English new testament in greek text order

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John Parker | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Nov 4 2011 8:33 AM

Is there an english text written in percise or close order to the greek?   That would be nice especially when I Display/inline.

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BillS | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 8:42 AM

Hi John,

Welcome to the forums!

A plain interlinear does that, but as you can see it's a choppy (at best, unnatural at worst) word order for English language speakers. The problem is that Greek & Hebrew don't use our expected subject/verb order. So the answer is "no", for the translations I'm familiar with (NIV, NASB, ESV, NRSV, RSV, KJV, etc., all the common ones). Even "literal" translations (Youngs, etc.) don't try to hold the word order, as it's too often just not how we'd construct a sentence.

That said, I usually use NASB &  NRSV when I want a translation closer to the Greek / Hebrew. They're a little more "wooden" than NKJV, ESV, NLT, NEB, GNB, NIV, etc., but for word studies I find them more helpful...

Blessings on your effort!

 

Grace & Peace,
Bill


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Clinton Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 8:43 AM

I think you want a Greek interlinear? There the English is in the exact order of the Greek.

Try: Aland, Kurt, Matthew Black, Carlo M. Martini et al. The Greek New Testament, Fourth Revised Edition (Interlinear With Morphology), Deutsche Bibelgesellschaft, 1993; 2006.

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BillS | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 8:49 AM

BillS:
A plain interlinear does that

And in my library there are several... If you have a collection that includes languages, chances are you have one.

Grace & Peace,
Bill


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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 9:00 AM

I wanted to be able to quickly move across the different languages but stay in english (syriac gospels, Peshitta, coptics, greek, latin, etc).

Using the 'English Literal Translation' line of the NA27 or USB4 interlinears works nicely for the greek (quite readable).

And of course it also allows a mouse hover for the morph-tag.

"I didn't know God made honky tonk angels."

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 9:08 AM

John Parker:

Is there an english text written in percise or close order to the greek?   That would be nice especially when I Display/inline.

I'm not aware of any, since Greek word order is determined by Greek grammar and English word order by English grammar. Let me give an example of English in Greek word order (Rom 6:12-13): "Not but let reign the sin in the mortal of you body unto the to obey the desires of it, nor present the members of you weapons/instruments of unrighteousness to/for sin, instead present yourselves to the God as from dead living and the members of you weapons/instruments of righteousness to the God."

NOTE: There are passages where Greek word order, rendered directly into English would be even more confusing. My Bible just happened to be open to this one.

Young's literal perhaps is the most literal of translations available in most base packages, but it does not follow precise Greek word order either.

If you have the LGNTI (Lexham Greek-English Interlinear New Testament -- doesn't work with the NA27 Interlinear), and you strip everything but the English literal, as in the image below. You can have a virtual English text in Greek word order. If you then copy the text (from the right click menu) and paste (Keep Source Formatting) into Word you can have this word order preserved (this works in Word 2010, at least)

Here's the graphic:

Here's the above text copied from the LGNTI using the method I just described (the word order numbers would have to be stripped manually, if you don't want them):

Normal 0 false false false EN-US X-NONE HE

12 [do] not [let]2 therefore1 reign4 — sin3 in5 — mortal7 your6 body so that — [you] obeya — desires2 its1, 13 and [do] not present — members2 your1 [as] instruments5 of unrighteousness6 to3 sin4, but present yourselves to God as from2 the dead3 those who are alive1 and4 — members6 your5 [as] instruments9 of righteousness10 to7 God8.

EDIT: Noticed others posted as I was writing.

Also I forgot to mention the Lexcam English Bible (LEB). This is unique to Logos, and is also a very literal translation. But it doesn't preserve Greek word order any better than Young's.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 12
John Parker | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 9:11 AM

Yes, this will work!  Thank you!

Posts 12
John Parker | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 4 2011 9:15 AM

Along with thanks to Richard, Thanks too, to Bill, Clinton, and Denise.   WOW! This is a hot forum.   Is there a specific forum for readers of Greek

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 5 2011 12:20 AM

Couple more Greek Interlinear resources have option to display English in Greek order (along with visual filter highlighting of verbal mood, number, tense, and voice):

Wiki Extended Tips for Visual Filters => Examples of visual filters includes Logos Greek Morphology visual filter examples.

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 12
John Parker | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 5 2011 9:28 AM

Thank you.   I found NA27 McReynolds.   Cool.   I'd already figured out to filter my Lexham Causal Outlines which works just fine for what I want.   I didn't find Lexham Discourse.  Maybe that was in the the next set above mine which is Silver I think.  

Speaking of finding Lexham Discourse,  In L3 there was a list locked books.  Where can I find that now?

And i know there's a rather expensive greek dictionary I don't have It cast about $150.  Does any know what I'm talking about.  (Hey, that's more clues then Neb's dream!) LOL!

Posts 10522
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 5 2011 9:36 AM

I'm guessing the 'expensive' greek dictionary is Liddel-Scott: http://www.logos.com/product/3879/liddell-and-scott-greek-english-lexicon

or more likely BDAG: http://www.logos.com/product/3878/a-greek-english-lexicon-of-the-new-testament-and-other-early-christian-literature-3rd-ed

The latter you definitely want (along with HALOT). LSJ is huge and concentrates on the classics (greek).

Regarding L3's list of locked resources, that was a nice feature not carried over to L4, Logos.com presumably taking up the slack.

"I didn't know God made honky tonk angels."

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 5 2011 12:36 PM

John Parker:
Speaking of finding Lexham Discourse,  In L3 there was a list locked books.  Where can I find that now?

Logos 4 downloads and shows resources that are licensed for your use.

Wiki Logos Resource Reviews => Lexham Discourse Greek New Testament has links to several Logos.com product pages, including => Greek New Testament Discourse Bundle (7 vols.)

John Parker:
And i know there's a rather expensive greek dictionary I don't have

For BDAG, may want to consider upgrade to Scholar's Platinum (vis separate purchase).

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 12
John Parker | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 5 2011 5:31 PM

BDAG! That's it!  Thx!

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