Open Kindle Books in logos

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Jonathan Gainer | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Jan 20 2012 4:27 AM

So this may sound like a strange question, but I've down loaded some kindle books that would like to be able to search with my Logos 4.  Can I import kindle books into logos 4?

 

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Paul-C | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 4:45 AM

Hi Jonathan, welcome to the Logos forums.

The short answer is: I don't think you can import Kindle books very easily. 

I believe the only way to do this would be to somehow turn your kindle book into a Personal Book (see - this article for details on how to make Personal Books) and import it that way.  This could involve a lot of work, depending on the length of the book in question, to ensure it is properly tagged like native Logos resources are, to get the full search functions enjoyed in Logos.

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alabama24 | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 4:56 AM

Jonathan - First, welcome to the forums!

There is not a consensus about that issue here. One of my good forum friends thinks differently about the issue, so I am sure he will share his opinion if he feels my answer is lacking. Stick out tongue

The issue to me is that Kindle is a protected format. Copy protection has been put into place to prevent you from doing what you are asking. It is my understanding of the law (I am no lawyer, but I've played one on TV) that breaking the copy protection is itself a violation of the law. Exceptions are granted under very narrow circumstances which it is unlikely for you to meet. (Are you blind? Is the book not available for read aloud mode?) The answer to your question is that yes, it is technically possible, but it does require using software which I believe to be illegal. Once you have the text in a copy & paste format, you would create a Personal Book using PBB & Word.

Let me add that I personally believe you should be able to do this... I just don't believe the law allows you to do so.

The advantages of the Logos platform are that you can search your entire library, which is why you are asking your question. Do you mind me asking which books you are interested in? Have you checked VYRSO (the new eBook store from Logos)?

 

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alabama24 | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 5:00 AM

Paul Clarke:
This could involve a lot of work, depending on the length of the book in question, to ensure it is properly tagged like native Logos resources are, to get the full search functions enjoyed in Logos.

Creating a "full featured" Personal Book does require much time & effort, however, creating a simple eBook is fairly straight forward. Vyrso books would be similar in quality because they have hyperlinks to Scripture but not much else.

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Jonathan Gainer | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 6:28 AM

I was trying to work with David Bivin's "New light on the difficult words of Jesus."  Are there books in Vyrso that I can't get in logos?  I'll check it out. 

 

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 7:04 AM

Hi Jonathan

Jonathan Gainer:
 Are there books in Vyrso that I can't get in logos?  

Just to clarify....

There are books which you can purchase at vyrso.com which you can't purchase at logos.com and vice versa.

The vyrso books are simpler ebooks and don't have the richer tagging which you get in Logos books.

However, any books which you purchase at vyrso.com can be read in your Logos application and vice versa.

Jonathan Gainer:
New light on the difficult words of Jesus

This book is not currently available at Vyrso. 

Graham

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alabama24 | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 7:11 AM

Jonathan Gainer:
I was trying to work with David Bivin's "New light on the difficult words of Jesus."

I checked for you... Unfortunately it is not in Vyrso.

Jonathan Gainer:
Are there books in Vyrso that I can't get in logos?

Typically, books that are in Logos are academic in nature. Vyrso books, on the other hand, are what you would find at your average "Christian" book store. This includes books such as (ahem) "Amish Romance Novels," to "Christian Living" books and devotionals. Here are some things you should know:

 

  1. Vyrso books do work in Logos. Once you purchase them, they download like Logos books.
  2. Vyrso books are "bare bones" eBooks, such as you would find on Kindle, Nook, etc. In other words, they are not extensively tagged like other Logos books.
  3. Scripture references are hyperlinked. 

 

[EDIT: You posted before I could Graham!]

 

 

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 20 2012 7:30 AM

Jonathan Gainer:

I was trying to work with David Bivin's "New light on the difficult words of Jesus."  Are there books in Vyrso that I can't get in logos?  I'll check it out. 

Welcome Big Smile

Posted in Suggestions forum => Suggestion: David Bivin's "New Light on the Difficult Words of Jesus: Insights from His Jewish Context"

All Vyrso books can be used in Logos 4 => http://vyrso.com/ that can be filtered in Library using edition:eBook

One option for use with Logos 4 is reading kindle book using Amazon's Kindle for Mac along with building a Personal Book for your Notes, which could include text copied from Kindle book with citation (similar to Logos 4 copy and paste with footnote reference).  Your personal notes could include comparison and/or contrast with other 2nd Temple literature.

Keep Smiling Smile

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 5:27 AM

alabama24:

Paul Clarke:
This could involve a lot of work, depending on the length of the book in question, to ensure it is properly tagged like native Logos resources are, to get the full search functions enjoyed in Logos.

Creating a "full featured" Personal Book does require much time & effort, however, creating a simple eBook is fairly straight forward. Vyrso books would be similar in quality because they have hyperlinks to Scripture but not much else.

Just to confirm Alabama's words, creating a "simple" Personal Book out of a Kindle book is technically not a problem.

I think there are or have been Kindle books without DRM (such as old PD works that Amazon gives away for free or nominal charge), where Alabama's rationale about breaking the protection mechanism wouldn't apply and one might try how it looks. It is upon you to decide whether the use of a simple, automated DRM-removing converter (e.g. a Calibre plugin) is against the law in your jurisdiction and/or your personal ethos. I find that the various legislations and court-rulings in different countries regarding this kind of thing (private format conversion of a digital resource you paid for) are neither consistent nor exhaustive and may render this into a somewhat grey area for some of us. But you need to decide for yourself.

It's obvious that (should someone decide to do this) at least in most western jurisdictions the sharing of such a private format-converted resource would be illegal. 

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alabama24 | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 5:48 AM

Yes

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Mitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 8:47 AM

I've done this, using a combination of Calibre and Word to turn a Kindle book into a personal book file. I think NewbieMick covered the legality issue as best as it can be covered - that is to say, it is absolutely, definitely, beyond the slightest shadow of a doubt... a grey area.

Sharing (and especially selling) of said resources is not a grey area at all, so don't do it.

Now onto a subject on which I have some expertise. Use with discretion and for personal, non-sharing purposes only. Here are the necessary steps to get a Kindle book (or other eBook, obtained from CCEL or Project Gutenberg, for example):

1. Install Calibre eBook management tool (free and open source)

2. Install Kindle de-DRM (instructions and files available here)

3. Import Kindle book into Calibre

4. Convert Kindle book to ZHTML format

5. Open HTML file in Word

6. Save as .docx

7. Manually add reference tagging (optional)

8. Import into Logos as Personal Book

This will keep the table of contents intact, although sometimes I've had to do some manual work to get images right.

I started doing steps 1-4 before I even had Logos because I don't like giving Amazon total control over items that I've purchased. There was an instance a while back where Amazon remotely removed a book from users' Kindles without notifying them, and to me that's entirely unacceptable (ironically, the book was George Orwell's 1984). If I buy it, I want to be able to put it on any device I want and I want to be sure I can still access it even if Amazon goes under. The ability to add these books to Logos is just an added bonus.

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 9:16 AM

Thanks Mitchell.

Calibre is great and I have occasionally used it for ebooks from various source types (such as PDF and epub, which one finds on the web for out-of copyright books), however I always "automatically" converted to RTF to open in word, since this used to be Word's format in the past and we advise to use it for "sanitizing" docx-files anyway. It never even occurred to me to try another format... Any issues with RTF or other reasons you prefer the HTML? 

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Mitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 12:02 PM

Calibre supports exporting to what they call "HTMLZ", which is essentially a ZIP file containing an HTML document and its associated files (images and stylesheet). I picked this over RTF for two reasons. 1) It keeps links intact, which means that the table of contents is created automatically and 2) it supports images.

Honestly I didn't even try it with RTF, so the table of contents may work with either format. Images didn't really translate too well in my experience so there may be no advantage to HTML at all. If you have the time, it would probably be best to try both and see what works best for that particular book.

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Jonathan | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 23 2012 2:41 PM

Mitchell Ebbott:

5. Open HTML file in Word

6. Save as .docx

I do not believe that Word for Mac allows one to open htmlz files. At least mine does not. It gives an error message and then fails to open. Are you using a Mac to do this?

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Mitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jan 24 2012 7:02 AM

I am using a Mac, but I think I forgot a step. The HTMLZ file is really a zip file, and you'll need to extract it first. I'm starting to vaguely recall renaming the HTMLZ file to a .zip extension, then double-clicking to extract. I'm not at my mac now to test this, but that should do the trick.

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Jason Stanland | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 5 2012 1:50 PM

How do you add reference tagging?

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