Looks like Zondervan bought themselves some Bible software...

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This post has 85 Replies | 6 Followers

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 6 2014 11:20 PM

It is not Zondervan's policy is to allow dynamic pricing. 

Posts 19039
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 6 2014 11:37 PM

David Paul:

It is not Zondervan's policy is to allow dynamic pricing. 

I know it isn't now. But that was the gist of my post. (Perhaps I wasn't clear enough.) I hope that "growing the relationship" means that in the future they will allow dynamic pricing. I'm not holding my breath, though.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 3:24 AM

Rosie Perera:
Here's a link for Zondervan (set to show only the titles you don't own yet):

Thanks for that link Rosie. Out of curiosity I went there and discovered a highly desirable resource I did not realize Logos carried. And it was only $2.99 more than my Birthday credit Party!!!

Posts 2829
Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 4:55 AM

What really seems to drive the Bible software market these days is content - people don't want to buy the same book multiple times, so it's hard to switch. You can bet the software companies like Logos know that. So if the Bible software market proves to be of a size that's worth going after for a new comer or an also-ran, the key is (1) good software (2) be able, both by license and through software, to convert existing resources to a new format. If you could move from software product A to B and take your resources, it's a new ball game.

Now this is a very daunting task and license issues most certainly prevent it today I would think, but none of these problems are insurmountable if money can be applied to the solution - money to influence publishers to modify licenses, and money for the technology team to convert resources. But this could happen if the market gets big enough - it has happened in quite a few software markets where the conversion challenges are much more substantial than in this market IMHO.

I welcome the competition. While I love Logos, I grow very tired of the lack of attention of so many usability things (my personal pet peeves these days are the long-standing lack of attention on Personal Books, Info Pane is unusable, Notes needs more attention, and searching My Content is as sophisticated as Google in 1996; but there are others). And then you see new additions to the Library, most of which are very nice, and such obvious issues exist like tags are truncated in entry and display, and we don't even get any acknowledgement to fix it? How much time does it take to put a yellow bubble over the tag on mouse-hover to see the whole name? 

There are so many days I wonder if anyone at Logos uses the product, they couldn't possibly see some of the things we do and think the product is easy, intuitive, or in some cases even functional given the size and sophistication of what we have now. 

Second and related, I also grow tired of the lack of transparency by Logos on their plans - how many threads are asking for updates on things, and the requests are just ignored. Logos has said in the past they don't want to offer updates because when their intent doesn't happen they get criticized for it, but from my recollection they get criticized more for silence - when they put out a thoughtful update, which almost all are, 95% of the user base commends them and thanks them for the update. 

I know sadly that Logos knows these complaints, there is nothing new here. 

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 5:02 AM

You know what would be something?

If HarperCollins bought the print division of Moody Publishing.

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

Posts 11308
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 6:57 AM

Dan, you're dreaming (saying that smilingly).

Little groups lost in big groups where the culture is the big group is almost never a good thing.  If Logos had bought OT, that'd be a good thing (similar cultures/product/people).

Z-company doesn't have a good track record for inept patience.

And abondservant ... you have too much time on your hands (ease of use not significant).  When a competitor has a lower price and easier to use, disaster is in the making.  Like a slow drip in the sink.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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LaRosa Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 7:11 AM

Zip it!CoolGeeked

it's gonna be an adventure

Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com 
Christ-centered Hip-Hop - http://www.sphereofhiphop.com

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PL | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 8:31 AM

LaRosa, don't you work for one of these Bible software companies now?

Posts 596
LaRosa Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 9:40 AM

PL,

Yes, I work for Olive Tree (since Jan '13). Before that it was WORDsearch/Lifeway ('07-'13).

Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com 
Christ-centered Hip-Hop - http://www.sphereofhiphop.com

Posts 78
Rob | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 9:53 AM

This is really interesting news! I can't imagine HCC bringing Bible Gateway and Olive Tree under the same umbrella just for the fun of it. They must have a plan.

Today's market is about light, mobile apps connecting to your data wherever you are so I could easily see Logos getting cornered into a niche if they are slow at reacting.

Posts 4111
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 10:23 AM

Denise:

And abondservant ... you have too much time on your hands (ease of use not significant).  When a competitor has a lower price and easier to use, disaster is in the making.  Like a slow drip in the sink.



I think perhaps you misunderstood - I already feel like I know how to use Logos. However I wouldn't want to invest the time in a new software even if it is easier to use.

L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, L9

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 10:31 AM

Robert Perron:
They must have a plan.

I'm thinking that they are hoping to work toward people eventually saying "LifeChurch who?"

Or at least put more than a 10% dent in it.

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

Posts 391
Geo Philips | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 7 2014 11:59 AM

News like this makes me think more and more that Biblia.com (or its next iteration) is the future of Logos.

I know there is a lot of resistance to an always-online app but an offline/online app built on Web principles has a lot of benefits.

Posts 855
Ron Corbett | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 5:27 AM

abondservant:
I won't be jumping ship; and further I refuse to open their stuff in another program. I'd sooner do without the zondervan titles I don't own, than be required to use and learn a different program.

Agree. My sentiments exactly. I'll only be buying resources for Logos from here on out. Way too much time and energy and money invested. To me, it would be wrong of any company to rock a boat that does SO WELL serving the needs of Bible Students, Authors, Pastors and Academicians. Any hurt to Logos hurts all of us who have waited for a program like Logos - that offered MANY publishers at great prices in a software engine that excels in every thing it does. I am curious to know how many LOGOS users are out there. Do we know? 

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Kent | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 6:09 AM

I am wondering about Logos' partnership with Knox and DTS. Do these seminaries have required Zondervan resources for their students? 

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 7:03 AM

This is a good business decision. Lifeway bought WORDSearch and now Harper Collins Christian buys Olive Tree. This cuts out the middle man in an increasingly digital age and allows two publishers direct access to an existing base of Bible software users and buyers.

It would not be good business as a publisher to align with only one 'delivery' product. Zondervan did that. Abingdon did that. Both 'saw the light,' backed off that position, and no doubt have increased sales as a result. Unfortunately Moody and Logos had a 'falling out' but that's already been discussed to death.

Is Harper Collins mostly interested in Olive Tree's mobile capability? That is probably where the consumer Bible software market is headed. Desktop apps will continue to have a loyal following among 'power' users until mobile apps catch up (if ever), but most folks will settle for a mobile app that does some basic things well. Olive Tree should benefit from the deep pockets of Harper Collins, consumers will enjoy a better product, and Harper Collins will almost certainly make more money in the end. I have no problems with that.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 11308
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 7:24 AM

Sorry, I misunderstood, abondservant!

Mark ... you've bounced your pickup off the road (for the first time).  The reason there's retail stores; convenience.  On the web, 52 publishers to read each set of books is positively nutty.  That's why Amazon has such a stranglehold on the publishers: convenience.

Plus my observation is that organizations (almost) never learn. Cultures control. Zondervan saw a small outfit, thought 'what the hey ... let's see what'll come up for air'.  With a big boy like Amazon facing them down, and Olivetree's competitive edge being cheaply tieing verses together (that IS all it does, A and B-Company do the heavy lifting), I think they're nuts.

They'd need to buy another company to make it work.  Bibleworks would be good.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 8:03 AM

Denise:
The reason there's retail stores; convenience.  On the web, 52 publishers to read each set of books is positively nutty.  That's why Amazon has such a stranglehold on the publishers: convenience.

I think you are treating Bible study and reading books as the same thing. I don't have Olive Tree but know it has more features than Kindle, even if, as you say, it is just linking verses together. Agreed that there are many readers. No need to buy and own another one. If you are a publisher you want your stuff able to be read by any reader. More sales. Zondervan stays on as many devises and readers as possible. Not so many Bible study apps or programs, so if you want to tap into that market it makes sense for a larger company to buy someone who's already doing it. That is what Harper Collins just did. (Of course we have no access to their rationale, but from outside it seems like a good move and doesn't need to be anti-competitive.)

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 5315
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 9:02 AM

Olivetree has quick searches of your open text, as well as a decent and quick passage guide. The original language look up is not the same as Logos but powerful enough. I have taken a screen shot of the Desktop App which is too barebones but gives you an idea of what it offers.

-Dan

Posts 1440
PL | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 8 2014 9:17 AM

I love Olive Tree's Resource Guide -- fast, usable offline, clear and simple.  If only they have more robust commentaries available.

Peter

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