Zondervan Biblical Languages

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This post has 18 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 688
Robert Peters | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Aug 27 2013 3:49 PM

Since there is no discount on this product, even academic discount is zero. Do you guys plan to release these titles individually in the future? 600+ is hard to come out of pocket

Posts 571
Martin Grainger Dean | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 3:57 PM
Robert Peters:
Since there is no discount on this product, even academic discount is zero. Do you guys plan to release these titles individually in the future? 600+ is hard to come out of pocket
Yes
Posts 408
Erik | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 4:08 PM

I really want this but I'll wait and see if it ever goes on sale again.  In the meantime I'll make do with my hard copies and Pradis versions, etc.

Posts 3093
Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 4:29 PM

This has been beaten about the head and shoulders in many threads.  My particular pet thread is here-

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/74054.aspx

For the life of me, I can't understand what logic would suggest they'd sell more with the Gk and Heb bundled together.

I'll bet my lunch money they'll sell a lot more copies of parts, if unbundled, than they'd sell whole.  I'm guessing this is a Zondervan issue, not a Logos issue, but the bottom line is the same...allow Logos to unbundle and make more $$.

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 5:44 PM

Doc B:
I'm guessing this is a Zondervan issue, not a Logos issue, but the bottom line is the same...allow Logos to unbundle and make more $$.

If past practice is any indication it will be broken up. The Zondervan Reference Bundle was released in the same fashion.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 501
SteveHD | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 6:27 PM

I just cancelled my order so they can get a better picture of who just wants one or the other but not both. If I see the single language offered I will order it. Otherwise I will wait to see if Olive Tree offers something competitive.

Posts 2772
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 9:04 PM

The reality is that a serious seminary student is going to take both Greek and Hebrew for more than one semester.

If that isn't what they are going to do, they can save a whole bigger pile of money and find another vocation. 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 172
CL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 27 2013 10:15 PM

This is not marketing rocket science. They put everything together at first and try to make profit that way and then when that has run dry, they will split up the package. It makes perfect sense, but for those who are in a hurry to get particular titles and aren't willing or unable to shell out the cash, must wait until then.

Reality hurts sometimes...!

Posts 2513
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 28 2013 8:15 AM

 

mab:

The reality is that a serious seminary student is going to take both Greek and Hebrew for more than one semester.

If that isn't what they are going to do, they can save a whole bigger pile of money and find another vocation. 

Just because a "serious seminary student" is going to take both Greek and Hebrew does not guarantee that this is a good deal. My Greek profs did not use any of these texts in the 3 semester of Greek (one of the resources was highly recommended as a supplement text to get some time) and my Hebrew Prof only used one volume from this collection. This is why it needs to be broken up.

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 28 2013 10:00 AM

David Thomas:
Just because a "serious seminary student" is going to take both Greek and Hebrew does not guarantee that this is a good deal. My Greek profs did not use any of these texts in the 3 semester of Greek (one of the resources was highly recommended as a supplement text to get some time) and my Hebrew Prof only used one volume from this collection. This is why it needs to be broken up.

Just because seminary students are slaves to whatever text their professors use does not mean others do not want these resources. Big Smile And seminary students are not the only ones who learn Greek and Hebrew. My homeschooled children start Greek in elementary school. I was very happy to pick up this Bundle. Now that I saved a bundle on the Bundle, I hope they split it up for the rest who don't want everything.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 2513
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 28 2013 10:32 AM

Super Tramp:

Now that I saved a bundle on the Bundle, I hope they split it up for the rest who don't want everything.

I'm glad the bundle was available on pre-pub for those who want the whole thing. I don't think it should be an either/or proposition (either bundle or individual). My preference would be individual resources available for a certain price, small bundles (beg Greek, adv Greek, beg Hebrew, adv Hebrew) for a small discount [say 10%] and "the whole enchilada" for a deep discount [say 30%]. This keeps an incentive to "buy in bulk" while enabling the purchaser who wants to pay the "single-can convenience store price" to be able to do so. I realize that my proposal is more complicated and I realize there are both Logos and Publisher restrictions, but I also think it is more customer friendly.

Of course those with Academic pricing should be able to get either the single resource, micro bundle or mega bundle for 40%-50% off retail Big Smile

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 482
elnwood | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 28 2013 11:05 AM

Doc B:

For the life of me, I can't understand what logic would suggest they'd sell more with the Gk and Heb bundled together.

I'll bet my lunch money they'll sell a lot more copies of parts, if unbundled, than they'd sell whole.  I'm guessing this is a Zondervan issue, not a Logos issue, but the bottom line is the same...allow Logos to unbundle and make more $$.

I'm guessing it's a Logos issue, not a Zondervan issue. Zondervan doesn't sell their books in massive bundles through other retailers, and I don't know any other book seller that's as bundle-happy as Logos.

Posts 2772
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 28 2013 10:53 PM

For those who don't want bundles, they always have the option of getting on with a print copy for the duration. It's been quite some time that these resources haven't been in Logos. Somehow the world managed with only print copies. 

Logos has to pay the freight of literally republishing everything and relies on bundles to get these projects into production and rewards those who help them do it. This is nothing new. 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 2589
Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 2:21 AM

mab:

The reality is that a serious seminary student is going to take both Greek and Hebrew for more than one semester.

If that isn't what they are going to do, they can save a whole bigger pile of money and find another vocation. 

What's that got to do with seminary, and more pertinently, what's that got to do with the inherent worth of this bundle?

I find that this view of yours (taken together with two similar posts on the Zondervan bundle elsewhere) is extreme, and not very well-reasoned at all.

Do you have a corner on seminary education that the world knows nothing about? Is it particularly God-honouring to buy this bundle? I don't see any correlation.

It's fine if you like this bundle and it serves your needs. If you want to widen your situation to all seminarians at large etc. you need to marshal something more compelling than throw-away platitudes. As you've noted yourself, the world has survived long enough without this bundle.

Posts 590
Bobby Terhune | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 5:22 AM

Lee,

I think the issue is more related to Logos desire to get more titles into production by using the bundle method. if they chose to start with listing just individual titles, then most would cherry pick the offerings and a lot of titles just would not have the interest to go into production.

The is one of the reasons old testament commentaries are often bundled with the new testament, then everything gets into production. I think the same goes for author collections and so forth.

Logos answer for what you want is to wait 6 months for the collection to be broken up. But sometimes they do so earlier. I think what they are doing is in the end giving us access to a lot more titles than the competition can hope to offer. By only offering select titles (cherry picking) such as Olive Tree and Accordance offer, means many less popular titles will never make it to their platform.

Posts 2589
Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 5:50 AM

Knew that already! Smile

Posts 482
elnwood | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 9:12 AM

mab:

The reality is that a serious seminary student is going to take both Greek and Hebrew for more than one semester.

When I went through seminary, we used Mounce for Greek. However, when I went through Hebrew, we didn't use Pratico/Van Pelt. People who study both Greek and Hebrew have legitimate reasons for only wanting the Greek resources, or only wanting the Hebrew resources. I took four classes in each of Greek and Hebrew. Of all the resources in the bundle, the only ones required for my seminary education was the Mounce grammar and workbook.

That's the main problem with bundling. People are forced to buy resources they don't need to get the product that they want. Students who are cash strapped are disproportionately affected because they have to buy books in time for certain classes.

Posts 2513
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 9:28 AM

 

elnwood:

Students who are cash strapped are disproportionately affected because they have to buy books in time for certain classes.

Yes

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 590
Bobby Terhune | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 29 2013 9:44 AM

I think a good compromise for Logos is to make an exception for Academic students. after all they are going to break the collections up anyways.

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