Your input needed: Faithlife Study Bible

Page 2 of 10 (183 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last »
This post has 182 Replies | 13 Followers

Posts 1880
Philana Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 2:20 PM

Into Grace:

Tom Castle:

Just to be sure, I went through the process again to see if I had to enter anything... Clearly, from the screenshot, you can see that no payment is due and I was not asked for a CC.

If I recall correctly, I had to provide a credit card when I created the account a few months back.

 

I have signed up several people and never once did I have to enter a credit card.

Posts 679
Into Grace | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 2:24 PM

Philana Crouch:

Into Grace:

Tom Castle:

Just to be sure, I went through the process again to see if I had to enter anything... Clearly, from the screenshot, you can see that no payment is due and I was not asked for a CC.

If I recall correctly, I had to provide a credit card when I created the account a few months back.

 

I have signed up several people and never once did I have to enter a credit card.

I stand corrected then.

Posts 1880
Philana Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 2:24 PM

Tom Castle:

It is actually FREE for the next 9 months.

That only takes you to March 2013 so adding 12 months it's FREE for the next 21 months. 

Posts 397
T Gerold Castle | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 2:31 PM

Philana Crouch:

Tom Castle:

It is actually FREE for the next 9 months.

That only takes you to March 2013 so adding 12 months it's FREE for the next 21 months. 

Indeed!

In HIS Eternal Service,
Tom Castle
**If we will do God's work, in God's way, at God's time, with God's power, we shall have God's blessings!!**

Posts 325
Robert Wazlavek | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 3:39 PM

Tes:

I agree with you.

I second that.

 

Into Grace, I know you're upset about the nontransferability of Logos Academic items.  But don't misplace your frustration and see everything that Logos does as underhanded.  It's been made clear from the start that the Faithlife Study Bible would be subscription based, and that you get it free for a period of time with the promo code.

Posts 325
Robert Wazlavek | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 3:43 PM

Bob,

For those of us who signed up for the FSB before the free period was extended to March 2014, do we need to resubscribe or anything?  Or are you saying that no one will be changed until 2014 at all right now?

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 4:03 PM

First, 'free until 2014' can mean two things:
  - An annual subscription is free for 20 months but the 21st begins the charge.
 OR
 - Any users signing on before March 2014 have free use of it period.

Doesn't matter for me; I downloaded it. Decided I don't need the regurgitated evangelical theology that re-writes the text, and put it in the hidden resources where I hope it will stay.

My only concern now is I hope 20 months from now it doesn't wake up and start charging my credit card.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 325
Robert Wazlavek | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 4:21 PM

DMB:

My only concern now is I hope 20 months from now it doesn't wake up and start charging my credit card.

That would be great!  I've been under the impression that we all get it for free until March 2014 when everyone will be charged.  But if everyone who signs up until then got it for free with no subscription ever necessary, as a "gift to beta users" or something like that, that would be really cool.

Posts 679
Into Grace | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 4:45 PM

Into Grace:

Bob,

Why do you keep calling Faithlife "free". A credit card is required with an agreement to an upcoming annual subscription. A person does not own anything. After the trial runs out you start charging an annual subscription. Should they decide to opt out, they have nothing. Logos would have a lot more credibility if they were truthful. Your program is free for nothing.

 

Bob,

If I offended you or anyone else with what I stated above, I apologize. As a Christian I am accountable to God and others for what I say.

In Christ

Posts 325
Robert Wazlavek | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 4:53 PM

Into Grace:

Bob,

If I offended you or anyone else with what I stated above, I apologize. As a Christian I am accountable to God and others for what I say.

In Christ

Your humility is refreshing, to say the least.

Posts 453
Mike S. | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 5:05 PM

Bob Pritchett:

We know that some free mobile Bible apps have had as many as 40 million downloads. With a great study Bible, media, Bible dictionary, devotional content, and more, the FSB is an even more useful tool – and it is also free.

Remember, you are VERY late to the game and net new adoption is rare and difficult. You're no longer trying to get people to adopt something new (a different challenge), you're trying to get them to convert. Conversion is difficult... and, frankly, the free subscription model vs the free "ownership" model is a serious barrier to conversions. More savvy thinkers may understand that the "ownership" model is as much a subscription as your model, but the vendor handles it and it "feels" more free (LOL). 

Your content is better, features new and exciting, and the opportunity for expansion and growth is fantastic. In a head to head competition that looks at what you get for what you pay for, you win... until. You see that plenty, if not most of your competitors provide a translation that is widely adopted for free, and you ask $4.99. A fantastic price without a doubt, but why should a user convert from free access, doing 80% of what they want in the existing app, to pay? Also remember that there's a very good chance that they have a community around them that already use the free-free app. So conversion requires evangelists with a strong community and communication around the platform you're trying to encourage conversion towards.   

Another challenge: you're "competing" against non-profits with a mission to get the Word into people's hands at as low a cost as possible. As a business, you have the higher value, more attractive product, but you have to convert people from "free" to "some-undetermined-future-subscription-price" (perception, not necessarily reality... consumers aren't use to doing business with Logos!). 

Bob Pritchett:
How can we tell people outside our existing Logos user base?

You need to find the evangelists for this product, not the Portfolio base package... people who will add no more then a hundred dollars in resources over a couple years and be excited about it. 

The product offering is muddled and complicated. Simplify and focus message. 

Bob Pritchett:
What would we need to say / do / offer to reach the people you go to church with? Have you already told them? Why or why not?

I've had in depth discussions with leadership at my church and they've seen it as "yet another portal" or "yet another Facebook" and they're having a tough enough time managing multiple media platforms as it stands today. . . I've tried explaining how it is different and can be complementary, but first impressions and the majority of content is around trying to be a community product. 

N.B. they have NEVER seen it as an entry level electronic bible study competitor. This is a marketing/message problem!

Bob Pritchett:
The FSB is our biggest content project ever, and we have a lot of marketing effort coming up. But we started with our existing user base, and have been surprised at how quiet the response (and sharing with others) has been. I think there are some community pricing titles that get more buzz! [smile]

I must say that I LOVE the content myself. I love the UIX for the commentary/bible dictionary; I think it should eventually replace the Logos mobile app experience. 

One issue: you started with "keep it quiet" and so I largely have kept it quiet. 

Another: again with the muddled product offering and future, and again with the difficulty of conversion... constantly get the "here's what I use" and no one I've talked to is looking for something else (sometimes something more, but not enough that they're looking for something else).

Bob Pritchett:
Why? Is it that FSB isn’t targeted at our core customers? (Even if you don’t want a study Bible, have you checked out the Lexham Bible Dictionary?) Are we not describing it well? Is the message lost among our other communications? Does the product not seem right for your friends?

You are not describing it well. I don't see how this fits in the continuum of bible study/reading software you sell. 

Bob Pritchett:
I’d appreciate hearing your thoughts, as well as feedback on the FSB itself.

I actually have high hopes for FSB if you can find the right model and get the conversions you need to gain momentum. 

Truth be told, I would LOVE to be the product manager for this product! Having done product management/marketing of this kind of work for things I don't have near that amount of passion for, I suspect the biggest (internal) issues are related to the huge focus on building more and more content to sell to Logos users -- predictable ROI, easy upsell, and minimal risk... why invest in the low end with small returns, high cost, and high comparative risk? That's going to require absolute clarity of vision and evangelism on your part and some muting of the Logos Base Package drumbeat. I don't think this has to be at the expense of the Logos user market at all, but I constantly see you trying to sell $500 in bible software to people who are currently happy with free. They need to understand what they're missing, give them a viable entry point, and then you can take people up the value chain. 

There's also, I think, untapped synergy between Logos, FSB and Proclaim. You could also stand to better partner with some of the community platforms out there (not FB, but like PCO and CCB). 

All this and I'm guessing you don't want a software professional's feedback, but the "man on the street" Logos user! I hope this is helpful. Feel free to contact me via email if you prefer.

 

 

Posts 2459
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 7:43 PM

Ironically, just on Tuesday of this week I created a PDF flyer from the email that I received about the promo code. In my flyer I told our congregation that I am a happy LOGOS user for many years but that it is not very affordable for casual bible readers. I briefly explained FSB as a study Bible designed for those who use a tablet (about 5% of our worship attendance). This e-flyer will be attached to our weekly bulletin that is emailed to our entire congregation on Friday this week and next.

I signed up for my FSB promo in early May but waited until after the v.1.0 designation before deciding to recommend it to others. Waited until the email came that I could cut and paste the marketing material with embedded links into a PDF that would be visually compelling to email to our congregation.

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 679
Into Grace | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jul 4 2012 8:14 PM

Here is my 2 cents. (If I have any credibility left Embarrassed )

"There is nothing new under the sun" Book of Ecclesiastes. Copy the successful business model used by Apple software developers. Create two Faithlife applications, one free and one premium. The free edition would be limited so potential customers can test it and fall in love with the features and decide to buy.

The premium edition would be a one-time charge. The market does not support annual subscription type software. People want to own products; this is how the Apple and Android market work. Successful software developers make money by volume selling. If a product is great, and continues to get better over time, more and more will join and the positive rating will follow. Who would not want the Faithlife application once it's improved for say, a one-time price of $9.99? Once Logos sells several thousand copies, they break even and it turns profitable; this includes additional new customers for the flagship product, Logos Bible Software.  

In Christ!

 

Posts 286
James Hudson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 3:55 PM

For me plain and simple, it's the subscription model.

I agree with the above:

, frankly, the free subscription model vs the free "ownership" model is a serious barrier to conversions. More savvy thinkers may understand that the "ownership" model is as much a subscription as your model, but the vendor handles it and it "feels" more free (LOL).

 

I like to "pay once and own forever" with all I buy.

Every blessing,

James

 

 

Posts 948
Everett Headley | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 4:22 PM

For what it's worth, Bob:

1.  I'm not sure of the source of the information or its theological leanings.  Unknowns like this make it very difficult to trust it.  If it's purely factual information or diagrams only, the distrust decreases.  Yet, I have a study Bible to help me in those times that I don't have time to get into my Logos library and dig deeper, like during sermons or other teaching times.  So maybe perhaps the idea of something like this being instantly available might be burdensome for the person trying to use it during those times; outside of those, its use is probably eclipsed for the reason I shared above.

2.  Subscription service?  Like nearly everyone else,  I want to pay for it and own it forever, that's when ownership occurs.

3.  How can it have notes and community notes but we can't in the Android app?  I feel like a faithful user of Logos has been set aside in this case and replaced by what your own priorities.  I would think you would perfect what you have before adding to.  The Android guys says its still months before we will have this feature in the app.  Sorry for the rant, but you asked for my thoughts.

Posts 3205
Tes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 4:36 PM

James Hudson:
I like to "pay once and own forever" with all I buy.

I agree with you 100%.

Blessings in Christ.

Posts 29798
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 5:28 PM

Everett Headley:
How can it have notes and community notes but we can't in the Android app?  I feel like a faithful user of Logos has been set aside in this case and replaced by what your own priorities.  I would think you would perfect what you have before adding to.  The Android guys says its still months before we will have this feature in the app.

I can't speak definitively but Bob has said that, at least on the iOS side of things, the faithlife app development will drive the development of the other two apps. Since the apps will use much of the same code, the development of the faithlife app is really helping the development of the Logos app.

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 236
David Ladiges | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jul 5 2012 7:15 PM

Into Grace:
If I recall correctly, I had to provide a credit card when I created the account a few months back.

If you added any other Bible to your cart that had a price > 0 or if you arrived at this page and then entered the coupon code or entered an invalid or mistyped coupon code on the home page, you may have been presented a credit card entry form. So you may have seen an credit card form, but if you enter the coupon code on the home page while logged in to logos.com or enter the FREE code on this page, you should arrive at a screen similar to the above image.

Posts 483
Gary Butner, Th.D. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 6 2012 4:09 AM

DMB:

Am sure you'll get a lot of input.

But for me, the $30/year subscription cost meant 'don't get involved'.  Usually when I plug in a resource, I want it to be a long-term go-to solution.

Thinking about this some more, and already being solidly 5-figures into Logos, the subscription is actually pretty peanuty (by comparison). So I suppose I haven't crossed the 'subscription' model yet. I do subscribe to JBL but some years yes, some no.

Later: I downloaded the free version. It did download immediately. I'm studying in the syriac Luke and on opening the study Bible it popped to where I was studying. Scanning down, it's a typical study Bible (easy to quickly read and get the key points). But I also notice when the going gets rough, like most of today's study Bibles, it waters Jesus down to middle-class palatability. I suppose that's ok for the group intended; certainly not my call anyway.

Bob, I think DMB's statement regarding the Jesus of the FSB reflects my views, without going into details.

Posts 7
Joel Bennett | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jul 6 2012 10:29 PM

Bob Pritchett:

FSB supports private and community notes; you can have all private notes. It's your choice. And your notes aren't locked up -- even if you didn't subscribe to the FSB in the future, you'd still have your notes in Logos, attached to any Bible (including free ones) you wanted, or available through the notes documents UI.

See, that's great! Make it say that clearly somewhere....

One thing that I noticed is that when I want to "use" FSB I have choices with confusing features that make no sense to me: an app for my phone, Biblia.com, Logos.

First: I already had Logos and Vyrso on my phone, can you guys please find a way to differentiate these three apps and help me understand why there are three instead of one?

Second: when I use Biblia.com, I have tons of Bibles (including a bunch that I haven't paid for, and a few that I have), I have so much content that I had to use search in the second pane to even find the new FSB content.  When I use Logos on my desktop (or my phone), I only have access to the translations that I've bought. When I go to FSB on my phone, I only had Lexham (after a while I found the spot to pick my translation and switch).

At the end of the day, it's a little confusing what FSB *is* --  Is it notes? Is it a Bible? If it's notes, why am I renting instead of buying like I do all the other Logos content?  I've seen in several places the phrase "pick your translation" but only on the checkout page did I find out I had to PAY (again?) to pick the translation I wanted.  The prices are cheap, I was already worried about that whole "free until ..." bit, and cheap is not free, and I guessed that I would be renting them (and loosing access to them if I decide not to pay the annual FSB fee), so I decided to try it with just the Lexham translation...

 

Page 2 of 10 (183 items) < Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last » | RSS