Morph search - double verse results (count) (This before that) original language

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Bård Skeie Sørheim | Forum Activity | Posted: Sat, Mar 16 2019 5:26 AM

Hey!

I´m trying to do a morph search to find all results in the Hebrew Bible where the term נאם יהוה (announcement of YHWH) occurs. I´ve tried searching for "lemma:נְאֻם BEFORE 4 CHARS lemma:יהוה" and "נדם before יהוה" and similar. I want to know the exact ammount of times the words occur in that exact order in the BHS or LHB. But as you can see from the screenshots, Logos gives me double search results (as far as I can tell). I want Logos to show me the results focusing on the exact phrase - not each word individually. Currently it shows me a) results where נאם occurs before יהוה, and also where יהוה occurs after נאם. That´s not very helpful. 

Anyone? 

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:00 AM

Hi  Bård - and welcome to the forums

Try switching the display to "Verses" instead of "Analysis"

Graham

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:39 AM

Bård Skeie Sørheim:
lemma:נְאֻם BEFORE 4 CHARS lemma:יהוה

Proximity searches will always return counts for both words in the search.

You can use a phrase search to avoid this: "lemma:נְאֻם lemma:יהוה"

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Bård Skeie Sørheim | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:43 AM

Doesn´t help. Cf these images - a different example showing the same problem. Switching to "verses" shows one ersult, but the result count (above the results, below the search field) still counts 4. 

I´m aware this counts 1 verse, but with נאם יהוה I need to know the exact amount of results - so if by chance the term should occur twice in the same verse - the verse count wouldn´t help me. 

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:47 AM

Bård Skeie Sørheim:
Doesn´t help. Cf these images - a different example showing the same problem. Switching to "verses" shows one ersult, but the result count (above the results, below the search field) still counts 4. 

Does Mark's suggestion help.

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Bård Skeie Sørheim | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:49 AM

Mark Barnes:

You can use a phrase search to avoid this: "lemma:נְאֻם lemma:יהוה"

Well look at that! Thank you so much!! =) 

Graham Criddle:

Does Mark's suggestion help.

Most certainly! Thank you both! =)

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:51 AM

And using a Morph Query document is another option

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 6:52 AM

Alternatively, you can group by lemma, so you can see the individual counts for each word:

The reason the double counting happens is because with a search like Peter WITHIN 30 WORDS Jesus, you might get three occurrences of Peter near to two occurrences of Jesus. Should that count as one? Three? Five? Six?

PS — be careful with BEFORE 4 CHARS. Technically that means BEFORE 0-4 CHARS, and it may not be your intention for your search to be quite that broad. There are only 2 CHARS between נְאֻם and יהוה. So if you want to be absolutely precise, use BEFORE 2-2 CHARS:

CHARS doesn't consider the length of the word, if that's what you were intending.

  • 0 CHARS would mean in exactly the same location (only useful for two words in the same position in an interlinears)
  • 1 CHAR means immediately before (but with no allowance for a space or maqaf).
  • 2 CHARS allows for the space or maqaf.

You can also use BEFORE 1 WORD, of course, but I'm conscious that the definition of a 'word' in Hebrew isn't always straightforward.

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Bård Skeie Sørheim | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 7:04 AM

Graham Criddle:

And using a Morph Query document is another option

Looks like I don´t have the option to do any "query" search. I only have the Logos 8 basic, I believe. 

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Bård Skeie Sørheim | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 7:07 AM

Mark Barnes:

Alternatively, you can group by lemma, so you can see the individual counts for each word:

Thank you! That´s a good idea!

Mark Barnes:

be careful with BEFORE 4 CHARS

Oh, thanks for the heads up! This was done automatically by left-clicking the phrase in LHB and clicking "morph". I´ll use BEFORE 1-1 WORDS or something from now on. 

EDIT: I tried both, and it looks like I get the same results with both BEFORE 1-1 and "lemma:X lemma:Y". So I believe both will be effective, though "lemma:נְאֻם lemma:יהוה" would look better if referring to it in a paper. 

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 8:16 AM

Bård Skeie Sørheim:

Graham Criddle:

And using a Morph Query document is another option

Looks like I don´t have the option to do any "query" search. I only have the Logos 8 basic, I believe. 

Yes - in that case, Morph Query is not an option.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 16 2019 10:28 AM

Bård Skeie Sørheim:
Oh, thanks for the heads up! This was done automatically by left-clicking the phrase in LHB and clicking "morph".

The context menu errs on the side of caution by specifying four characters for a phrase. In the NT that copes with punctuation, for example.

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