So long Logos4...

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LogosEmployee

The lineup of Windows 8 editions is explained here: http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b/bloggingwindows/archive/2012/04/16/announcing-the-windows-8-editions.aspx

You can see that only "Windows 8" and "Windows 8 Pro" support "Installation of x86/64 and desktop software" (e.g., Logos 4).

Posts 2736
Bohuslav Wojnar | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 11:26 PM

Bradley Grainger (Logos):

The lineup of Windows 8 editions is explained here: http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b/bloggingwindows/archive/2012/04/16/announcing-the-windows-8-editions.aspx

You can see that only "Windows 8" and "Windows 8 Pro" support "Installation of x86/64 and desktop software" (e.g., Logos 4).

Thank you Bradley for all your explanation. The good thing is that (if I understand it right) there will be tablets running on x86 platform and able to use Windows 8 with the PC version of Logos. I would be ready to put away my iPad to get this kind of a tablet :-)

Bohuslav

Posts 291
Bob Schlessman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 4:56 AM

DMB:
wouldn't we ALL like to have you helping us out on our PCs!! But with over a million accounts (users?), I don't think you could get around to optimize everyone's computer. It would definitely take you a while. And so the issue with 'software'.

YesBig Smile

Touche' DMB! Tou have just hit the nail on the head as to why there are still millions of people in this country who do not own or use personal computers. And the majority of people who do have them are not techies. Add to that the hodge-podge of bloatware that comes preinstalled by the major PC manufacturers and it's a recipe for frustration and disatisfied customers when a complex program like Logos 4 is installed.

As I reread my previous posts I realized that I may have sounded smug and arrogant. For that I do beg the forgiveness of the forum members.

Blessings,

Bob

Posts 7983
LogosEmployee

Bohuslav Wojnar:

Thank you Bradley for all your explanation. The good thing is that (if I understand it right) there will be tablets running on x86 platform and able to use Windows 8 with the PC version of Logos. I would be ready to put away my iPad to get this kind of a tablet :-)

Yes, that's correct. For example, the Microsoft Surface (http://www.microsoft.com/surface/) will come in a regular (ARM-based) and "Pro" (Intel-based) configuration. The "Surface Pro" will most likely be more expensive, but will be able to run Logos 4 and all your other desktop apps. (And there are already Intel-based tablets, like the Samsung Series 7 slate, that can be upgraded to run Windows 8.)

Posts 6481
Forum MVP
Lynden Williams | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 8:15 AM

Andrew Morgan:
I have finally come to the end of the road with Logos4.  What started as affection for Logos2/3 has descended into a deep hatred for Logos4.  Logos4 is a door to a gray building without a buzzer or door handle and a welcome mat the reads "Go away, I'm busy".

Andrew, were your issues resolved?

Everything ever written in Religion and Theology formatted for Logos Bible Software.Logos Youtube Channel

Posts 483
Gary Butner, Th.D. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 6 2012 4:46 AM

Andrew, I have used Logos since 1994. Initially, I purchased 3 additional Bible programs for evaluation, and it quickly became apparent Logos would be the best package in the long run. Over the years I encountered a few problems, but for the most part I was the problem. A call to Logos support or another user always solved the problem. 

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 6 2012 6:22 AM

Jason B:
When I called support, they started asking me questions about if Logos was working correctly or not, and I told her that I was pretty certain it was working just fine, just that it was me who was the problem, and that I just didn't understand how to use the tool correctly, and could she assist me with this problem?  Her prompt reply was that my issue was a training problem and that she could not help me, and then she pointed out the Morris Proctor training materials on the Logos website, as well as telling me I could watch the support videos and ask questions in the forums to learn how to use the program correctly.

That makes perfect sense to me. Technical support is for precisely that; technical support. It's not their role to provide free training in how to use the program, and the people selected for technical support are undoubtedly selected for their technical expertise not their training knowledge.

I consider the response you received to be entirely valid; they directed you towards both paid and free training resources which could answer your query. What they didn't do was say 'If you want to know that, you have to pay for it'.

Win 7 x64 | Core i7 3770K | 32GB RAM | GTX 750 Ti 2GB | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (system) | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (Logos) | WD Black 1.5 TB (storage) | WD Red 3 TB x 3 (storage) | HP w2408h 24" | First F301GD Live 30"

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 6 2012 6:51 AM

Bob Pritchett:

Jason B:
my only option left was to call support to see if they could help me understand how to construct my syntax query correctly

I'm very sorry that support wasn't able to help you. I must confess, though, that when I read that your question was about syntax queries, I understood why. Syntax queries are complicated, and it's hard to use them without a deep understanding of linguistics, or at least Greek and Hebrew. These are skills we do not require in our customer service or tech support teams; it would simply be too hard (and too expensive) to hire this expertise for phone support.

In fact, I'd say very few people here really understand syntax queries. Which sounds terrible, except that we also know (from stats reporting) that very, very few users even attempt to use them. They really are a specialist tool, and if I had to choose between having to staff the support department with people who could teach syntax searching and removing the feature, I'd have to remove it! :-)

Well said Bob. Syntax queries are highly complex, and require advanced knowledge. They certainly don't fall under 'technical support'.

 

Win 7 x64 | Core i7 3770K | 32GB RAM | GTX 750 Ti 2GB | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (system) | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (Logos) | WD Black 1.5 TB (storage) | WD Red 3 TB x 3 (storage) | HP w2408h 24" | First F301GD Live 30"

Posts 5
Charles Meyer | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 13 2012 9:40 AM

I have been using Logos since version 3 and I have installed Logos 4 at least 8 times (as a programmer I upgrade and re-install computers frequently),  I can verify several of the same problems he is having. 

a. No control over the download possess

b. No control over how much of the library gets downloaded (this is big for those with limited bandwidth and small hard drives) the problem gets bigger if you buy a bigger library

c. No control over where the library gets downloaded to (this is a very big problem for those who are using a small SSD for boot)

d. Downloads a second copy of everything if you log in as a different windows user and try to run Logos (even though you are using the same Logos user name)

e. Very little control over your library (no way to delete books)

f. Non-standard user interface! Creating an intuitive user interface is not about being simple or creative; its about doing things in the way the user is used to. (Yes, I design user interfaces for a living and I have never seen any other program use the same UI patterns as Logos 4)

That being said, I use Logos every day because it is such a powerful program, but I do understand his pain.

Posts 10524
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 13 2012 10:06 AM

Charles Meyer:
no way to delete books

It's called "hide" in L4. This removed the resource from your computer.

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 13 2012 11:37 AM

Irony defined:

Charles Meyer:
no way to delete books...Non-standard user interface!

Jack Caviness:
It's called "hide" in L4..

Big Smile

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 13 2012 12:18 PM

Paul Golder:

Irony defined:

Charles Meyer:
no way to delete books...Non-standard user interface!

Jack Caviness:
It's called "hide" in L4..

Big Smile

Yes

Posts 533
Jonathan Burke | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 17 2012 8:55 AM

I have a lot of sympathy for the original poster, and for similar comments in this thread. When L4 came out, it was seriously broken. By that I mean it lacked a significant number of features which were standard in L3, features which were not merely cosmetic or a different way of doing the same things.

It took a long time for these features to be included in L4, and during that time the program was extremely frustrating to use. Some feature, such as the PBB, didn't appear until an incredibly long time.

However, once most of those features were included, L4 was clearly a massive improvement over L3, and the only real issue which remained was learning the new system. That learning curve was steep, but paid off well.

Win 7 x64 | Core i7 3770K | 32GB RAM | GTX 750 Ti 2GB | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (system) | Crucial m4 256GB SSD (Logos) | WD Black 1.5 TB (storage) | WD Red 3 TB x 3 (storage) | HP w2408h 24" | First F301GD Live 30"

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