Mormon Studies Collection (45 vols.)

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This post has 29 Replies | 3 Followers

Posts 1404
Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Apr 9 2012 6:45 PM

Mormon Studies Collection (45 vols.)

This is a much needed collection, if you have not bid on this collection please do. These books are essential to anyone into mormon apologetics for both sides. Personally this weekend was speaking with 3 lds fellows, and found myself quoting from the lds church history book a-lot.. If you are into apologetics this is a MUST have set. 

Posts 2332
Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 3:38 AM

I agree.  I was surprised to see this one moving so slowly.

Posts 103
Bethany Wilson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 4:09 AM

Personally I would find the "Book of Mormon", the "Pearl of Great Price" and the "Doctrine and Covenants" very useful, but not sure about the rest?

parkbench234 AT gmail DOT com

Posts 1367
Ben | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 5:12 AM

They're a collection of semi-spontaneous sermons that people like to mine for crazy stuff. It's fairly easy both to shock Mormons with what they say, as well as misuse them as a source. I'm not bidding on them, myself.

"The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected."- G.K. Chesterton

Posts 2825
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 7:27 AM

Bethany Wilson:

Personally I would find the "Book of Mormon", the "Pearl of Great Price" and the "Doctrine and Covenants" very useful, but not sure about the rest?

Isn't the "Pearl of Great Price" and "Doctrine and Covenants" regarded as authoritative Scripture by the Church of Latter Day Saints?  Or am I mistaken about that?  Not out to debate, just would like to know.

 

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 55
J Hale | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 7:41 AM

Yes, The Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine and Covenants, are Scriptures of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, “the Mormon’s”.

Posts 2408
David Ames | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 11:41 AM

J Hale:
The Pearl of Great Price, Doctrine and Covenants, are Scriptures of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, “the Mormon’s”.

Publication Date: 1918:  And there were some key updates in the 1980s that changed things in that church - too bad that the best we can get is 90 years out of date

Posts 1404
Blair Laird | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2012 9:16 PM

David Ames:
Publication Date: 1918:  And there were some key updates in the 1980s that changed things in that church - too bad that the best we can get is 90 years out of date

Having the original is essential, but it is nice to reference to the new stuff to show the changes that have been made.

Posts 4
Deborah Alves | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 8 2017 5:37 PM

I made my bid on this product. Right now I am witnessing to a growing number of Mormons that God has placed in my life. This would be an invaluable tool in knowing their history and its changes.

Posts 4
Deborah Alves | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 8 2017 5:39 PM

The "Teachings of the 'Prophets'" and a few other books reveal the hypocrisy of the church as well.
They believe the teachings of their 'prophets' to be infallible, but they contradict one another and they try to hide the error in doctrine from their followers.

Posts 3187
Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 8 2017 5:48 PM

Ben:

They're a collection of semi-spontaneous sermons that people like to mine for crazy stuff. It's fairly easy both to shock Mormons with what they say, as well as misuse them as a source. I'm not bidding on them, myself.

Since they are all published by the LDS- better to have documentation directly out of the mouth of Satan regarding his false religion- the truth from Scripture will refute the lies they have entangled themselves in.

Posts 744
Armin | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 8 2017 8:06 PM

I also hoped for faster progress. I placed my bid 4 (!) years ago.

Posts 10178
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 5:08 AM

"Better to have [out of date] documentation ..."

I think folks that come from a world of 'the original!' don't understand the problem of progressive revelation. Earlier revelation is interesting, but irrelevant.  And that should be obvious with Mormons, concerning multiple spouses, etc.

This same principle spoke to the success of the Montanists, as well as other revelation-from-the-Spirit groups.  If you watch current Mormons arguing between each other, there's rarely references to older revelations.

Regarding Mormon inconsistencies, this issue bedevelled the jews in the 2nd Temple period, and thense Christians in its early centuries. The solution was similar to the Mormons ... creeds.


Posts 301
David Wanat | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 9:58 AM

If one wants to compare the changes, I believe you can get the Book of Mormon/Doctrines and Covenants/Pearl of Great Price on Amazon for free.

Of course the current version of Doctrine and Covenants removed certain passages that were embarrassing (for example, decrees forbidding black people from their priesthood—the current version only has the change admitting them). So from a historical perspective I would be interested in the 1918 version to see the conflicts. 

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Posts 2693
DominicM | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 10:04 AM

Whilst they may be better tagged inside faithlife, should this fail most of these resources are available and could be PB'd - certainly availability of source of major items mentioned is not an issue 

Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have

Posts 1367
Ben | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 10:38 AM

It is extremely important to go to "original sources." But as Denise helpfully points out, Mormonism (unlike some other American-born religions like the JW and SDA) does *not* follow the typical static Protestant paradigm; it's its own unique beast and needs to be understood as such. Richard Mouw provides some useful observations on this here. Responsible readers and scholars (like Mouw) understand that every religious tradition needs to be studied on its own terms, and it does no one any favors to mispresent, even if unintentional. Some Evangelical scholars writing in Trinity Journal 20 years ago set out to debunk what they called some "myths" about Mormonism, e.g. 

"It is a myth that there are few, if any, traditional Mormon scholars with training in fields pertinent to evangelical-Mormon debates. It is a myth that when Mormons receive training in historiography, biblical languages, theology, and philosophy they invariably abandon traditional Latter-day Saints (LDS) beliefs in the historicity of the Book of Mormon and the prophethood of Joseph Smith. It is a myth that liberal Mormons have so shaken the foundations of LDS belief that Mormonism is crumbling apart. It is a myth that neoorthodox Mormons have influenced the theology of their church to such a degree that it will soon abandon traditional emphases and follow a path similar to the RLDS (Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) or the World-Wide Church of God. These are myths based upon ignorance and selective reading. Evangelicals who wish to be responsible must abandon them." 

So, if you want nice original historical sources, check out the Joseph Smith Papers Project. All holographs, all scanned, etc. http://www.josephsmithpapers.org

Second, for claims of hiding Mormon scripture changes, check out the Book of Mormon critical text project. Again, all changes tracked, scans, originals, etc. With a handful of exceptions, this is standard textual criticism cataloging variants due to 19th century hand-copying, hand-set type, etc. http://criticaltext.byustudies.byu.edu The linguistics prof. running that project also has a volume from Yale U. Press on the earliest text of the Book of Mormon, here.

Similarly for the the Doctrine and Covenants, you can find pdf copies of a BYU dissertation by Woodford, "Historical Development of the Doctrine & Covenants." It used to be available direcly from BYU Studies on a CD or download, but is now being surpassed by the JSPP. BTW, D&C never had any revelation about forbidding black ordination, and so never had any removed. For a history of race and Mormonism from Oxford Press, see here. (Edit: To be clear, it is correct that D&C now includes a short Official Declaration about it, but not that any prohibition was ever present in the volume.)

A bunch of this stuff has also been discussed in official and lay LDS publications, so many Mormons are aware in general, if not in detail. See for example, here or here.

Although this thread is quickly beginning to infringe the community guidelines, I decided to reply to correct simple misunderstandings and provide sources, no more.

EDIt: FWIW, I proposed a more current Mormon Collection list in 2014 in this thread here.

"The whole modern world has divided itself into Conservatives and Progressives. The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected."- G.K. Chesterton

Posts 3187
Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 11:53 AM

The tree grows from the root- not the other way around- and regardless- Mormonism is a "false religion" nothing Christian about except terminology- their words may resemble ours but the true meaning is far from it- also- how much cyanide does it take to poison the water to be deadly? A lie is a lie doesn't matter big or small.

I have the same issue with certain so-called christian cults- and will not mention so other will not freak-out- since its ok as long as we agree on the essentials- yea right!

Posts 1019
EastTN | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 12:00 PM

Ben,

Thank you for your thoughtful explanation of the context and relevance of these documents.  I very much agree that your proposed "Modern Mormonism" collection would be more useful.  I'm likely going to stay "in" on this one, though, simply because $30 doesn't seem an unreasonable price to me for the Book of Mormon, Peal of Great Price, and Doctrine and Covenants.  If I have to disregard the rest as too dated to be useful, so be it.  It won't be the first time I've gotten "filler" volumes that I didn't care about in a Logos bundle.

Posts 5250
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 1:53 PM

Whyndell Grizzard I respect your opinion but please remember this is suppose to be a theological discussion free zone. I am sure you can find debate and discussion on this topic in christian discourses (http://christiandiscourse.com) which FL set up for that purpose. This forum is suppose to be a safe spot primarily dealing with program/resource related items. We have had good Christians who were very helpful MVPs leave over the acrimony of some discussions. Please try to follow the forum guidelines.

-dan 

Phil Gons (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Jan 19 2010 11:23 AM | Locked

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Posts 3187
Whyndell Grizzard | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 9 2017 2:36 PM

Good grief get a life snowflake!

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