Bible Studies by Adolf Deissmann

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 3:28 AM

P. Keith Larson:

JackCaviness:
I believe that for Pre-Pubs and Community Pricing, Logos only looks to recover initial production costs.

This is only true until they meet production cost. The period they remain on the pre-pub page between meeting production cost and the shipping of the product produces sales that do make Logos profit.

I agree that production once sufficient orders have been made to cover cost, production begins. Then any additional orders will be profit (less overhead, or course). I really do not have a problem with Logos making a profit on the products they sell. If they don't make a profit, they cease to exist.

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 3:34 AM

Roger Feenstra:

David J. Wilson:
If you do not like the Community Pricing model then by all means avoid it and pay more or less elsewhere.

P.S.  I don't like Community Pricing, but the customer is kind of stuck once they buy the base program.  It's like the airlines frequent flyer miles program.  You get hooked on Delta because you have built up miles, and even though Delta may give you poor on-time service, you're still compelled to fly with them because of the miles you've built up.  They've gotcha! Cool

I don't understand your logic here. What does pre-pub have to do with Delta? What does Community Pricing have to do with the base program? You can own the base program and never participate in the community pricing program.

The fact that Barnes Notes have languished in Community Pricing reveals the fallacy of your reasoning. Over the years, there has been great demand for this product. Logos could have calculated that it would take $100 per copy to produce this resource if they sold 50,000 copies. After years on Community Pricing, the majority of bids remains near $30. Clearly Logos would have taken a tremendous financial hit if they had adopted your model. 

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Pastor Roger | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 6:16 AM

JackCaviness:
The fact that Barnes Notes have languished in Community Pricing reveals the fallacy of your reasoning. Over the years, there has been great demand for this product. Logos could have calculated that it would take $100 per copy to produce this resource if they sold 50,000 copies. After years on Community Pricing, the majority of bids remains near $30. Clearly Logos would have taken a tremendous financial hit if they had adopted your model. 

Jack, you may be right, but surely this is anecdotal? Sometimes, you have to take a hit on one product, but you make it up on another.

JackCaviness:
 I don't like Community Pricing, but the customer is kind of stuck once they buy the base program.

What other retailer (and Logos is a retailer on one side of their business) asks its customers, before bringing in a product, how much they will be willing to spend on it?  

My point is, once you spend hundreds, or thousands of dollars, you must continue buying from Logos, in the Logos format (Hence my analogy--which may be a weak one--with airlines; Delta or whomever).  

Additionally, there are no other competitors out there (I could be wrong...been wrong once or twice in my life).  Can I go to another website, right now, and buy books that will sync with my L4?  

 So, again, I repeat...I like Logos.  It is amazing.  I sometimes get the idea that if anyone challenges Logos on anything, they are an infidel--I'm not.

Elder/Pastor, Hope Now Bible Church, Fresno CA

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David Wilson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 7:07 AM

Can you go to another web site, right now, and buy books that will sync with your L4 ?

Well if you want to get super technical and avoid going via L3 perhaps you have a point.  But if you were willing to install them on L3 then sync your licenses and have L4 pick them up then you could go to quite a number of web sites to get books in Logos format.

Start with Nelson Ministry Services and their eBible downloads, http://www.nelsonministryservices.com/nms/dept.asp?dept_id=708&ref=WelcomeEbibleUser 
(You will find most of the titles available via the Logos web site as well, but if you want to pay more for shipping boxed products you can get them direct from Nelson)

Many other publishers who offer books in Logos format also offer them in other formats if you prefer, and many only market via retailers, prefering to sell only hard copy books directly from their web sites.  Check out the links from http://www.libronix.com/page.aspx?id=techpartners0 some of them are still quite active.

Check out a number of on-line Christian Book publishers and search their sites for "Logos" or "libronix" to get lists of titles available that are not published directly by Logos.

And yes, technically most of these are still in L3 format, a few even in L2 format: but they work in L4.

And later in 2010 (happy new year!!) we should be able to use our PBB collections in L4 http://www.stilltruth.com/topics/technology/libronix/pbb where you can go right now and add content to your L3 base packages (the ones that come with the PBB reader that is....

Not being a collector of Delta points I am not sure I see your analogies: I am a Star Alliance member which gives me a wide variety of world class airlines to travel on and multiple means of collecting and redeeming points.  Delta is not one of them http://www.staralliance.com/en/ 

 

Posts 456
Pastor Roger | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 7:29 AM

David J. Wilson:
I am a Star Alliance member which gives me a wide variety of world class airlines to travel on and multiple means of collecting and redeeming points. 

Uncle!  I will officially drop the Delta analogy Zip it!

David J. Wilson:
And later in 2010 (happy new year!!) we should be able to use our PBB collections in L4

Now that is good news.  Thanks.

Elder/Pastor, Hope Now Bible Church, Fresno CA

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 1:29 PM

Roger Feenstra:
JackCaviness:
 I don't like Community Pricing, but the customer is kind of stuck once they buy the base program.

Roger

This is a small point, but if you quote me please quote something I actually said. You quoted me as making a statement that you actually made.

Roger Feenstra:
My point is, once you spend hundreds, or thousands of dollars, you must continue buying from Logos, in the Logos forma

I am not required to continue buying from Logos just because I once purchased a package. I am free to switch to another product anytime I choose. Now if I choose to purchase a new product in Logos format, I am still not required to purchase from Logos, although that may change in the near future. But even if i am, how is the different from other proprietary products? I also use Accordance, and I must purchase their products from Oak Tree. I honestly don't understand what any of this has to do with the Community Pricing Program. I know that you managed a large chain of Christian book stores, but you are still comparing apples to oranges. Community Pricing is a good deal for Logos and an even better deal for us customers. As I said before, if you don't like it, don't participate. Better still, don't continually criticize a program that you obviously don't understand.

 

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J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 3:01 PM

Roger Feenstra:

JackCaviness:
The fact that Barnes Notes have languished in Community Pricing reveals the fallacy of your reasoning. Over the years, there has been great demand for this product. Logos could have calculated that it would take $100 per copy to produce this resource if they sold 50,000 copies. After years on Community Pricing, the majority of bids remains near $30. Clearly Logos would have taken a tremendous financial hit if they had adopted your model. 

Jack, you may be right, but surely this is anecdotal? Sometimes, you have to take a hit on one product, but you make it up on another.

Huh... maybe that is the same business model that has forced every Christian bookstore in our area to close their doors.  To many risks + no profit = closed doors.

 

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 456
Pastor Roger | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 5:10 PM

Joe Miller:
Huh... maybe that is the same business model that has forced every Christian bookstore in our area to close their doors.  To many risks + no profit = closed doors.

Duh, or, it could be competition, like Amazon and Wal-mart.  They certainly ask us what they should charge for a product, don't they? 

 

Elder/Pastor, Hope Now Bible Church, Fresno CA

Posts 456
Pastor Roger | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 3 2010 5:18 PM

JackCaviness:
This is a small point, but if you quote me please quote something I actually said. You quoted me as making a statement that you actually made.

I apologize.  A slip of the mouse!

JackCaviness:
Community Pricing is a good deal for Logos and an even better deal for us customers.

Okay.  You and I can agree to disagree on this issue.  It's not really a big deal to me.  I will buy the books I really need.  If the price is not right, I won't.   That's the free market.    My point was...again...I know I'm not required to buy...but...because I already have $$$ tied up in the program...I am compelled to keep buying them...because...there is nowhere else to buy them.

I am not criticizing.  I am stating my opinion.  I respect yours.  

Roger

Elder/Pastor, Hope Now Bible Church, Fresno CA

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Phil Gons (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 4 2010 9:16 AM

MJ. Smith:

This is ridiculously close to getting out of pre-pub ... someone want to volunteer to be its hawker?

Only three more bids needed! :)

Posts 221
Jeremy White | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 4 2010 4:30 PM

An considering that " The Commentary of Zacharias Ursinus on the Heidelberg Catechism" just came out of community publishing where you could have bought it for $7 and now is in prepub for $14.95 - Community Pricing is by far the cheapest way to buy individual titles.

Hey Logos, how about adding a few more titles into community pricing for consideration?

A song I wrote and recorded : He Who Sits Upon The Throne

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 7 2010 11:45 AM

MJ. Smith:

This is ridiculously close to getting out of pre-pub ... someone want to volunteer to be its hawker?

This has crossed the line at $8.00 and closes on Friday, Jan 9 (tomorrow).  With some more support it might get down to $7.00.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Otto S. Carroll | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:12 PM

Just received an email that said my bid was successful for Bible Studies by Adolf Deissmann.

Price closed at $8.

__________

15" rMBP 2.6 GHz i7 | 16 GB RAM | 1.0 TB Flash Drive | OS X 10.12.3 | Logos 7.0 (7.3.0.0062)

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Ted Hans | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:18 PM

Otto S. Carroll:

Just received an email that said my bid was successful for Bible Studies by Adolf Deissmann.

Price closed at $8.

Now on Pre-Pub for $19 http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/2507

 

Ted

 

Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ

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Nancy A. Almodovar | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:30 PM

I did not realize that community pricing was THAT good.  So all of us who bid for it there, now that its at a higher price in Pre-Pub, will still pay  the smaller amount.  That is pretty cool.

 

newbie

nancy

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:36 PM

Nancy A. Almodovar:

I did not realize that community pricing was THAT good.  So all of us who bid for it there, now that its at a higher price in Pre-Pub, will still pay  the smaller amount.  That is pretty cool. 

newbie

nancy

It was close enough that I think with only a few more bids we could have gotten it for $7.00.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 8 2010 12:57 PM

Roger Feenstra:
In business, this is called forecasting (not speculative pricing). It is based on a responsible business decision that reflect prior sales and potential sales.  And, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.

If Logos is guided by the "owe no man anything" directive they would simply count the cost and wait for the Community Price to reach that threshold.  You can never lose with that business model. Big Smile

Roger Feenstra:
 To an extent, Logos does not have a finished product yet.  I could see paying higher prices for a product that is streamlined and efficient, but Logos simply isn't there yet.  It still doesn't have all the bells and whistles.

 Trust me. Bob will probably always be improving, streamlining and adding "bells & whistles" to the Logos program. Any grand project takes a lot of planning, construction and tweeking. It took 21 years to build this one:

[

Roger Feenstra:
Logos has a monopoly right at the moment

 

Not really. Logos has peers in the Bible software industry, just no competetion when it comes to features, content and power. We are closer now than ever to truly having a standard in the Bible software industry. That standard is Logos.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

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