GREAT. Love it already and love the iphone app. Just trying to get the bugs worked out!

I your question is that the opened book on certain page on your PC is not synced to the same page on iPhone, than I have the same problem. I think this feature still do not work on iPhone. I use Favorites to get to the same page so far. I hope it will work however, since if I remember right, the feature was mentioned by Logos to be planned for the iPhone application.

Bohuslav

Posts 131
James Macleod | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 17 2009 12:38 PM

All in all, Logos for the iPhone is an amazing app for version 1 software. Logos has a right to charge for anything new they develop. Kudos to Logos on a job well done!

Posts 44
A.A. van der Leij | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 18 2009 1:25 AM

Sorry, English isn't my first language.

Do I understand correctly that the free download to Logos 4 is not enough, my (still to be bought) I-phone will not be able to use Logos.

So, besides having to buy my I-phone, I also need to buy the software upgrade (instead of the free version Logos 4).

 

Mat 6:33

Posts 131
James Macleod | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 18 2009 11:27 AM

AAvanderLeij:

Sorry, English isn't my first language.

Do I understand correctly that the free download to Logos 4 is not enough, my (still to be bought) I-phone will not be able to use Logos.

So, besides having to buy my I-phone, I also need to buy the software upgrade (instead of the free version Logos 4).

 

I believe from the responses you are correct. If you cross grade  or upgrade you get access to the iPhone app with access to your library. This seems fair to me. The iPhone is a new platform that Logos needed to develop for. None of us like to work for free. We all have families to feed and clothe.

Posts 1
Stephen Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 20 2009 7:15 AM

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Posts 1

The iphone application with the new Logos 4 is absolutely incredible. It is going to take sometime to get to know all that it can do, but what an amazing tool for me as a pastor on the go. I have your program loaded on my home, church, and travel laptops. Plus, having access to my library through my Iphone is just something wonderful. Thank you for such a fine tool. logos has been a blessing for me for years.

Dr. John Watson

Posts 3
John Scott Hamlin | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 23 2009 7:30 PM

Bob Pritchett:
Yes, iPhone synchronization is a feature of the paid upgrades to Logos 4. It's designed to work with Logos 4's synchronization framework,

I have upgraded to Logos 4. paying $100+. I have the Basic edition. As far as I can tell no additional resources were synched or added to the basic free Logos app. I checked the books before I upgraded, and then was eager to see what was available (knowing not all of them would be), but I can see no additional resources synced from my copy of Logos 4 Basic edition. I have made sure the account information is correct, but no additional books are visible on the iPhone app.

Is there something additional that I need to do? Do I need to uninstall the Logos app or something?

Thank you!

Posts 71
Ryan Burns | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 24 2009 11:10 AM

JohnScottHamlin:

I checked the books before I upgraded, and then was eager to see what was available (knowing not all of them would be), but I can see no additional resources synced from my copy of Logos 4 Basic edition. I have made sure the account information is correct, but no additional books are visible on the iPhone app.

Does this post help? http://community.logos.com/forums/p/3052/44061.aspx#44061

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