Hi Logos,
Speaking as a lay person, who is hoping to use Chinese CUV for word study as advertised by Logos, I am beginning to have serious concerns about CUV RVI alignment problems ... (please bear with my frustration - sorry). While I can understand and accept that there are some words that are difficult to translate like to equivalent of "behold" (看哪) that I mentioned in a number of posts. Some appear as very straight forward bugs.
This morning I was test driving the CUV RVI again
Right mouse click on the noun "约" (covenant) it gives me the verb "立"(make) in the context menu instead. Since both ESV and CUV RVI use the same source, I suppose the expert doing the alignment for CUV would have considered the alignment for LEB, ESV, NASB, KJV, NIV, NRSV, etc.
JK
MacBookPro Retina 15" Mid 2014 2.5GHz RAM:16GB SSD:512GB macOS Catalina 10.15.2 | iPhone Xs Max iOS 13.3
Another case, a little more involved. I was looking at the 4 / 5 promises that the Lord made. The proposition outline shows the 5 promises clearly under ESV, under CUV RVI it is really confusing; the alignment of first 3 promises is a real challenge for me to understand the alignment rationale as a lay person.
A screen shot with inline Interlinear to show the alignment challenges:
Thank you, LimJK, for bringing this up and for so patiently documenting specific cases. I don't have the time nor patience to document the RVI alignment problems because they seem so widespread that I basically do not feel that I can trust this data and use it for effective study without also referencing English Bible RVI's.
In general, I feel very underwhelmed and disappointed by widespread quality control issues of the Chinese Bronze package. There are so many obvious and clear inconsistencies among the Bronze resources (e.g. inconsistencies in book names and titles, abbreviations, etc, as you have been very patiently reporting and documenting) that it felt like the whole thing was rushed out the door without someone first doing any QC on the overall package.
I cannot, in all conscience, recommend Logos to my Chinese friends.
Peter
PL: Thank you, LimJK, for bringing this up and for so patiently documenting specific cases. I don't have the time nor patience to document the RVI alignment problems because they seem so widespread that I basically do not feel that I can trust this data and use it for effective study without also referencing English Bible RVI's. In general, I feel very underwhelmed and disappointed by widespread quality control issues of the Chinese Bronze package. There are so many obvious and clear inconsistencies among the Bronze resources (e.g. inconsistencies in book names and titles, abbreviations, etc, as you have been very patiently reporting and documenting) that it felt like the whole thing was rushed out the door without someone first doing any QC on the overall package. I cannot, in all conscience, recommend Logos to my Chinese friends. Peter
Hi, Peter and LimJK,
I appreciate your effort to report to us some bugs and errors in our Chinese Reverse Interlinear Bible. As Chinese Bible Translations are quite different than the English, the alignment of original texts with Chinese might sometimes difficult to align perfectly. This is our first Chinese Reverse Interlinear Bible and it is hard for us to catch some bugs and alignment errors the first time. We are striving to make corrections and improvement gradually and we appreciate your help and patience to make Chinese package perfect. I am sorry for the inconvenience and frustration we caused you.
Peter, I am sad and sorry to hear that you cannot recommend Logos Chinese Bronze to your Chinese friends at this time and I understand your frustration. We will improve and correct the known bugs as soon as we can. I sincerely hope that after our constant efforts to make improvement, you will be able to recommend Chinese Logos software to your Chinese friends in the future.
Once again, on behalf of Logos team, I apologize for the frustration and inconvenience we caused you. Please pray for us as we are trying to improve the quality of our products.
Best regards,
Philip
Hi Philip,
Thanks for your response. I'm actually surprised that FL decides to start from scratch with this RVI work. There've been such Chinese-Hebrew/Greek interlinear resources available for at least 30 years.
For now, for original language reference, I use the follow FREE resource which seems to have more accurate Chinese-OL associations. Not sure if they're basing things on another preexisting resource - probably.
https://itunes.apple.com/cn/app/%E7%B2%BE%E8%AF%BB%E5%9C%A3%E7%BB%8F/id969776780?mt=8
Hope this helps,
PL: Hi Philip, Thanks for your response. I'm actually surprised that FL decides to start from scratch with this RVI work. There've been such Chinese-Hebrew/Greek interlinear resources available for at least 30 years. For now, for original language reference, I use the follow FREE resource which seems to have more accurate Chinese-OL associations. Not sure if they're basing things on another preexisting resource - probably. https://itunes.apple.com/cn/app/%E7%B2%BE%E8%AF%BB%E5%9C%A3%E7%BB%8F/id969776780?mt=8 Hope this helps, Peter
Hi, Peter,
You are welcome. Thank you for the suggestion on the Chinese resources. We did not start from scratch with this RVI work. We signed the license agreement with a well-known Bible company to use their Chinese RVI data. We will go over their data and make improvement as soon as we can. Thank you for your patience.
Another alignment bug here Eph 6:5 with 你們作僕人的 where: in common sense Chinese "δοῦλος" being a noun here should be aligned with "僕人" and not "作" which loosely mean "being".
Another alignment bug here 1 Tim 5:1 "為寡婦"
Where
LimJK: Another alignment bug here 1 Tim 5:1 "為寡婦" Where "為" is loosely "being" "寡婦" widow
Hi, LimJK,
Thank you for taking time to find this. I have adjusted both issues to reflect more accurate positions for the alignment. It will be updated at future updates. Thank you.
Philip Peng: I have adjusted both issues to reflect more accurate positions for the alignment. It will be updated at future updates.
I have adjusted both issues to reflect more accurate positions for the alignment. It will be updated at future updates.
Philip,
Thanks
LimJK: Philip Peng: I have adjusted both issues to reflect more accurate positions for the alignment. It will be updated at future updates. Philip, Thanks
You are welcome, JK.
Another case, Ph 2:5 ... 以基督耶穌的心為心 ... word of interest is
if you compare ESV then take a look at CUV RVI where you disassociate the Chinese translation with a ( • ) and the Greek text with another ( • ), As a lay person, I thought it is more appropriate to align φρονέω under 為心 as shown in the screen shot below. May be if the RVI expert who did the alignment can explain the rationale. There are too many alignment issues! which also affect search results! and Bible Word Study results!