Logos 6

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Posts 391
Geo Philips | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 9:39 AM

This was just like the iPad and nexus leaks. But I agree with Rosie as to the ethics of the 'leaker'

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Fred Chapman | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 9:54 AM

I have sometimes thought these leaks were part of a marketing strategy, as the beta testing progressed it was more and more clear he had direct access to current information. If they were so be it, he did his job. If otherwise, Rosie is right. 

Posts 523
Fasil | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 10:22 AM

It may be done purposely to raise awareness and create expectation?

Posts 1039
Tom Reynolds | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 11:09 AM

Logos should know the IP address he is posting from and then compare it to known users or to their own office IP range and then they would know who s/he is if they cared to... It's possible s/he's using a proxy server or vpn but that seems rather high level for posting about Logos 6. We didn't have to sign an NDA this time so I don't think there's much recourse for Logos at any rate. No measurable harm, no foul?

Posts 8
Barry Stover | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:23 PM

Y'all were pretty brutal to Everett - whoever he/she is - particularly Rosie and Super.Tramp.  What's with showing Christian love and character?  This is a Bible Study program, after all...

Thanks, Everett!  You were right!  

Posts 334
Paul Strickert | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:33 PM

The forum "regulars" take things too seriously, as if it is their job to be the moral policemen around here.  I wish they would give it a break and just lighten up.  

Posts 18857
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:35 PM

Aaron Jex:

Y'all were pretty brutal to Everett - whoever he/she is - particularly Rosie and Super.Tramp.  What's with showing Christian love and character?  This is a Bible Study program, after all...

Thanks, Everett!  You were right!  

Good point. I never saw any Logos employee responding with a snide remark to him, so we could be more charitable. However they did delete his posts on more than one occasions, so I do believe they really did not want him posting those leaks. I don't think it was a marketing strategy. So I don't think there's anything wrong in pointing out that it was wrong of him to do what he did. But he's a human being too, and the marvelous grace of our loving Lord is greater than all our sin. So, I forgive you, Everett. You were of course right, as you knew you would be. And as I (being a beta tester) knew too. Kind of. I mean approximately, with more and more accuracy as the time got closer. But I wasn't allowed to say anything about it. I do think you were guessing at first (hence your wrong guess about October 1). But I do think you had some real inside information, screen shots of the real thing, etc. And I don't think you did any lasting harm to Logos by sharing it. In fact, you might have benefited them by increasing the anticipation. And perhaps that's why we're all having trouble getting on the website today. So much excitement that everyone wants Logos 6 NOW... [:-)]

BTW, much of my pretend anger towards Everett during the lead-up to today was my attempt at deflecting any suspicion that I knew anything or that he was onto something. If I went overboard in being brutal, I apologize.

Posts 21
Gary Foster | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:41 PM

I'm actually quite ashamed of how Everett was treated, and in a bible study forum of all places.

I have only seen a few posts where people have backtracked and attempted to step up, but even those have been kind of lackluster. I would expect to see something along the lines of "Wow, Everett, I was really off base in the way I treated you, I have no excuse and I apologize" instead of a lot of meandering and pussyfooting around it... or even worse now that he's been proven correct throwing aspersions on his character about supposed leaks.

No man knows the soul of another. We can only be responsible for the way we personally act towards each other. Remember the second most important commandment according to Christ was to "love one another as you would love yourselves".

Posts 2038
Unix | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:42 PM

Exactly, people are not getting to the website. Servers are also a cost besides lost L5 base-package sales this Autumn - which also makes people skip individual items and pre-pubs to save up for L6 base-packages:

Rosie Perera:
And I don't think you did any lasting harm to Logos by sharing it. In fact, you might have benefited them by increasing the anticipation. And perhaps that's why we're all having trouble getting on the website today. So much excitement that everyone wants Logos 6 NOW... [:-)]:
Aaron Jex:
This is a Bible Study program, after all...


EDIT: Rules, such as not gossiping publicly as an Alpha or Beta tester, make for a better world.

Aply!
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Posts 1002
Mike Pettit | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:44 PM

Everett cost Logos thousands of dollars, I cancelled around $400 of prepubs that reached production to free up some cash for Logos 6 and I am sure many did the same.

I think that he got off lightly, he should be ashamed of himself.

Posts 21
Gary Foster | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:48 PM

Not sure how that cost Logos money. By the way you state your message, it appears that If you had not cancelled those prepubs you would not have had the cash available to upgrade.

Either way they ended up with the same amount of money from you. You either spend it on the prepubs or you spend it on the upgrades. That's net zero loss for them, just a transfer of what it was spent on.

Posts 406
Erik | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:52 PM

Mike Pettit:

Everett cost Logos thousands of dollars, I cancelled around $400 of prepubs that reached production to free up some cash for Logos 6 and I am sure many did the same.

I think that he got off lightly, he should be ashamed of himself.

 

I didn't cancel any prepubs because of this, but I did hold off on buying a few resource sets until after the Thanksgiving holiday in anticipation.  I however do not see it as losing Logos anything...I only have a limited amount budgeted to spend and it would have been either on those resource sets or L6...not both.  Either way Logos is still getting the same amount of money from me.  I suspect that many (if not most) who held off making purchases as a result of this thread (and I would suspect that is a very limited number of Logosians) are in the same boat. 

Posts 1002
Mike Pettit | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:54 PM

Gary Foster:

Not sure how that cost Logos money. By the way you state your message, it appears that If you had not cancelled those prepubs you would not have had the cash available to upgrade.

Either way they ended up with the same amount of money from you. You either spend it on the prepubs or you spend it on the upgrades. That's net zero loss for them, just a transfer of what it was spent on.

I would have upgraded anyway, I'm all for stimulating the economy.

Posts 391
Geo Philips | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:55 PM

We don't know the truth. We never will. I am guessing he was not a beta tester but who knows?

Either way, we would be wrong to judge his motivation. If I got info about an iPhone 7 launch at a bar, and I was not under any NDA and neither was I put under a restriction by someone who shared that information with me, would I be free to write that up on a blog? I am not saying he did not violate any Ts&Cs, just that we cannot be sure. Of course, the only place where a Logos leak gets that kind of a reaction is on these forums.  Big Smile

That being said, the whole correlation between these kinds of secrecy (as well as wedding showers, birthday surprises etc.) and Christian ethics is a fascinating discussion that perhaps can be continued on Christian Discourse.

Rosie Perera:

Good point. I never saw any Logos employee responding with a snide remark to him, so we could be more charitable. However they did delete his posts on more than one occasions, so I do believe they really did not want him posting those leaks. I don't think it was a marketing strategy. So I don't think there's anything wrong in pointing out that it was wrong of him to do what he did. But he's a human being too, and the marvelous grace of our loving Lord is greater than all our sin. So, I forgive you, Everett. You were of course right, as you knew you would be. And as I (being a beta tester) knew too. Kind of. I mean approximately, with more and more accuracy as the time got closer. But I wasn't allowed to say anything about it. I do think you were guessing at first (hence your wrong guess about October 1). But I do think you had some real inside information, screen shots of the real thing, etc. And I don't think you did any lasting harm to Logos by sharing it. In fact, you might have benefited them by increasing the anticipation. And perhaps that's why we're all having trouble getting on the website today. So much excitement that everyone wants Logos 6 NOW... [:-)]

BTW, much of my pretend anger towards Everett during the lead-up to today was my attempt at deflecting any suspicion that I knew anything or that he was onto something. If I went overboard in being brutal, I apologize.

Posts 2038
Unix | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:57 PM

I would expect the rumours somehow to have spread to thousands around the world and the average user having a whole lot else to do than to spend on Logos/Verbum/Noet/Vyrso/Proclaim:

Erik:
ither way Logos is still getting the same amount of money from me.  I suspect that many (if not most) who held off making purchases as a result of this thread (and I would suspect that is a very limited number of Logosians) are in the same boat.

Aply!
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Gary Foster | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 12:57 PM

I am in the same boat. I have a certain budget to spend and it matters not whether I spend it on resources or upgrades. It didn't cost logos any money at all from me, all it did was transfer what that money got spent on

Personally, I would much rather hold off on spending it on resources and the be able to spend it on the upgrade to the new logos and would have been pretty disappointed to have blown all my budget and then not been able to take advantage of any of the new upgrades. If you look at it in certain lights, you could turn it to where Everett did people a kindness.

Of course it's much easier to throw rocks...

And Mike, if you are all about stimulating the economy and would have upgraded anyway, then what is preventing you from going ahead and spending that $400 on the prepubs after upgrading? I mean you were willing to spend $400 and then upgrade (if you hadn't known).

Personally, I would not make that same decision and I suspect that there are a lot more people around who can't just absorb that cost than there are who can. You are lucky that you can and I'm happy that you're in such a position. Not everyone is that fortunate.

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 1:02 PM

Rosie Perera:

Everett Doonand:
The Secret Hebron is finally out. Me too...

Oh, you're "out" are you? We still don't know who you are, so I doubt it.

Your motivation puzzles me Everett. Why would you want to disguise yourself and "leak" information? Honestly I don't understand.

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Posts 391
Geo Philips | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 1:03 PM

We have to recognize that Logos does have a discount for recent package purchasers that alleviates some of this discomfort. Its a pretty good discount too.

Gary Foster:

I am in the same boat. I have a certain budget to spend and it matters not whether I spend it on resources or upgrades. It didn't cost logos any money at all from me, all it did was transfer what that money got spent on

Personally, I would much rather hold off on spending it on resources and the be able to spend it on the upgrade to the new logos and would have been pretty disappointed to have blown all my budget and then not been able to take advantage of any of the new upgrades. If you look at it in certain lights, you could turn it to where Everett did people a kindness.

Of course it's much easier to throw rocks...

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 1:06 PM

Aaron Jex:
Thanks, Everett!  You were right!  

No, he was wrong on several points.

Aaron Jex:
Y'all were pretty brutal to Everett - whoever he/she is - particularly Rosie and Super.Tramp.  What's with showing Christian love and character?  This is a Bible Study program, after all...

When Everett confesses to the sin of being a snitch, I will grant him absolution. I knew the release date was Oct 27th but you didn't hear me running my mouth. Even God told John and Daniel to keep certain things quiet.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 27 2014 1:06 PM

Gary Foster:

Of course it's much easier to throw rocks...

Speaking for myself, whether or not the information was obtained legitimately, everyone who had the right to know was also in a position where it would be a breach of professional ethics to spread the information. There have been a number of "leaks" in recent years where what has bugged me is not the person's decision to disclose so much as the breach of professional ethics to obtain data to which they had no right. Having spent years in the IT end of Payroll/Personnel I have strong feeling about professional ethics.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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