Over $300 for L7 Features? Really?

I just checked my price for the full Logos 7 feature set. It is over $300! And I don't really see much that even interests me. Am I alone?

I know that Logos is moving from selling books to datasets and that they are trying to move everyone to the SaaS (Software as a Service) model. But for me, it doesn't give me much incentive to upgrade.

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Comments

Mark Barnes

So why don't you become a Logos Now member for $89.99 for a year? Much better value.

Matthew

I currently own all features/datasets from Logos 6 and am not a Logos Now member. I am showing a price of $134.93 for the full Logos 7 feature set if purchased as part of a base package. If I remove the library (books) portion of the base package from my cart and leave only the Logos 7 full feature set, the price increases to $179.91.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

Logos Now subscription includes full Logos 7 feature set using SaaS model ($ 89.99 this year, $ 99.99 per year next year)

Thankful for Logos Now "free" previews that have included Mobile Education courses.

Thankful for Logos Now timeline => https://www.logos.com/now-timeline

Keep Smiling [:)]

Shannon Martin

The beauty of this is that nothing happened to Logos 6. Logos 6 is the same program it was last week before 7 was introduced.

If someone does not see the value in 7 they will be happy to stick with 6.

Just like when Ford came out with a 2016 model after I bought my 2015.

I am grateful that Faithlife, and Ford for that matter, have not stopped innovating and moving forward.

(I BTW do see the value and that is why I am a "Now" member)

Pastor Park

For me the best deal was upgrading to 7 by picking the Bronze package. It lowered the full features to below $100 and gave me some new books for about $70 more (or about $40 more than what would have been my discounted price for just the L7 features).

But as someone else said, Logos 6 is still working fine. I had a $50 gift card that was set to expire in a week though, so I decided to just on the deal.

DMB

Tony, are you adding on to the Logos5 crossgrade? $300 seems high. I paid $199, not an LN-izer, and crossgraded L6 earlier.

Is it worth it? Judging from how few forumites can answer questions on how to use Logos features, I'd bet limited use is the rule for most.

Or more accurately, a couple features of value per user.

Worth $200-300? I doubt it. But money is only valuable when you don't have it.

David Betts

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841832#Comment_841832

For months I saved toward buying Logos 7 upon release.

I was totally uninterested in "Logos Now," and ignored it until a few days ago.

Having tried Logos Now, I am totally blown away and amazed!

I would encourage those who say there is no added value to give Logos Now a try. You can cancel within 30 days if not pleased.

$90 a year for the first year comes to $7.50 per month, or about twenty-five cents per day.

If someone is content and full of joy for what Abba Father has provided in Logos 6, by all means be content with what you have. According to Hebrews 5:11 - 14 some (still) need milk [gala/galaktos] (SEE also 1Pe2:2), others have "moved on" to solid food. I am thankful for the milk. Now, I am thankful that we are provided even better tools to access both milk, and 'solid food.' (According to Mt3:4 this includes locusts).

My encouragement for all is Hebrews 5:11 "..by this time you ought to be teachers," and Mt24:45 which speaks of "food," not just milk. Therefore, according to Hebrew6:2 "Let us go on to maturity....." !!!

Matthew

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841855#Comment_841855

For months I saved toward buying Logos 7 upon release.

I was totally uninterested in "Logos Now," and ignored it until a few days ago.

Having tried Logos Now, I am totally blown away and amazed!

Anything specific that changed your mind?

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841847#Comment_841847

Tony, are you adding on to the Logos5 crossgrade? $300 seems high. I paid $199, not an LN-izer, and crossgraded L6 earlier.

Is it worth it? Judging from how few forumites can answer questions on how to use Logos features, I'd bet limited use is the rule for most.

Or more accurately, a couple features of value per user.

Worth $200-300? I doubt it. But money is only valuable when you don't have it.

I have Logos 6 currently and did Starter last time round.

Mark Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841786#Comment_841786

If I remove the library (books) portion of the base package from my cart and leave only the Logos 7 full feature set, the price increases to $179.91.

That amount is about 2 years of Now subscription and buys you what Now subscribers have been progressively enjoying over the past about two years since Now began, and for about their price. That actually is not a bad deal for full ownership.

Virgil Buttram

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841915#Comment_841915

I have Logos 6 currently and did Starter last time round.

Then the Logos 7 equivalent would be the Starter Feature Set, or the Starter base package and feature set. The Full Feature Set corresponds with what you would have gotten from Logos 6 Gold or Logos 6 Feature Crossgrade (in the way of features/datasets, not the accompanying resources/books). The good news is, with Logos 7, you only need to get a Bronze package to get the Full Feature Set included.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841925#Comment_841925

The bad news is that the Bronze starter is the same as the feature set -- over $300. I may sit this one out and see what Logos comes up with in the future.

I think my biggest problem with the SaaS is that if you stop paying, you lose all of the added features. I think it would be better that if you stay for at least 12 months, you get to keep a subset of the features and if you stay for 24 months, you get to keep all the added features up to that point.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841930#Comment_841930

I can get L7 Basic for about $89, but not much compelling there either. So, unless I decide that I really need the SaaS features, I'll stay put. Did Logos ever finish the web engine improvements, anyway?

Jan Krohn

I just checked my price for the full Logos 7 feature set. It is over $300! And I don't really see much that even interests me. Am I alone?

I think I must have paid the very same price. I was on L6 Starter before as well, and decided to upgrade to Bronze now.

I agree, $300 is steep. However, you pay that only once, and the feature set belongs to you for good. The set includes really everything (let me stress e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g), that previously was restricted to Gold/Diamond/Platinum etc. and would have been a lot more expensive (either as part of a very high priced BP, or as a feature crossgrade). In terms of price, I believe the full feature set is a gigantic steal.

Second question: Is it worth the price? Currently, I think yes. Time will tell. I've been going through a couple of the Logos Pro videos recently (prior to L7), and noticed that with the L6 Starter features I could not do quite a lot of the stuff. Many of the features might look uninteresting, but under the hood they enable Logos to do all the cool things that you can see in Logos Pro.

(LN gives you the same features, but then, once you're in the fourth year of subscribing, it already gets more expensive than owning the feature set.)

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841967#Comment_841967

Using a car analogy, Logos seems to want to load you up with all kinds of options that you may or may not use. I would rather put the money into books and resources I will use. As I am invested in several Bible study platforms, I don't currently feel the need to have the latest and greatest. Just the tools I need to study the Bible. YMMV.

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841980#Comment_841980

Using a car analogy, Logos seems to want to load you up with all kinds of options that you may or may not use.

That's true — but we all want different things. If everyone wanted to pay $10each for the features they wanted, it may be that none of the features would have had enough customers to pay for the development costs. But if we all agree to have everything, and club our resources together, then Logos can make far more tools than they otherwise could. That's the theory anyway, and I'm grateful for the approach (despite being against Logos Now when it launched).

Virgil Buttram

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841930#Comment_841930

The bad news is that the Bronze starter is the same as the feature set -- over $300. I may sit this one out and see what Logos comes up with in the future.

Which is far less than the Logos 6 Gold package was. The entry price for all features is now (much) lower than it used to be. If that is still out of your budget (at the moment, it is definitely out of mine*), then waiting is the correct choice - not because the pricing is unreasonable, but because budget priorities are properly elsewhere.

*On the other hand, my Dynamic Pricing for the Logos 7 Starter Feature Set is insanely low. That one is highly likely to be an almost-immediate purchase.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842052#Comment_842052

We all want better tools for Bible study. However, we must determine which tools will be best for us to use and whether or not we can justify the expense. I will examine the feature set on LN to see if it is worth the $10 a month Logos wants for it...

Keith Larson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842102#Comment_842102

We all want better tools for Bible study. However, we must determine which tools will be best for us to use and whether or not we can justify the expense. I will examine the feature set on LN to see if it is worth the $10 a month Logos wants for it...

What calendar are you using? The last time I checked $99/12 = $8.25! Even less if you purchase now at $89.

Bob Price

I'm in the same boat. I currently have Bronze, and was planning to upgrade to Silver this fall. I'd been watching the prices on Silver, and it had been going up, but was somewhere around $350 or so. If I'm not mistaken, it used to include the New American Commentary, so it was a pretty significant upgrade in terms of resources. The new version of Silver does not include the NAC, so it's not as valuable as it used to be, but I suppose they offset that by including the full feature set with almost all base packages.

The new versions are, of course, pretty exciting by virtue of the feature sets, but I'm a lot less excited by what I would now get in the base package libraries. With the new pricing, I can essentially spend the same amount of money I would have spent on a Silver upgrade under Logos 6, but now I would only get Bronze under Logos 7. I'm not sure that's a good tradeoff.

So, I'll keep evaluating my options. Logos Now is tempting, but after 3 years, it becomes a money loser, and quitting after 3 years would leave me with nothing more than I have now. Still, it's the only option if your budget won't support a base package purchase. The tough thing is trying to determine if I would really use a lot of the new features. I'm not very strong in original language study.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842247#Comment_842247

I think that Logos offers far less value for more money than it used to. I started with Bronze back in 2009 or so (Logos 4) and received a really decent library for the money with a lot of good titles and some sets. I supplemented it by buying up all the value-priced Libronix packages that I could find. Now, it seems, the books are not as plentiful and the packages are filled with Logos-published and public domain works. The cost of entry has gone higher and higher. Now, the sky is the limit. The main draw seems to be the datasets which are of limited value to me, personally. Just give me great search capabilities and I can pull up what I need on any platform. What would interest me most in a SaaS scenario is not datasets. It is a more mature and capable web platform so I can do more on my Chromebooks.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842247#Comment_842247

The new version of Silver does not include the NAC, so it's not as valuable as it used to be,

The New American Commentary Series (42 vols.) now shows inclusion in several Logos 7 LIbraries, including Baptist Gold and SDA Gold

The new versions are, of course, pretty exciting by virtue of the feature sets, ...

Thankful for Logos Now exclusive features => https://www.logos.com/now-timeline that enhance Bible Study

Logos Now enables Discourse Analysis in more Bibles. Reader Edition allows selective filtering of interlinear lines by occurrence: e.g. lemma (different than hard copy English gloss). Logos Now membership also includes many exclusive interactives plus temporary access to resources along with discounts on resource purchases: e.g. temporary and Base Packages.

Thankful for option to purchase many Logos Now exclusive features => Logos 7 Full Feature Set and => Verbum 7 Full Feature Set

... but I'm a lot less excited by what I would now get in the base package libraries. With the new pricing, I can essentially spend the same amount of money I would have spent on a Silver upgrade under Logos 6, but now I would only get Bronze under Logos 7. I'm not sure that's a good tradeoff.

Thankful for Library Compare across denominational packages: e.g. Gold (with identical regular price of $ 1,222.22)

=> https://www.logos.com/compare/libraries?productIds=81151,81159,81166,81173,81180,81184,81193,81200

Noticed UBS Handbook Series Old & New Testament Collection (55 vols.) is no longer in Logos 7 Gold packages, now only in Logos 6 Gold Bilingual

So, I'll keep evaluating my options.

+1 [Y] plus praying for God's peaceful directing of steps for His glory.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Dwayne Justice

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/841930#Comment_841930

The bad news is that the Bronze starter is the same as the feature set -- over $300. I may sit this one out and see what Logos comes up with in the future.

I think my biggest problem with the SaaS is that if you stop paying, you lose all of the added features. I think it would be better that if you stay for at least 12 months, you get to keep a subset of the features and if you stay for 24 months, you get to keep all the added features up to that point.

Tony, I am curious. Where are you getting your prices from? $300 seems quite high. If I wanted buy bronze (which comes with the full feature set) I would only have to pay $57.39. I realize that price is based off of what I currently own. However, that is a very far cry from $300. I don't see the difference being that much no matter the difference in our two base packages that we currently own. I don't know, maybe there is, but is seems a little too substantial of a difference for that to be the case. Quick question: are you signed in when you are viewing prices?

Jan Krohn

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842461#Comment_842461

$300 is the correct price to upgrade from L6 Starter to L7 Bronze.

[:'(] (but actually it's worth every cent).

David Wanat

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842486#Comment_842486

OK, I haven't tried Logos Now before, so forgive me if my questions are obvious to the rest of you. I have Verbum 6 foundations and am interested in giving 7 a try. Am I basically paying a yearly fee to get access to the maxed out package? Or is Logos Now less than that?

I'd like to find out what's going on here so I don't assume something Faithlife never intended to promise.

Dwayne Justice

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842486#Comment_842486

$300 is the correct price to upgrade from L6 Starter to L7 Bronze.

(but actually it's worth every cent).

WOW! Guess I'm a liar! LOL! I just didn't think there could be that much of a difference. I was wrong...[:#]

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842512#Comment_842512

Yep, it looks like I'm jumping off the Logos upgrade train for this go round. And not sure if Logos Now will provide enough value. So, I will just wait!

Sean Boisen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842512#Comment_842512

$300 is the correct price to upgrade from L6 Starter to L7 Bronze.

(but actually it's worth every cent).

WOW! Guess I'm a liar! LOL! I just didn't think there could be that much of a difference. I was wrong...

Dwayne: keep in mind that this is the ownership price. You can join Logos Now and get access the Full Feature Set (though not the library) for a very reasonable cost, along with discounts on other purchases that may make it worthwhile.

This post may help with determining the various costs and discounts: https://community.logos.com/forums/t/129621.aspx.

Save

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842510#Comment_842510

OK, I haven't tried Logos Now before, so forgive me if my questions are obvious to the rest of you. I have Verbum 6 foundations and am interested in giving 7 a try. Am I basically paying a yearly fee to get access to the maxed out package? Or is Logos Now less than that?

For maxing out features, annual Now membership is a better deal because some features and datasets are only available to subscribers: e.g.

Bible Browser
Discourse Datasets and Visual Filters
Lemma in Passage
Logos web app
New stuff added to Logos 7 and Verbum 7 that is not in the Full Feature Sets

Media Collections for Logos 7 and Verbum 7

Faithlife Animations (subscription only)
deSilva Teaching Materials, vol. 2 (subscription only)
Mars Hill Media Collection (subscription only)
Lexham Bible Dictionary Videos (subscription only)

The other subscription option that includes resources is Logos Cloud => https://logoscloud.com and Verbum Cloud => https://verbumcloud.com so can "rent" a larger library with features.

Verbum Now => https://verbum.com/now and Logos Now => https://www.logos.com/now

Verbum Now Timeline => https://verbum.com/now-timeline and Logos Now Timeline => https://www.logos.com/now-timeline

Keep Smiling [:)]

Glenn Airoldi (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842552#Comment_842552

We all derive value from Logos differently. Some of us place a tremendous amount of value on new books. Others take exactly the opposite approach, and place more value on new features.

Regardless of where you fit in this spectrum, there are ways to maximize what's valuable to you in an upgrade purchase during our Logos 7 introduction.

If what you're looking to accomplish with an upgrade is to get the best deal on books to grow your library, these are the things you should consider:

Every Logos 7 Library purchase should be considered an upgrade regardless of level, because you'll be adding new books to your library.
Users get the best price applied to Logos 7 Libraries in two ways

Purchase a library and a feature set together - Save 10% on the library -OR-
Purchase a library alone as a Logos Now Member - save 10% on the library

During the introductory period, there are additional discounts being applied

Save an additional 10% as part of our launch promotion
Logos Now members save another 5%

Here are some examples of how to purchase to maximize the value of the library.

Buy any library together with a Starter Feature Set, you'll get far fewer features, but still earn the library discounts offered for buying a feature set and library together.
Become a Logos Now member and purchase a library alone. Even after the introductory period, Logos Now members will save at least 10% on Logos 7 libraries. Consider that a Bronze library costs $200. The Logos Now Membership earns you at least a $20 discount. The $89.99 membership earns you a $122 on a Gold library. (Dynamic pricing will reduce those numbers if you're not paying full price for the libraries.)

If what you're looking to accomplish with an upgrade is to get access to new features, these are the things you should consider:

Logos Now membership, priced at $99.99 per year is discounted to $89.99 through the end of the year. Members get access to all Logos features for as long as they remain members.
For anyone who prefers to own the features instead of accessing them as a benefit of membership, these are the options

Users get the best priced applied to Logos 7 Feature Sets in two ways

Purchase a feature set and a library together - save 25% on the feature set -OR-
Purchase a feature set alone as a Logos Now Member - save 25% on the feature set

During the introductory period, there are additional discounts being applied

Save an additional 10% as part of our launch promotion
Logos Now members save another 5%

Here are examples of how to purchase to maximize the value of the feature set.

Buy a base package instead of a feature set alone
Choose Bronze over Starter. This $630 base package includes the $599.99 Full Feature set. Buying it with a library earns you the 25% discount, and your dynamic price can bring the dollar total even lower.
Become a Logos Now member and purchase the Full Feature Set alone. Even after the introductory period, Logos Now members will save at least 25% on Logos 7 feature sets. Consider that the Logos 7 Full Feature Set costs $599.99. The $89.99 Logos Now Membership earns you at least a $150 discount on a Logos 7 Full Feature Set. (Dynamic pricing will reduce these numbers if you're not paying full price for the feature set.)

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842661#Comment_842661

[Head spinning violently....]

http://babylonbee.com/news/pastor-takes-second-loan-home-purchase-new-logos-bible-software/

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842673#Comment_842673

[Head spinning violently....]

http://babylonbee.com/news/pastor-takes-second-loan-home-purchase-new-logos-bible-software/

The babylonbee is a "Christian Satire" site.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842681#Comment_842681

Yes it is... [:)]

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/842683#Comment_842683

So, what is going on with the web version of Logos that was one one the main features of Logos Now? Is it still in development? How far has it progressed? Since I have not seen it since the Logos Cloud rollout, I would be interested in knowing.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843159#Comment_843159

So, what is going on with the web version of Logos that was one one the main features of Logos Now? Is it still in development?

Yes it is still under development - status updates are available in https://community.logos.com/forums/136.aspx

If you are a Logos Now subscriber you can (normally) see it at http://app.logos.com/ but it isn't responding at the moment.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843163#Comment_843163

but it isn't responding at the moment.

and it's back!

Not fully featured yet but certainly useful when you don't have access to your desktop.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843186#Comment_843186

So, how does it compare to the regular biblia.com and bible.faithlife.com sites?

Diego Lara

I find Logos Now to be a better deal than purchasing the upgrades. I own all the books, so don't mind paying per month for the features. This is similar to what Microsoft is doing with Office 365, you don't own the software but for a only a few buck a month you will always have the latest version when a new version comes out. You can pay 300 for all the Logos Features now but you won't have any of the new features as they come out and will have to pay another 300 when Logos 8 comes out. But for 9.99 a month or 100 per year you will always have the latest features.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843301#Comment_843301

So, how does it compare to the regular biblia.com and bible.faithlife.com sites?

Difficult to say without an itemised list.

It doesn't have Reading Plans at the moment - which biblia does - and neither does it provide access to many of the FSB features.

It does support multiple layout options and resource linksets as well as initial support for the Guides

Very much depends on what is important for you.

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843306#Comment_843306

But for 9.99 a month or 100 per year you will always have the latest features.

Just a detail - the new Logos Now scheme is only available for annual, not monthly, purchase

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843321#Comment_843321

So, no real way to try it out for a month or two and see if you actually benefit from the features?

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843335#Comment_843335

So, no real way to try it out for a month or two and see if you actually benefit from the features?

Correct - and with the discounts available to Logos Now members:managing a free trial could be difficult

"Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries
Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets
PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount"

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843338#Comment_843338

So, no real way to try it out for a month or two and see if you actually benefit from the features?

Correct - and with the discounts available to Logos Now members:managing a free trial could be difficult

"Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries

Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets

PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount"

Understandable. Then, I am definitely going to remain on the sideline.

Diego Lara

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843321#Comment_843321

Really? I still have it per month, so I was grandfathered into it?

Graham Criddle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843347#Comment_843347

Really? I still have it per month, so I was grandfathered into it?

Those who were on monthly subscriptions can remain until the end of the year - then it switches to annual. See https://community.logos.com/forums/p/128695/836465.aspx#836465 for some context.

Rick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843347#Comment_843347

Really? I still have it per month, so I was grandfathered into it?

Only until the end of December. Then us monthly subscribers have to make a decision of either cancelling or having it turn into an annual subscription. I would expect an email reminder before that happens but you never know.

Tony Thomas

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843351#Comment_843351

Personally, I think it is a mistake to only offer an annual option. $90 is a big commitment for something that you don't get a chance to test out.

Diego Lara

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843351#Comment_843351

Oh ok, well its still worth every penny for $89 a year to get all those great features and anything new that comes out.

Diego Lara

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/843352#Comment_843352

They should definitely provide a one month free trial, by disabling all the discounts so that no one abuses the free trial just to buy books at a discounted price. I agree I probably would hesitate to sign up for an entire year if I had not tried it first.

Batman

No, you are not alone.
I find this ridiculous.
I myself am what I will call a "light user", with "only" 1660 resources; yet, I have spent well over $2000 for this collection of stuff that I have to force myself to make time to figure out how to even use it. It was supposed to be a $400 investment, but, has turned out to be 5-6x that!
As far as upgrading? NEVER AGAIN! You are correct, in my not so humble opinion, there is not even one resource that I considered buying even separately. Nothing! And to pay ANOTHER $300ish?
I just wish I could find someone who wants my license. I'd go back to the better $100 software titles.
Better? How? For one, I could use them. For two, they weren't money hungry (in appearance). You bought their product, and none of this constant barrage of ads, in email, on the home page. I never had to go to settings to tell it to not place ads everywhere.
I've been with Logos since 2009. I purchased L-3 and now, not even 10 years later, I've seen four MORE versions? That's crazier than Windows! Even greedy MS has taken longer to release 4 upgrades to Windows!

No, you are definitely not alone. I'm pretty much done with Logos. I understand being in business to make money, but this is ridiculous, and I am wondering what Jesus would do if he were here physically, or if Peter would react similarly to how he spoke to Simon the sorcerer.