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Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Jan 31 2014 2:31 PM

I keep separate note files for books of the bible and when rereading and adding notes to an older Notes document, I noticed what looks like a change in the format. Normally I wouldn't really care, but since my notes take upwards of 1-1/2 minutes or more to display, and I probably have several note files with both formats, I was wondering if any of the Logos developers could shed some light on whether or not the different formats in my Notes files could contribute to the slow display of my highlights.

I am including a screenshot with my own highlights and notes. It appears that previously, if a highlighted section went beyond one carriage return, as is common in some styles, like Proverbs, only the first line of the highlight is in the "highlight" field and the rest of the highlight is in the "note" field. In more current highlights, the highlight is only in the "highlight" field and does not "spill over" into the "note" field.

Comments?

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 2:58 PM

Bill Stevener:
I was wondering if any of the Logos developers could shed some light on whether or not the different formats in my Notes files could contribute to the slow display of my highlights.

I don't think so. The reason for the slowness is likely:

  1. The size of your note document (i.e. "Notes on Proverbs".)
  2. The number of notes within a given resource (i.e. your "NASB" bible)
  3. A combination of #1 & 2. 

The mobile app is highly susceptible to performance issues when you have large note files. Personally, I create a new note document for each resource (i.e. "The Peacemaker" by Ken Sande). I change translations each year for devotional reading, and by the end of the year I delete the note document, because by that time notes take forever to appear.

I don't think I have seen the behavior you are showing. Out of curiosity: Do ALL of your highlights come from the iOS mobile app? If not, what other apps & devices do you take notes with? Do you have any idea how old the "old" notes are? Do you see this behavior ONLY within the NASB? 

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Posts 132
Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 3:35 PM

I have made most of the highlights from the ios mobile app, going back about two years.

I also have "notes" where the highlighted portion was two verses (John 1:40-41, for example), and when I look at the note, either in the desktop version (L4) or the ios version, the note I wrote appears after verse 41, which appears in the "Note" section. This is really strange!

And yes, I have only seen this with the NASB, but that is where most of my notes and highlights are. I have some notes and highlights in other references, but they do not normally cross a carriage return boundary (as do the verses in the NASB display), and if that indeed is the trigger that allows/forces highlighted areas to spill into the notes area, I would not have seen it in the other references.

Being a former programmer, I know data file formats can change and in-line converters in the code can help read older versions of files when the formats change, but that takes time... hence my question about whether or not mixing the old format (highlights spilling into the notes area when a carriage return is found) and new format (keeping highlights and notes separate) might be slowing things down.

If I add a highlight and wait the 1-1/2 to 2 minutes for the update, than add another highlight, it still takes another 1-1/2 to 2 minutes to update, as if it is reindexing everything every time. I understand the more notes you have, whether they are in one large note file or many smaller note files, the longer it will take to update. I would have thought some optimization could occur such that if you add a new highlight to the same resource it would not have to reindex everything each time.

Posts 132
Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 3:37 PM

BTW - I still have L4 because I run Windows XP on my desktop machine and Logos 5 will not run with Windows XP.

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:02 PM

Bill Stevener:
I still have L4 because I run Windows XP on my desktop machine and Logos 5 will not run with Windows XP.

That shouldn't matter... although at some point in the near future, the mobile app might not be able to sync with some/all features within L4. [There hasn't been an official announcement about how the mobile apps might interact with the soon-to-be unsupported L4.]

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:08 PM

Bill Stevener:
And yes, I have only seen this with the NASB, but that is where most of my notes and highlights are.

I am curious if this is a resource specific issue. It would be interesting to hear from other users who have been using the NASB for some time.

Bill Stevener:
If I add a highlight and wait the 1-1/2 to 2 minutes for the update, than add another highlight, it still takes another 1-1/2 to 2 minutes to update, as if it is reindexing everything every time. I understand the more notes you have, whether they are in one large note file or many smaller note files, the longer it will take to update. I would have thought some optimization could occur such that if you add a new highlight to the same resource it would not have to reindex everything each time.

Logos will have to respond, but I don't think this is an indexing issue. I have been wrong before though. Surprise

If you want to experience quick highlighting, I think you can. Do the following:

  1. Choose a resource you have NEVER used.
  2. Make a highlighting selection, but make sure to create a brand new note document.

The highlight should appear instantaneously. I would be very surprised if it did not. If the note doesn't appear very quickly, select the highlight to edit it, and verify which document it was saved to.

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Posts 593
Drew Hannay | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:15 PM

Re: old vs new style highlights

I believe there used to be a bug in that the iOS apps created highlights differently than the other platforms (which was incorrect). That bug has since been fixed, and I bet that's why you're seeing two different styles (although I don't have time right now to go back through the old code and see how exactly iOS was improperly creating the highlights). That being said, the actual format of the note files hasn't changed, so there's nothing to convert. The old incorrectly made highlights are indistinguishable from new and correct highlights, so there's not really anything we can do to fix them.

The slowness is a separate issue, and it's on the short list of things to work on.

Posts 132
Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:19 PM

Yes, I have created highlights in other documents, and whether I use a new Note document or one with existing notes (20-50 notes, for example), the highlighting is very fast, so I know it is because I have so many notes attached to the NASB. Many are notes from daily readings, many are notes from sermons I have listened to, and others are notes from messages I have prepared.

I am looking at issues which may make the problems worse (like mixed data formats in the notes files, reindexing when not necessary, etc) yet are addressable. Deleting large batches of notes is not an option I want to consider at this time. Geeked

Posts 132
Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:22 PM

Drew Hannay:
The slowness is a separate issue, and it's on the short list of things to work on.

This would make me (and I'm sure many others) very happy!  Party!!!

Posts 1823
mike | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:40 PM

Drew Hannay:

Re: old vs new style highlights

 That being said, the actual format of the note files hasn't changed, so there's nothing to convert. The old incorrectly made highlights are indistinguishable from new and correct highlights, so there's not really anything we can do to fix them.

Sad

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 4:50 PM

Bill Stevener:
Deleting large batches of notes is not an option I want to consider at this time. Geeked

I wasn't meaning to imply that you should. Smile

My Bible reading highlights were not particularly profound, nor well thought out. They were just things that caught my attention in a devotional read through. If/When Drew is able to get around to some serious performance enhancements, I might consider taking a better stab at it. Stick out tongue

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Posts 132
Bill Stevener | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 5:14 PM

Drew Hannay:
That being said, the actual format of the note files hasn't changed, so there's nothing to convert. The old incorrectly made highlights are indistinguishable from new and correct highlights, so there's not really anything we can do to fix them.

Interesting, because as I mentioned, I have some "notes" where the highlighted portion of the resource spills into the note portion of the note, and the note I wrote follows the part that spilled into the note field... and the highlighting in the resource still highlights the correct part!

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 31 2014 5:29 PM

Bill Stevener:
Interesting, because as I mentioned, I have some "notes" where the highlighted portion of the resource spills into the note portion of the note, and the note I wrote follows the part that spilled into the note field... and the highlighting in the resource still highlights the correct part!

The highlight, the note title, and the note field are all unconnected. You can delete the note title (the first line) and rename it anything you want. You can completely delete the note field. 

To further complicate things... Highlights created within L4/L5 should truncate the highlighted section within the note title through the use of an ellipses. Highlights made on mobile (at least on the iOS app) do not. This is considered a "bug" by Logos within the mobile app. 

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