Dynamic Collections

Just a quick note. First, I love Logos and have been a user since 1995. However, I am not a "computer whiz'. I must say that I don't like the new way of making collections. I much prefer Logos 3 in this respect. I have watche the videos, both the Logos version and the user video by Mr. Barnes. For me, there is just too much, "plus this, minus this, ANDNOT, OR, etc. To me it is confusing and I think it was much simpler with the "Define Collections" in Logos 3. I still love the product, but I just wish the collection feature was a little more simplified. Thank you and blessings to all.

John Arnold

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BillS

Hi John,

Though I've been a techie forever, I still tend to agree with you on preferring the L3 way & finding L4 more complex... Yet at the same I'm finding it also to be more powerful.

wish the collection feature was a little more simplified

[Y] +1

Brent Daniel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82233#Comment_82233

Like a lot of good things that come in this life, L4 requires a change in the way users think - a paradigm shift from L3. While many may find the change in thinking a challenge for a while, I believe that many will come to appreciate the benefits of dynamic collections. Also, note, that L4 supports static collections by simply adding resources to the "Plus these resources".

With all the upgrading that Logos users are doing these days (with the discounts on base packages), I'm sure there are users that already appreciate dynamic collections that adjust when the add new resources to their library.

Just my 2 cents ...

John Fidel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82247#Comment_82247

While respecting the opinion of others, I do feel that once some time is spent using the dynamic collections, it is really a better method. If you do not like it, you can always drop all the books you want into the collection similar to L3 and not use the dynamics at all. Perhaps making it easier to select the books to go into the collection that way may be a win win for everyone.

Friedrich

Just a quick note. First, I love Logos and have been a user since 1995. However, I am not a "computer whiz'. I must say that I don't like the new way of making collections. I much prefer Logos 3 in this respect. I have watche the videos, both the Logos version and the user video by Mr. Barnes. For me, there is just too much, "plus this, minus this, ANDNOT, OR, etc. To me it is confusing and I think it was much simpler with the "Define Collections" in Logos 3. I still love the product, but I just wish the collection feature was a little more simplified. Thank you and blessings to all.

John Arnold

John, i am not enamored wiht having to set up dynamic collections, because, as you point out the ANDNOT's, etc., are not intuitive to a lot of us. That said, two things, the first, you may not be so interested in. [;)]

Once you get the hang of dynamic strings, or even just cut and paste some from the Wiki (see link at top of homepage for forum) that users have created (I did last night, and now i have "systematic theologies" "commentaries on John" etc. The advantage is that every purchase you make, if it fits in that category, will be automatically created.
If you like the old way, there is a better way to do the old way! [Y] Open up your collections window, and next to it, open your library (by dragging the library icon button down into the layout area, next to your open collections window. You should now have both panes (windows) open side by side. In your library, type in whatever descriptor you want (dictionary, baptism, family, etc) and it will pop up many resources. Find the ones you want and drag and drop them into "+ plus these resources". This is pretty much like the old way, only you get to see what resources you are putting in: you see the book cover, the description, etc. In L3 you just saw a title and had to guess if it fit or not.

Maybe this will help you!

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82251#Comment_82251

once some time is spent using the dynamic collections, it is really a better method.

More powerful? Yes. Better? Maybe... depends on whether we need the power.[:)]

making it easier to select the books to go into the collection that way may be a win win for everyone.

I couldn't agree more! [Y] +1

Friedrich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82251#Comment_82251

While respecting the opinion of others, I do feel that once some time is spent using the dynamic collections, it is really a better method. If you do not like it, you can always drop all the books you want into the collection similar to L3 and not use the dynamics at all. Perhaps making it easier to select the books to go into the collection that way may be a win win for everyone.

John, I do think that making it easier to make dynamic collections would help. the search string method is just too abstract for a lot of people. Either they don't get it, or it takes too much brain power, and they give up. Some people are just not wired that way.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82257#Comment_82257

Also, being able to select and drag multiple books at once and drop into the "+ Plus these resources" area (which has been requested before) would make it easier for people who don't want to do dynamic collections.

John Fidel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82257#Comment_82257

Hi Dan,

My point is that you can create collections similar to L3. Just open your library and begin dropping resources that you want in that collection in to the + section. No search string is necessary. I think they could make it easier by allowing multiple books to be selected and dropped rather than one at a time. It really would then be the same as L3, only you have the library window open in one tab and the collection in another tab.

Mark Watson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82257#Comment_82257

John, I do think that making it easier to make dynamic collections would help. the search string method is just too abstract for a lot of people. Either they don't get it, or it takes too much brain power, and they give up. Some people are just not wired that way.

Dan, have any of the "syntax happy users" ever considered creating "pre-defined collection" syntaxes for the wiki or this forum? Perhaps if someone "non-syntax happy" would created a type of book collection that they would like to see a syntax for, the let the happies run with it and create a cut and paste syntax for that collection.

I like to make alot of collections based on author, publisher, etc, so that I can cut down on the number of resources I search in...like what does Max Lucado write about "__________" .

Just food for thought that might help some of us "syntax challenged" persons.

Friedrich

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82317#Comment_82317

Rosie/John--i just realized you couldn't select multiple resources at once. You CAN select several with ctrl, but you can't move them all at once.

John, yes, I understood you. I just meant, even though the dynamic collection is a TERRIFIC idea, it is just daunting to set up for people who haven't the foggiest on how to set up a string, complete with parentheses, ANDNOTs, colons, etc.

Rosie and John, you two rock! [8][H]

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82323#Comment_82323

Mark, there are quite a number of examples of collection syntax at http://wiki.logos.com/Collections I realize that they might not anticipate everything you want but they should get most people started.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82324#Comment_82324

I think they could make it easier by allowing multiple books to be selected and dropped rather than one at a time. It really would then be the same as L3, only you have the library window open in one tab and the collection in another tab.

I had been starting to write the same thing (i.e., that is L3 you used to be able to move multiple books at once into a collection) but then I went back and checked, and you can't. You can't even select multiple items in the list box on the left. So what we've got now by being able to drag and drop one book at a time is precisely the same functionality L3 offered. Am I missing something? (Except perhaps it was easier to click Add, Add, Add -- which you could do in L3 -- than dragging one at a time; clicking Add would move the selection down to the next item in the list so you could add a whole bunch quickly that way.)

Rosie/John--i just realized you couldn't select multiple resources at once. You CAN select several with ctrl, but you can't move them all at once.

Yep. You can also select a whole continguous bunch of them by clicking on the first one and then holding the Shift key down while you click on the last one in the bunch. With multiple resources selected you can tag them all at once or set the same rating for all of them, or open all of them at once. But that's all you can do. You can't drag them to a collection or to prioritize, which would be handy.

Rosie and John, you two rock!

Thanks![:)]

Mark Watson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82325#Comment_82325

Mark, there are quite a number of examples of collection syntax at http://wiki.logos.com/Collections I realize that they might not anticipate everything you want but they should get most people started.

Kevin, thanks for the link. I am quite comfortable with the syntax in creating collections. But after reading hundreds of posts in these threads, there are many non-computer geeks who are getting frustrated with the changes from L3 to L4 and if anyone can remove part of that frustration by creating a place to ask for a specific collection, step-by-step directions for how to perform a task, etc. - to me, that is what each of us helping others is all about. With work from all, we are creating a giant help file for this software as well as product suggestions from users who may own a specific resource we are looking into purchasing.

I have learned alot from the forums; however, sometimes searching them took way to long. I prefer to see one thread per discussion, instead of several concerning the same subject - like Notes in L4.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82338#Comment_82338

Mark, there are quite a number of examples of collection syntax at http://wiki.logos.com/Collections I realize that they might not anticipate everything you want but they should get most people started.

Kevin, thanks for the link. I am quite comfortable with the syntax in creating collections. But after reading hundreds of posts in these threads, there are many non-computer geeks who are getting frustrated with the changes from L3 to L4 and if anyone can remove part of that frustration by creating a place to ask for a specific collection, step-by-step directions for how to perform a task, etc. - to me, that is what each of us helping others is all about.

I have learned alot from the forums; however, sometimes searching them took way to long.

That's precisely what the forums are for, though. People can always ask a specific question such as "how do I make a collection of _____" here on the forums and many of us would be glad to jump in and help out. I fear that if we made a separate place, say on the wiki, where people could ask specific questions about how to perform such-and-such a task, we'd still get just as many frustrated people here on the forums asking those types of questions, and they wouldn't know that a page on the wiki existed for it and they'd ask them here anyway, and we'd either answer them here or direct them to the wiki page to ask their question which would make it redundant for them. So I think that would be silly. I'd just as soon leave it the way we have it now, imperfect though it is. What would the forums be if we took all the questions about "how do I do XYZ" away? Those are what I enjoy answering here!

Mark Watson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82341#Comment_82341

we'd either answer them here or direct them to the wiki page to ask their question which would make it redundant for them. So I think that would be silly.

Rosie - what you think is "silly" about directing them to the "wiki" is exactly what Kevin did to me. My post was an expression of a "thought" directed toward the post of Dan DeVilder not something for someone to begin to degrade.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82349#Comment_82349

we'd either answer them here or direct them to the wiki page to ask their question which would make it redundant for them. So I think that would be silly.

Rosie - what you think is "silly" about directing them to the "wiki" is exactly what Kevin did to me. My post was an expression of a "thought" directed toward the post of Dan DeVilder not something for someone to begin to degrade.

Sorry, I misunderstood what you were asking for. I didn't mean to degrade your suggestion in any way! Kevin did what I think was very helpful, which was to direct you to an existing page describing how to make various collections which should answer most people's questions. What I thought you were asking for (and perhaps I was wrong) was a separate place where people could ask and have answered their specific questions about how to make certain collections (and I also thought I understood that you were generalizing that to other step-by-step instructions for various other tasks, but I might have been wrong about that latter as well). Anyway, many apologies for misunderstanding. I wasn't saying that what you were suggesting was silly. I was saying that what we might do if such a separate place existed would be silly (we often are silly here, myself included; and silly isn't a bad word in my vocabulary anyway -- I like being silly...very Monty Pythonesque).

The wiki is meant as a static location for collected wisdom from the forums. Browsing through it might answer some people's questions, but it is not meant as a substitute for being able to ask their questions here. And we're always glad to help, even if the question has been asked before. So basically, I think what I was saying is that what you're asking for already exists -- and it's the forums. Maybe I'm missing something. Please don't think I was trying to dis you. I was trying to help.

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82317#Comment_82317

they could make it easier by allowing multiple books to be selected and dropped rather than one at a time.

[Y] Now that's what I'm talkin' about... +1[:D]

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82257#Comment_82257

Either they don't get it, or it takes too much brain power, and they give up. Some people are just not wired that way.

Or they don't want to have to remember a search syntax to do something they do once in a blue moon...[:)]

BillS

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/82324#Comment_82324

Rosie and John, you two rock!

[Y] +1

I've learned a lot from both of you.