Multiview Resources – ESV OT + HDNT

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Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Apr 5 2018 7:48 PM

I'd like to have the HDNT display for NT references, but switch to the the ESV for OT. Is there any way that I can limit the Multiview to a particular part of a resource, e.g. only the OT part of the ESV? I've already tried:

  • Simply adding the ESV to the Multiview configuration; but then for NT references, both the ESV and the HDNT are displayed, which is a redundant use of screen real-estate.
  • Adding an English OT-only resource (e.g. LES) instead of the ESV is functional; but because the HDNT uses the ESV text, it makes more sense for it to fall back to the ESV for OT references.

Thanks,
-Pete

P.S. There seems to be a terminology bug/inconsistency: the Logos Pro video calls this the "Multiview" resources tool, but the L7 GUI has a "Multiple resources" tooltip for the feature.

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 5 2018 8:51 PM

Series:"Lexham High Definition Bible" has NT and OT ESV: 

FYI: Discourse features are now usable in many Bibles (using datasets).

Keep Smiling Smile

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Philana R. Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 6 2018 11:57 AM

Pete De Bonte:

I'd like to have the HDNT display for NT references, but switch to the the ESV for OT. Is there any way that I can limit the Multiview to a particular part of a resource, e.g. only the OT part of the ESV? I've already tried:

  • Simply adding the ESV to the Multiview configuration; but then for NT references, both the ESV and the HDNT are displayed, which is a redundant use of screen real-estate.
  • Adding an English OT-only resource (e.g. LES) instead of the ESV is functional; but because the HDNT uses the ESV text, it makes more sense for it to fall back to the ESV for OT references.

Thanks,
-Pete

P.S. There seems to be a terminology bug/inconsistency: the Logos Pro video calls this the "Multiview" resources tool, but the L7 GUI has a "Multiple resources" tooltip for the feature.

Hi Pete,

There are two options that might be used; it might not be quite what you want.

There is a Discourse Visual Filter for both Greek and Hebrew that can be applied to Bibles with RI’s. You could apply this to the ESV. You could open the ESV and only turn it on for the NT.



Or you could use the ESV as your main Bible, and then have the HDNT and HDOT set as your multi-view resource.

I hope this is helpful.

Blessings,

Philana

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 6 2018 7:21 PM

To clarify my situation/library:

  • I have the HDNT and ESV.
  • I am aware that a HDOT exists, but I don't have it and it isn't even available for purchase anymore.
  • As for L7, I have only the SFS, so I don't have the discourse visual filters.

Regardless, I was really hoping that one could (or if not, call this a feature request/suggestion) configure the Multiview Resources tool to use only part of a resource. My ESV OT + HDNT seemed like a good example, but maybe also someone might appreciate only particular parts of a one-volume commentary. One way to think about it (but certainly not the only way), would be to to allow prioritization of resources in the Multiview, e.g. in one of the Multiview columns, always display this resource if it contains the passage, and then fallback to this other resource when it doesn't.

FWIW,
-Pete

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Apr 7 2018 1:56 PM

Pete De Bonte:
so I don't have the discourse visual filters.

Discourse datasets are in bundle => Lexham Discourse Bible (8 vols.) that is included in => Logos 7 Extended Feature Set and => Logos 7 Essential Upgrade (L) (with dynamic pricing, one of these may be attractive).

An alternative for ESV OT could be Lexham English Septuagint

Another workaround idea is using HDNT with another NT only Bible: e.g. The New Testament: An Expanded Translation (bit verbose for verbal rendering) or The New Testament in Modern Speech: An Idiomatic Translation into Everyday English from the Text of “The Resultant Greek Testament”

Pete De Bonte:
Regardless, I was really hoping that one could (or if not, call this a feature request/suggestion) configure the Multiview Resources tool to use only part of a resource.

Confirmed Advanced Prioritization has no effect on Multiview Resources (verse not in Bible verse Range prioritization is displayed in Multiview). Also confirmed MultiView shows all resources that have Bible verse.

Keep Smiling Smile

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Philana R. Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 9 2018 9:53 AM

Pete De Bonte:


    As for L7, I have only the SFS, so I don't have the discourse visual filters.



Pete,

Can you clarify what you mean by SFS?

As for Multi-view resources, the main resource is what is called the host resource and can't change. There are two options.
Option 1
You would need to set a multi-view resource set with the ESV as the host with the ESVNT as a guest, it would still display the two resources when you are open to a New Testament passage.

Option 2
If what you want is when you click on a reference link to the OT for it open just the ESV and then for a link to the NT to open up the HDNT you could prioritize the resources in your library using advanced prioritization. You can use the settings shown in my screenshot. The only difference is you will only have the one resource.

I hope this helps.

Philana

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 10 2018 7:28 PM

Philana,

L7 SFS was my shorthand for Logos 7 Starter Feature Set. I also have datasets from the L4 and L5 Crossgrades, but only the Starter features from L7.

Philana R. Crouch:
Option 2
If what you want is when you click on a reference link to the OT for it open just the ESV and then for a link to the NT to open up the HDNT
That is what I wanted; however…

Philana R. Crouch:
you could prioritize the resources in your library using advanced prioritization. You can use the settings shown in my screenshot. The only difference is you will only have the one resource.

…although I copied the advanced prioritization of the ESV and HDNT shown your screenshot, the HDNT and ESV didn't seem to function any differently for me. How do you use this once you've configured it? Do I presume correctly that "you will only have the one resource" means that your technique is incompatible with the Multi-view feature?

Thanks : )
-Pete

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 11 2018 4:14 PM

Pete De Bonte:
although I copied the advanced prioritization of the ESV and HDNT shown your screenshot, the HDNT and ESV didn't seem to function any differently for me.

As KS4J states above, and I also confirm it, advanced prioritization does not work with Multiview. Nor does it work with Parallel Resources. It is intended to work with bible references (links) in a resource, so that your preferred bible(s) can be selected to view the passage.

Dave
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Philana R. Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 12 2018 8:02 AM

Philana R. Crouch:

Pete De Bonte:


    As for L7, I have only the SFS, so I don't have the discourse visual filters.



Option 2
If what you want is when you click on a reference link to the OT for it open just the ESV and then for a link to the NT to open up the HDNT you could prioritize the resources in your library using advanced prioritization.

Pete,

To clarify option 2 was meant to be an alternative to using multi-view. It would trigger the resource based on the Bible reference you clicked on. If you want to use multi-view, you would have to have the ESV with the HDNT opened in multi-view when a NT passage is opened. 

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 12 2018 5:55 PM

Thanks Dave & Philana, for the clarification. I'd seen KS4J's note that it wouldn't work with the Multiview feature, but I didn't understand Philana's distinction at the time.

So, then, I'd like to suggest Advanced Prioritization for Multiview as a future feature.

Thanks again,
-Pete

Posts 2028
LogosEmployee

Pete De Bonte:

So, then, I'd like to suggest Advanced Prioritization for Multiview as a future feature.

It's not clear what this means. Multiview shows all resources from the set you've selected in the order you specify that contain the active reference. Prioritization doesn't enter into the issue at all, and I'm not clear on how it would.

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 12 2018 6:25 PM

Andrew,
OK. I can summarize this thread for you. I'm essentially requesting the ability limit the Multiview usage of a particular resource to a subset of that resource. Some people (e.g. KS4J) viewed my request as if applying Advanced Prioritization to Multiview. The examples that I gave were having, as Multiview participants:

  • only the OT part of the ESV (and then I'd use the HDNT for the NT).
  • only the coverage of particular books of the Bible from a particular one-volume commentary

Thanks,
-Pete

Posts 2028
LogosEmployee

Hmm... so instead of showing all resources in the selected set, you only want to show only the one with the highest priority.

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Apr 12 2018 7:28 PM

Although I actually hadn't thought of Advanced Prioritization when I originally posted, I suppose that would be one way to do it.

My original thought, however, was to include all applicable resources, but allow the user to specify the applicable reference ranges for each included resource, e.g.

  • for an OT reference, use resources {A,B,C}, but for a NT use {A,Y,Z}, even if all of those resources cover the entire Bible.
  • Or perhaps I'm a fan how the Psalms are translated in a particular Bible, so I'd like to include it in my Multiview whenever I go to the Psalms, yet exclude it from the Multiview for all other references
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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 13 2018 12:24 AM

Pete De Bonte:
My original thought, however, was to include all applicable resources, but allow the user to specify the applicable reference ranges for each included resource

In theory that could work, but there are some difficulties

  • it would have to be considered for Parallel Resource sets; where Prioritization determines resource order, but Advanced Prioritization for a Range is not applied
  • It's use in Multiview may conflict/differ with your use for Prioritization i.e. have an Advanced Prioritization restricted to Multiview

Dave
===

Windows & Android

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 13 2018 4:41 AM

OK, if implementing my feature suggestion via Advanced Prioritization isn't practical, let's drop the Advanced Prioritization idea.

THE GOAL: I'd simply like to request that Multiview somehow be made more flexible so I could add only part of a resource to it.

Posts 4823
doc | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 13 2018 2:39 PM

So what you are wanting is for FL to redesign the software because the HDOT is no longer available to purchase and the replacemen for the HDOT is to expensive for you to purchase. It’s going to take time, effort and money for FL to do that Software’s redesign. Seems to me the simple solution would be for someone at FL to make the call and grant you a license so you have access to the HDOT, Your needs will be met much sooner and FL will be saved a whole lot of trouble at looking at another change to the software which might not happen anytime soon, if at all. Happy Customer, Happy Developer. Everybody wins. Just my simple view from looking at the problem from the outside in instead of the inside out.

Pete De Bonte:

OK, if implementing my feature suggestion via Advanced Prioritization isn't practical, let's drop the Advanced Prioritization idea.

THE GOAL: I'd simply like to request that Multiview somehow be made more flexible so I could add only part of a resource to it.

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 13 2018 3:53 PM

Pete De Bonte:
THE GOAL: I'd simply like to request that Multiview somehow be made more flexible so I could add only part of a resource to it.

Another place for Range selectivity is "Send Hyperlinks Here"

  1. Tab could receive Old Testament hyperlinks
  2. Tab could receive New Testament hyperlinks
  3. Tab could receive Deuterocanonlical hyperlinks

Multiview shows resource(s) when active location is in those resource(s) while search shows all Resources in Verses view:

Having one column for custom Bible series with original Language resources would reduce white space (by 1/3). Column header could have series. Before showing series in one column, code could check that Bible resource Ranges do not overlap.

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 126
Pete De Bonte | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 17 2018 7:03 PM

Disciple of Christ (doc):
So what you are wanting is for FL to redesign the software because the [the alternative] is to expensive for you to purchase.…

Sarcasm?

I tried to pose this as something that might be useful for others, as well. If I could, I'd rename the thread.

I think KS4J was also posing another application with his "Send Hyperlinks Here" screenshot, above; but for yet another example,
how about a Multiview column using:

  • OT: Lexham English Septuagint
  • NT: Lexham English Bible
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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 18 2018 2:07 AM

Pete De Bonte:
One way to think about it (but certainly not the only way), would be to to allow prioritization of resources in the Multiview, e.g. in one of the Multiview columns, always display this resource if it contains the passage, and then fallback to this other resource when it doesn't.

Put this way, I think this is a reasonable and useful request - especially for people who set multivews for resources with differing canons.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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