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Posts 725
Harry Hahne | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 28 2009 5:37 PM | Locked

MJ. Smith:

Harry Hahne:
there should be some logic to the arrangement of words and the sizes of words

There is - the computer is simply following a detailed algorithm. However, just like compare versions the algorithm has not been shared with us.

It is clearly not frequency of words in the passage, since the one of the most common words in the verse I am looking at ("God") is not even included. Nor does it seem to be based on frequency in the New Testament, since very common words can be very small or large. The visual layout of the translations in the Bible Word Study in version 3 communicates relative frequency of translation through the word size, which is useful information.

Posts 1341
PL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 28 2009 5:56 PM | Locked

I had always assumed -- rightly or wrongly -- that Interesting Words follow an algorithm similar to Amazon.com's "Statistically Improbable Phrase" (SIP) -- http://www.amazon.com/gp/search-inside/sipshelp.html/ref=sib_sip_help

So, my understanding -- again, could be completely off base -- is that if two words both appear only once in a passage, the one that occurs less frequently in the rest of the Bible (or the rest of the library?) would get a larger display size, because it is more "statistically significant."

Would be curious if Team Logos could confirm or refute this theory...

Peter

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 29 2009 3:34 AM | Locked

I guess the whole "important words" thing is lost on me....

I just don't get it.

Because a word is used a lot doesn't mean it has any importance....nor does lack of use say anything either...

I just don't see how this whole idea is valuable... Embarrassed

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 26511
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 29 2009 11:31 AM | Locked

Robert Pavich:
I just don't see how this whole idea is valuable...

Where I have seen it applied usefully is in studies relating to dating or indicating authorship. It is part of a whole collection of text analysis that has expanded its use dramatical with computer text analysis tools - an area in which I can display a great deal of ignorance.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 139
Sean Boisen | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 29 2009 8:00 PM | Locked

Chris Elford:
Not sure why the "Key topic" is not part of the "collage."

I haven't actually seen the new presentation yet, but the reason for separating "key topics" out is that they were manually selected, hence higher quality (and therefore there are also relatively few of them). By contrast, the other topics are automatically dervied from dictionary content.

Posts 139
Sean Boisen | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 29 2009 8:03 PM | Locked

PeterLi:
So, my understanding -- again, could be completely off base -- is that if two words both appear only once in a passage, the one that occurs less frequently in the rest of the Bible (or the rest of the library?) would get a larger display size, because it is more "statistically significant."

Peter:

Without going into the fine details of the algorithm, at a conceptual level you're correct: it's comparing local frequencies (within the passage) to those outside the passage.

Posts 725
Harry Hahne | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 30 2009 9:52 AM | Locked

Clinton Thomas:
Text so small as to be unreadable unless the guide is opened up in a large window.

One idea that would help view small topics would be for the software to show the topic in a balloon window if you hover over the word/phrase, much like it does for abbreviations and Bible verses in various reference books.

Posts 386
Clinton Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 30 2009 11:11 AM | Locked

Harry Hahne:
if you hover over the word/phrase

Hi,

I completely disagree with a user having to do this.

A user should not have to do anything to view the primary data that is returned by a tool (maybe scroll if there is too much of it to display on one screen).

If the user wants more inofrmation, then hovering over a piece of information should bring it up, but to have the primary data be a random scratch that is too faint to read, or too small to read, is not right.

Llike the wordle website says, 'wordle is a toy'

Regards,

Clinton

 

Posts 7
Victor Dela Cruz | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 7 2010 8:20 AM | Locked

Anyone know where I can go to get a more detailed explanation (help site) of how I can use the topics (in its current graphics format) and interesting words?

Posts 26511
Forum MVP
MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 7 2010 10:43 PM | Locked

Clinton Thomas:
A user should not have to do anything to view the primary data that is returned by a tool (maybe scroll if there is too much of it to display on one screen).

I've been mulling this over as a minor fan of the wordle. It reminds me of my first introduction to a data mining tool whose diagrams reminded me of drawings with the spirograph toy - or a swinging pendulum. I slowly learned to "read" the diagram to see how breaks in the pattern were where I needed to drill down to see "real" information. Over time I gained an ability to "read" the diagram at a glance and "know" when to move on and when to dig.

It seems to me that the same thing holds true for some of the Logos graphics. To me, the prepositions chart is actually the least "readable" - but I know that is because I don't yet know how to "read" it.  My point is that any "new visualization" we need to give a chance. What appears meaningless may become intuitive and useful. It's all in the communication

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 3578
steve clark | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 7:38 AM | Locked

I have a difficult time reading these charts. I am slightly dyslexic. Also on computers with smaller screens the smaller words are difficult to read.

QLinks, Bibl2, LLR, Macros
Dell Insp 17-5748, i5, 1.7 GHz, 8G RAM, win 8.1

Posts 408
Ken Shawver | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:36 PM | Locked

Damian McGrath:

Greg, how come yours is readable? Mine looks like this:

Damian, maybe it has to do with the varying degrees of gravitational pull between where you are and Logos HQ Stick out tongue?

In Christ,

Ken

Dell Studio 1555; 15.6 True Life LCD; Intel Core 2 Duo T6600 2.20 GHz, 2M Cache, 800 MHz FSB ; 500GB 5400 HDD; 8GB RAM, Win 10, Chrome 70

http://wiki.logos.com/

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