Why I am starting to hate this software

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This post has 123 Replies | 5 Followers

Posts 167
Randall Lind | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Feb 28 2012 12:37 AM

After all the update I believe Logos has broken it's software.

I order this software 5 months back it opened fast and rocked. However after 3 or 4 major updates and countless little ones it takes 2 mins to open. I click on the Logos icon and then the logos 4 logo is on the screen for over a min before it launches, then I get a syncing prompt  or preparing library screen which takes another min or so. Then another 20-40 sec or so for homepage to load.

1 out of 2 times when starting I am prompted for an upgrade. Upgrade of what I never know sometime it will tell me after the upgrade other times I have to search the forums.

I don't even like opening this software any more but for $600 I feel the need to at least try to use this pain in the neck software. Don't even talk to me about how it indexes my library every  time it updates which locks up the software. So much for we only index once motto.

 

I am running a dual core celeron laptop and like I said before all these SP updates I had no issues now I think I had 3 or 4 SP updates . My laptop isn't slow it  just that Logos4 has become slow after all these updates.

I am not trying to make anyone mad but, I really don't see why it takes so long to open, The only other piece of software that hates to open for me is Firefox which I compare to this.

Posts 271
Don | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 12:42 AM

Have you defragged / optimized your HD? Do you regularly clear cache files?

 

Posts 18670
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 12:50 AM

Have you considered turning off "Automatically Download Updates" in Program Settings? Then you have the choice to accept software updates only once every couple of months or however infrequently you want.

Posts 439
Mark Stevens | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 1:24 AM

I still love this software but I must admit I have also noticed it is slower than usual and using more resources. Has anyone else noticed this?

Posts 10046
Forum MVP
NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 1:32 AM

In addition to the hints from others: Did you perchance add the Perseus resources and other big resource counts to your Library? At least that was my experience regarding L4 performance - once I added these, I took a performance hit. Same again with Catholic Library Builder and the Catholic Scholar's package. My small Acer Extensa (I think it uses a single core Celeron) did well performancewise with up to 1000 resources. Now over 3000 I experience some things you describe - and others described in the forums before all these upgrades.

What is different now with the updates (since 4.5?) is that Sync2 openly works at the inital start of L4 - since one can bypass this, maybe Logos should contemplate putting some of this (as well as prefetching menu items etc) into background tasks that occur without being noticed by the user. Rosie has commented on this somewhere based on her Microsoft experience. However the small SPs shouldn't bother you - maybe they introduce performance improvements as well, and after all, you may turn them off. Bob (the CEO) commented that they have a larger than usual number of SPs to accomodate the companion side to the long-asked-for mobile sync functionalities.

There are some hints on the wiki regarding performance improvement - maybe these help you. Overall however, it seems that a machine that is spec'd more like that of a gamer or video amateur (i.e. fast and new processor [i7], super-fast HD with lots of free space, big memory, separate fast video processor with lots of own memory) would work better with Logos. 

Running Logos 8 latest beta version on Win 10

Posts 18670
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 1:57 AM

Here are some wiki pages with hints about speeding up performance:

http://wiki.logos.com/Logos_Running_Slowly

http://wiki.logos.com/Speeding_up_Logos_4_responses

Though frankly much of what is discussed in them I consider voluntary crippling of the software. You shouldn't need to limit your use of powerful software just because it's too slow when you're using it to the max. On the other hand, if you have a slower machine, it might be necessary in order to have a pleasant experience with the software. A dual core celeron laptop isn't exactly a "slow machine" but it's not among the top of the heap. Still, it's odd that everything would have been chugging along just fine when you first installed Logos and would have slowed down significantly just from a couple of recent updates, unless you're only talking about the startup experience, which is an exception at the moment.

Posts 48
GS | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 4:02 AM

I've reached the point where I look at Logos 4 like I look at my wife's MG Midget: It looks good sitting in the garage and it's fun to play with sometimes but when you have to rely on it you realize how unreliable it is.  Unfortunately, Logos 4 has been an experience in slow and glitchy performance from day one.  I've upgraded both my computer and memory (now an i7 with independent video card) with only modest improvement.  I like having access to all Logos' resources but I still can't get my head around why it's such a performance dog compared to every other program I use.

Posts 439
Mark Stevens | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 5:08 AM

I know this might sound like a dumb question but would and upgrade from scholars to scholars Gold plus a number of large commentary additions slow performance?

 

Posts 634
Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 5:33 AM

I love Logos and have been using it since 1997, but my fear is that when other software (i.e., BibleWorks) that already focus on original text, begin to add other resources, which is just a matter of time, Logos is going to start hurting for business. I am suprised that Logos as not already lost some Mac users to other software like accordance. They need to do something to make this software faster and more reliable. I simply refuse to download an update until I read the forums and 10 times out of 10, people are having difficulties and many times, it is the same problems all over again. So I usually run a couple of upgrades behind.

I hate to use the same comparision, but I have a friend that works for Ford Motor Company. He said that they were constantly having problems with their diesel engines built by International. It was not until Ford broke ties with International and began to build their own diesel engines that Ford stopped having so many problems.

Maybe if Logos depends too much on Microsoft and the Microsoft programs are slowing it down and causing other incompatible problems, maybe they should create their own platform. I dont know, I am not a computer programmer, I am a pastor.

Pastor Michael Huffman, Th.A Th.B Th.M

Posts 549
Shawn Drewett | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 5:57 AM

I always tell my wife that Wal-Mart will "go down" one day if they don't do something about the 15-20 minute check out times. You can get what you want there, but you WILL have to wait for it. I avoid WM if I can get the items I want elsewhere-even if I have to pay a bit more for them. Why do I mind waiting? Because I know I can check out quickly at the dollar store, so why waste time at WM? 

It may be a strange illustration but the point is "Logos needs to fix it's speed problem or they will lose business to faster software programs". 

Posts 10178
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:04 AM

Gregg ... at least your wife has good taste. I thought your comment was so funny, since two years ago, we compared L4 to a jag sitting in the garage.

I do think, though, that like the absence of good help files and manuals, a good set of company advice on what drags L4 vs makes it go would have been nice. Every time I see one of these threads, I wonder if Logos even has performance goals (computer-wise). It 'sounds' like the Beverly Hillbilly's (that's a compliment) where they just keep adding furniture on the little truck.


Posts 549
Shawn Drewett | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:12 AM

DMB:
. It 'sounds' like the Beverly Hillbilly's (that's a compliment) where they just keep adding furniture on the little truck.

 

Love the analogy! lol

Posts 1281
toughski | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:14 AM

Pastor Michael Huffman:
Maybe if Logos depends too much on Microsoft and the Microsoft programs are slowing it down and causing other incompatible problems, maybe they should create their own platform. I dont know, I am not a computer programmer, I am a pastor.

Bob has defended their position, by saying basically "do you want us to write display code all day OR do you want us to write Bible Study software?" to which my reply would be BOTH. They chose the path that is better for their business, the only recourse we have is to vote with our wallets. As a full-time pastor myself I am constantly frustrated with having to wait and maintain L4 (choosing to delay indexing due to updating, clicking out of unnecessary browser reminders that pop-up, waiting on slow startup, unsubscribing from over-zealous promotional emails, ...)

Shawn Drewett:
15-20 minute check out times

obviously you never lived in Russia Smile We long for Walmart to come in and introduce real customer service.

Posts 634
Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:24 AM

toughski:
do you want us to write display code all day OR do you want us to write Bible Study software?" to which my reply would be BOTH.

Amen!!!! Both!!!!! We surely pay enough. Now, I must admit at this point that I have been very blessed y not having the problems others have reported.....to which I am very thankful!!!! I do wish; however, that they would work on their speed and I wish that I could trust the new updates to download them. When I have the program running well, I am afraid to download the new one for fear of having the same problems as others.

Pastor Michael Huffman, Th.A Th.B Th.M

Posts 549
Shawn Drewett | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:25 AM

Hey toughski I feel for you. I've never lived in Russia and am thankful for Wal-Mart just making a comparison. People raise their expectations when the overall standard is raised. I visit India frequently and they wish they COULD wait in line for items. 

Posts 1875
Paul-C | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 6:30 AM

Shawn Drewett:

I visit India frequently and they wish they COULD wait in line for items. 

Come to the UK.  We just love a good queue. Cool

Posts 1649
Room4more | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 7:02 AM

Hmmm, this is interesting:

I run on a laptop using a wireless and a server. To be honest the only time I really experience a slow L4 is when it is updating or doing a sync. Although , I must admit that I usually have the use the internet and the auto-update unchecked and not running, and usually check once or twice a week for them.

Not having these checked reduces the start-up time as well as having it load the home page every time I run the program. I also have those ‘other guys’ and to be honest I really do not see much difference. If you start L4 with a particular set-up every time, then there will be a slower runtime at the beginning,  as opposed to starting with a blank screen. You can also keep the ‘history’ clean so that it will run smoother.

Yet, all in all, I can remember when it was L2, and in comparison to L4 – well there is no comparison really. But I guess it all comes down to a matter of preference. But then I do not have Scholars or Portfolio, just the OL, so my resources are not as exhaustive or as cumbersome in the start-up process.

Well that’s my star-bucks $1.50$

 

DISCLAIMER: What you do on YOUR computer is your doing.

Posts 767
Alan Charles Gielczyk | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 7:09 AM

I understand all the frustration BUT, we have all been pestering Logos for notes and highlighting on our mobile devices for almost two years now and we finally have it. That said it comes at a price, the syncing to keep every platform in line with each other takes time. There are trade offs for every feature we all want so I just want to speak up and say thank you Logos for putting up with all of us and still trying to make all our desired features a reality!

Posts 640
Into Grace | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 7:11 AM

Alan Charles Gielczyk:

I understand all the frustration BUT, we have all been pestering Logos for notes and highlighting on our mobile devices for almost two years now and we finally have it. That said it comes at a price, the syncing to keep every platform in line with each other takes time. There are trade offs for every feature we all want so I just want to speak up and say thank you Logos for putting up with all of us and still trying to make all our desired features a reality!

Yes

Posts 10178
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Feb 28 2012 7:33 AM

Alan ... you need a 'star'!!  I was wondering how many entries it would take before the 'we deserve this'.


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