Recommended resources to study convictions (firmly held beliefs).

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Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Aug 28 2018 7:42 PM

Hi power users:

Studying a bit I came across the term convictions (as in firmly held beliefs), and supposedly are different from normal beliefs (i.e. convictions are more action oriented?)

I did a search in L7, and not much about convictions in that sense, only dictionary definitions. The term is more related with conviction (as the result of a penal procedure).

I would like to know if you know of any resource that explains more about convictions, their relation to beliefs, the difference from opinions, prejudice, worldview, etc.

Also how are they formed, can they be changed, what is the practical result (or should be) of having them, etc.

Thanks ahead of time for any recommendations.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 28 2018 8:18 PM

I suspect that the terminology you ran into comes either from the logic of belief religion or from the representation of knowledge. I've not found anything online that is at an introduction level - https://plato.stanford.edu/ appears to be your best bet.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 29 2018 6:11 PM

Thank you very much MJ.

Found some articles on the site you mentioned: Parmenides, Max Weber, Descartes, etc.

I just cannot believe there is no resource written about convictions.

I found some good pages, but they are good as introductory matter:

https://writing.colostate.edu/guides/teaching/co300man/pop12d.cfm

https://www.differencebetween.com/difference-between-conviction-and-vs-belief/

Before that, believe it or not the only reference I had was:

... And with the power of conviction, 

there is no sacrifice,

it's a do or die situation,

we will be invincible...

LOL, maybe you will recognize the lyrics: Pat Benatar.

Thanks for the link.

Did a search using my Spanish resources (string: convicciones), and I got over 2000 hits. Not bad, interesting information.

So makes me wonder if I look the word for convictions in German, and search my German package, maybe there is more info.

Could I theoretically use google translate to see what it says in the German hits?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 29 2018 6:53 PM

Hamilton Ramos:
Found some articles on the site you mentioned:

Ah, I was trying to direct you to articles such as: Belief, Formal Representations of Belief, Logic of Belief Revision, Self-Deception (for prejudice) . . .

The Colorado site you reference is generally solid. I am not familiar with the other one ...

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 29 2018 7:25 PM

Ok, you were quick to respond, I edited my previous post.

I searched for "convicciones" in my Spanish resources, and I got a lot of useful information.  A lot of it is Catholic Catechesis but a lot of insights.

So if I look in my German resources, could I theoretically use google translate to see what it says?

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 29 2018 9:51 PM

Try searching on ASSURANCE (πληροφορία). I found this entry in A Critical Lexicon and Concordance to the English and Greek New Testament.

ASSURANCE

1. πίστις, faith, the trust which one entertains or puts in a person or thing. Parallel to this is the meaning of conviction; a conviction based upon trust, not upon knowledge; a persuasion fortified by faith. A firmly relying confidence. A confidence cherished by firm conviction.
2. πληροφορία, full conviction, perfect certitude, (from πληροφορέω, to bring in full measure, complete an act), not an effect of the logical faculty, but produced by the inner working of the Holy Ghost.

Also I found this interesting quote about conviction:

"Now, a person who thinks should not try to persuade others of his belief; that is what puts him on the road to a system; on the lamentable road of the 'man of conviction'; politicians like to call themselves that; but what is a conviction? it is a thought that has come to a stop, that has congealed, and the 'man of conviction' is a man restricted: experimental thought seeks not to persuade but to inspire: to inspire another thought, to set thought moving…." (Milan Kundera)

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Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 4:43 AM

Excellent Rosie, thanks.

I do disagree with the congealed thought quote.

"Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life"...  I am glad to have this key thought congealed in my system.

So you all get an idea of what I found in Catholic apologetics I will translate:

"... 4 Expose the presuppositions of the non-believer

 Now is your turn to ask some questions to the non-believer. Ask specially why he / she believes what he / she believes. Keep on asking until you get to his / her most fundamental convictions.  For example they could believe in evolution. When you ask why, they will probably offer scientific evidence.

Ask why they believe in scientific evidence. At the end they will have to reveal their starting point. If the persons believes in reincarnation, ask why. If they answer that they think impossible for a person's spirit to just cease existing, ask why. 

This will reveal finally their most basic convictions, those they cannot defend, that is, their presuppositions. Most will not have a problem to recognize that it is them the ones that decide what is or is not truth. It is important to have the person acknowledge that..."

Excerpt (roughly translated by me) from: 

Ramsay, R. B. (2008). Certeza de la fe: La defensa del evangelio en un mundo inseguro. VILADECAVALLS (Barcelona) ESPAÑA: Editorial CLIE.

Very interesting, and more in line of what I wanted. Glad that I have a Verbum package. There is a lot of excerpts like that, from a myriad of resources in Spanish.

I will have to see if similar types of resources in English have that also. I am sure that the Germans have something to say, but I am not able to read German at present.

I did not even find a German English dictionary in L7, very strange.

Eventually I will have to sit and synthesize bits an pieces here and there to get a bird eye's view on the topic. And that is a shame, because after 2000+ years of theology, I would imagine that some expert would have written a book dealing with all key aspects of convictions (convicciones in Spanish).

Kind regards.

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 4:53 AM

Yes MJ, I understand.

What I thought was wonderful, is that in the page you provided a link for, I wrote convictions, and many articles that mention the concept popped up.

That allows me to see usage from secular philosophical perspective in time, from modern thought other than religious, etc. I thought it was great.

I wonder why this Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy is not available in L7, I think it would be a good resource to have.

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David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 8:03 AM

Hamilton Ramos:

Excellent Rosie, thanks.

I do disagree with the congealed thought quote.

To follow up on Rosie's contribution. To keep this relevant to Logos I did a Bible search for "am persuaded" in my top Bibles and found 6 references that I would cite as examples of "convictions". In my evangelical tradition convictions are connected to a perception that God has convinced me through the ministry of the Holy Spirit (John 16:13) rather than through human deductive logic. [I'm not looking for a debate or presuming that you will agree with this, just offering the perspective as one who comes from a different faith tradition.]

Peace to you my friend!

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

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Liam | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 8:40 AM

Hey Hamilton,

I haven’t delved deeply into them, but you may find John Frame’s and Cornelius Van Til’s work on apologetics helpful in your study. They have a theory called presuppositionalism that might be right up your alley!

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Liam | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 11:17 AM

Also, I just happened to be listening to this sermon by John Piper where he discusses how he thinks conviction arises: https://www.desiringgod.org/messages/spoken-confirmed-witnessed-a-great-salvation

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 2:11 PM

Hamilton Ramos:
I wonder why this Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy is not available in L7, I think it would be a good resource to have.

It exists only as an online resource and it constantly being updated. I have a quick link to it on my tool bar. One of the few things I preferred about L3 was it's handling of links in the shortcut bar.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 11:23 PM

Thank you David, very insightful.

I like the approach you take: to go directly to the Bible to clarify, and obtain objective evidence.

My worry is that most traditions insist on deductive method as initial step: authoritative teacher strongly suggesting (not to say imposing or indoctrinating) doctrinal constructs that are expected to be taken at face value without critical evaluation.

What should we accept as the right way to develop convictions that perfectly align with revealed truth in the Bible?

Blessings.

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 11:39 PM

Thanks Liam for the tips.

Thanks also for the link. I liked the allegory of plug and socket. I just see it in another way:

People were elected from before the foundation of the world by God for certain purposes, and even for certain destiny. Without entering in detail, The message will plug in those people that have their name written in the Book of Life.

We believe in the Holy Spirit gift of discernment, and we see Paul encouraging believers to develop it. The reason is that you can give a general call to come and be a part of the Good News (Gospel). But the particulars of the entrance to the New Covenant, and the subsequent discipleship should in theory be done mostly on those who have been discerned as true sheep, elected by God.

Warning is given to that respect in the Bible: do not give the pearls to the pigs.

When discoursing on CD site about the noble Synagogue Bereans, I tried to find out what factors aided in their being so noble: 

was it their leaders?, or maybe a particular teacher that taught them critical thinking? was it their geographical position as crossroads near large trade centers that made them open minded enough to interact with different people, and thus different worldview? 

I asked teachers, friends, fellow believers, and most had not thought about it. Meditating intensely in the case, I realized (maybe by illumination from the Holy Spirit) that the reason they were so noble, is because God made them that way, they were elect sheep, that were going to receive the true message, ascertain its truthfulness by searching the Scriptures, and accepting it so it became their deeply held conviction.

Even though I believe in election, I do would like to know more about convictions, to see if that can aid in being more effective to disciple "discerned" true sheep.

Blessings.

Posts 525
Hamilton Ramos | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 30 2018 11:41 PM

MJ: Too bad it is not a resource in L7. But I thought that the ability to place links in the shortcut bar still exists.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 31 2018 12:01 AM

Hamilton Ramos:
But I thought that the ability to place links in the shortcut bar still exists.

It does but one can no longer have multiple tiers.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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