Accordance, Bible Explorer, Biblesoft, BibleWorks, Laridian, Olive Tree, Quickverse, WORDsearch...
The title of this post will probably help clear up any confusion about whether it is okay to post the names of the competition or not.
I was asked to comment on this recently, and am happy to oblige. We have no problem with people posting comments that include the names of other Bible software companies or products. The issue is not that we have a "naughty word list" that includes words like "Accordance, Bible Explorer, Biblesoft, BibleWorks, Laridian, Olive Tree, Quickverse, WORDsearch..." but rather, since we are in the Logos forums, we want to keep the focus on Logos.
There's an appropriate use of discussion related to Logos that mentions other products. For example, did you know that BibleWorks supports external links to Logos books? There are two ways to talk about that. One "cool" way is to start a thread and ask other Logos users which resources are best to buy at Logos so you can link to them from your BibleWorks library, or look for interesting ways to link from BibleWorks to specialized resources within Logos. Alternatively, a "not so cool" way would be to start a thread and basically create an advertisement for BibleWorks, and encourage all the Logos users to drop Logos and go buy BibleWorks, and then put an actual hyperlink to a discount page. The difference is clear, keep the conversation about Logos, and not an advertisement for, or link to, the other companies and products.
Also, please remember we are talking about companies and products designed to help people get more into Bible study. Let's not forget that there are real human beings behind these products, and they want to sell a product yes, but they could be in any business they want. They chose to be where they could help get people into the Word. On a business level we are on different "teams", but on another level it is more like your kids being on different "teams" in little-league. When the season is over both your kids are still on "Dad's team".
People tend to get passionate about products, brands, sports teams, theologies, denominations, local churches... you get the idea. Because of this passion, there is a danger to cheer on the home team a little too fervently, at the expense of the "competition", and that is what we want to avoid.
When you happen to mention another product, make sure it is kind, gentle, appropriate and relevant to the thread, and that the thread is about Logos. At Logos we are all about the Bible and better access to it. We think everyone should be studying the Bible, and we are glad that there is enough interest in Bible study to have so many products for that purpose.
- Do we love our baby? Yes!
- Is the Logos forum designed to be all about Logos? Yes!
- Do other companies produce products to help people in Bible study? Yes!
- Is it okay to mention other products without advertising or linking to them? Yes!
I hope that clears it up, except for one last thing I really want to say, and this bears repeating, ahem, Accordance, Bible Explorer, Biblesoft, BibleWorks, Laridian, Olive Tree, Quickverse, WORDsearch...
Comments
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I think it's cool that all of these companies can work together in one way or another & that they all have the common goal of getting people to study the Word of God [:)]
It's nice to see the Olive Tree guys @ BibleTech... or Accordance & Logos & BibleWorks going head to head @ SBL, but still sitting down & being friendly with one another after it's all said & done.
You gotta luv it! They all push each other to excel & make Bible study better for the consumer!
Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com
Christ-centered Hip-Hop - http://www.sphereofhiphop.com0 -
Dan Pritchett said:
except for one last thing I really want to say, and this bears repeating, ahem, Accordance, Bible Explorer, Biblesoft, BibleWorks, Laridian, Olive Tree, Quickverse, WORDsearch...
I object. You failed to mention Biblia Clerus, Davar 3, The Faith Database (which currently has some problems with its downloads), Vulgate 4, Bible Mapper, Menologion, and Universalis all of which sit on my Logos shortcut bar - which tells you what I treat as my primary product. [:D] ... and I have none that you mentioned although I did help my father with one of them.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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LaRosa Johnson said:
You gotta luv it! They all push each other to excel & make Bible study better for the consumer!
And I get to sit back and reap all the benefits... [:D]
"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."
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I'm glad for the clarification. Much appreciated.
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What about little ol' e-Sword?
Jerry
iMac (2019 model), 3Ghz 6 Core Intel i5, 16gb Ram, Radeon Pro Graphics. 500GB SSD.
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Great post, Dan, thank you. What an example of godly competition. And you've just proven a point that I think I'd made somewhere else which is that the mere mention of the names of those products is not a problem. It does not cause Search engines to drive more traffic to their sites or anything (which some of the other MVPs were claiming). If that were the case you wouldn't have so gleefully repeated them over and over in your post. [;)]
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...... Dan did not mention ABible either (Japanese software) but who's keeping track?MJ. Smith said:I object. You failed to mention
I do have all the software programs mentioned (-Laridian) and while I find nice things about each of them, there are two points I want to make for the other Logos users:
1) I have never gone to other companies' websites and trashed their product because I think it is wrong to do so.
2) I know Logos is the best in the field. And that is quite an achievement considering some of the other companies also do well.
Thank you Dan (& Bob, Dale, Phil & just about everybody at Logos) for being so gracious about everything.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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It's early morning here in Europe and I want to say Dan, you made my day. You just proved to me that, yes, you are a business company, but you are first of all Bible believing, God loving Christians. I feel very good, and even better now, about using of your product, by far the best Bible program on the market IMHO.
Just to add one little point, before we have all the Czech and Polish Bibles in Logos, Davar 3 icon will seat on my Logos toolbar to get an easy access to those Bibles as I study Logos.
Bohuslav
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Thanks Dan for the clarification though I did not need it, your previous post was clear to me. Some users went far beyond what you intended in your previous post on the same subject matter. Stifling appropriate conversation/inquiry on the forum when another software was mentioned which did not involve promoting or linking to other products though their intentions were noble.
I have argued on three separate threads for the above (your clarification) as your intended meaning. Glad that this will lay to rest what in my view was a draconian application and interpretation of your previous post. Thanks again & good morning down here in the UK.
Ted
Edit
Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ
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Excellent post. I suggest this be a 'sticky' at the top of the forum for future reference.
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Donovan R. Palmer said:
Excellent post. I suggest this be a 'sticky' at the top of the forum for future reference.
I'd second that! [Y]
iMac Retina 5K, 27": 3.6GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9; 16GB RAM;MacOS 10.15.5; 1TB SSD; Logos 8
MacBook Air 13.3": 1.8GHz; 4GB RAM; MacOS 10.13.6; 256GB SSD; Logos 8
iPad Pro 32GB WiFi iOS 13.5.1
iPhone 8+ 64GB iOS 13.5.1
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Ok now that this is out and in the air is this the correct place to ask if logos4 has links that will allow me to access my wordsearch POSB comentaries. I've used both for years with LOGOS being my main application i would love to be able to access that data. (espeacily with Logos 4 faster search capaiblities). [:^)]
Nathan Madison
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Dan,
thanks for the clarification....
I get it...[:O]
Robert Pavich
For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__
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Jerry Bush said:
What about little ol' e-Sword?
Jerry
Yes, I thought of that one, too, along with any other free Bible software or smaller package like OLB.
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E-Sword is a pretty amazing little piece of software for what it is. I still recommend it to people that just want to do simple searches and are not ready to take the plunge into Logos. There are no other paid programs that I would recommend.
A great reflection on L4:
I used Logos 3 almost exclusively. I also had e-Sword installed. I used it for quick searches and copying. Mostly copying to make PPoint slides. After a few weeks of Logos 4, I realized that I was not opening e-Sword anymore. The speed and improved copying features had eliminated my need for it.I honestly can't think of anything Logos 4 does not have that I need. I have a copy of WORDsearch that is not installed. I can download e-Sword anytime. No need to because of L4. Pretty cool.
Now if they would only get the UPDATED version of My Utmost For His Highest in Logos, I would be totally happy.
How about Community Pricing to gauge interest, Logos gals & guys?
Jerry
iMac (2019 model), 3Ghz 6 Core Intel i5, 16gb Ram, Radeon Pro Graphics. 500GB SSD.
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Nathan Madison said:
if logos4 has links that will allow me to access my wordsearch POSB comentaries
That currently isn't possible right now.
Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com
Christ-centered Hip-Hop - http://www.sphereofhiphop.com0 -
Dan Pritchett said:
There's an appropriate use of discussion related to Logos that mentions other products. For example, did you know that BibleWorks supports external links to Logos books? There are two ways to talk about that. One "cool" way is to start a thread and ask other Logos users which resources are best to buy at Logos so you can link to them from your BibleWorks library, or look for interesting ways to link from BibleWorks to specialized resources within Logos.
Dan,
I really appreciate this clarification. The specific example you used is something I've had several questions about since I own BibleWorks. With the release of BW8 some of the external links to Logos don't work with the same ease (probably an overstatement) as they did with BW7. I had wanted to ask a few questions but it seemed like everytime someone mentioned a competing product the "forum police" would immediately pounce on the unsuspecting offender. Again, thanks for the clarification.
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Ted Hans said:
Thanks Dan for the clarification though I did not need it, your previous post was clear to me. Some users went far beyond what you intended in your previous post on the same subject matter. Stifling appropriate conversation/inquiry on the forum when another software was mentioned which did not include promoting or linking to the product though their intentions were noble.
I have argued on three separate threads for the above (your clarification) as your intended meaning. Glad that this will lay to rest what in my view was a draconian application and interpretation of your previous post. Thanks again & good morning down here in the UK.
Ted
Yes Ted, you are right (as usually [:)] ). The way the regulations has been usually explained on the forum (not by Logos but by us, users) somehow did not go well together with all other very broadminded and gracious attitude of Bob and other people in Logos to anybody, even users who abused Logos verbally and have not acted fair to them. I am very glad we have heard that clarification from Dan. Now I feel much better about their attitude to the other Bible software companies than before. It's true "chesed" (steadfast love) attitude. As I understand "chesed" is that it is the attitude of a winner towards all others. Only those who are sure of their place in Christ (and I believe it applies to people in the Bible software companies also) can truly express chesed like David did in many occasions. I'll stop here before I start preaching... [:$]
Bohuslav
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Beautiful post from you Bohuslav. What can I say? As for you preaching just a gentle reminder when will you get round making your web site more English friendly[:)]? Second time I am asking, looking forward to your musing[Y].
Ted
Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ
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LaRosa Johnson said:Nathan Madison said:
if logos4 has links that will allow me to access my wordsearch POSB comentaries
That currently isn't possible right now.
Do you know something we haven't heard yet? It would be an interesting scenario to access Wordsearch/Bible Explorer resources through Logos. There are a few titles (i.e. Complete Biblical Library) that are exclusive to Wordsearch for a number of years.
This also reminds me of Bob Pritchett's survey last year when he polled users about what features they would like to see. One question was "How important is it to you for Logos to be able to use PDF documents?"
I would be tickled pink to use Logos to access EVERYTHING, regardless of it's format and orign. A web-based Logos should be able to do that if licensing agreements are not a problem. It might be a "win-win" for all companies involved.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Ted Hans said:
Beautiful post from you Bohuslav. What can I say? As for you preaching just a gentle reminder when will you get round making your web site more English friendly
? Second time I am asking, looking forward to your musing
.Ted
Thank you Ted. You are very kind. Well, I wish we would be able to have an English version of our web site sometimes. In the list of "must do" things it is number... (well, sorry, it would not encourage you...) [:)]
The main thing on our site that is used very much is sermon download and obviously that is just Czech. There is no way to have that in English, only if we would manage to convince our people to listen to the English sermons. [:)]
Bohuslav
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Bohuslav Wojnar said:
The main thing on our site that is used very much is sermon download and obviously that is just Czech. There is no way to have that in English, only if we would manage to convince our people to listen to the English sermons.
Ha, you've made my day - that was funny. Blessing.
Ted.
Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ
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Bohuslav Wojnar said:
only if we would manage to convince our people to listen to the English sermons
We have a parish in which the sermon is usually preached twice - once in Mandarin, once in Cantonese.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Matthew C Jones said:
Do you know something we haven't heard yet?
Little birdies tell me things... but I doubt any linking between WORDsearch & Logos will happen in the foreseeable future [:)]
Urban Scholar - http://urban-scholar.com
Christ-centered Hip-Hop - http://www.sphereofhiphop.com0 -
Great email! Did you know that
Logos rocks!, Accordance, Logos rocks!, Bible Explorer, Logos rocks!, Biblesoft, Logos rocks!, BibleWorks, Logos rocks!, Laridian, Logos rocks!, Olive Tree, Logos rocks!, Quickverse, Logos rocks!, WORDsearch
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Personally, I agree with your comments. However, if I were to mention the fact that I use other softwares, that doesn't mean I'm advertising them. For example, my # 1 Bible software is Logos 4 and I don't have to state the reasons, they are very obvious - Logos is the best in the business. My # 2 is WordSearch and I only have 3 reasons to use it: 1) They have lots of free books (e.g. from Hodge's commentaries to McGarvey's commentaries, etc.); 2) They have Dr. Rod Mattoon's Treasures from the Scriptures which are awesome and extremely practical for preaching through books of the Bible and 3) WordSearch has the complete John G. Butler's Analytical Bible Expositor, Following God Series, Biography Series and Studies on the Savior Series which are a magnificent help to preach expository sermons. You put Mattoon's work together with Butler's and you could literally preach for several years using their material alone!!! Superb masterpieces!!! If Logos could manage to get this BRILLIANT resources on Logos 4 format, that would definitely make me a Logos 4 Exclusive user! [:D] And last but not least, my # 3 Bible software is e-sword because: 1) It's FREE (free is always good), 2) It has 20 Spanish translations and 3) you can create your own modules for free too.
Having said all of that, I still love Logos 4 and one of the things I'm looking forward to is for my personal book builder to be available in Logos 4. I'm already able to see my sermons from the Sermon file in Logos 4, but having the PBB that will really help me get some of my own work to work with my favorite software. Anyway, to all those reading this post, if you really want to invest in the most splendid tool for Bible study, make sure to stop by at www.logos.com and choose the package of your choice. I recommend to go with Scholar's package or higher and take advantage of the Payment Plan option. I guartee that you will never be disappointed!
God bless!
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I was wondering about "middle ground" discussions, a bit like Giovanni brings up in the previous post where posters "talk up" the value of other software. Imo, how Giovanni did it is fine, because a) he is not slamming, but in fact promoting Logos, and b) the whole post--let alone thread--is not devoted exclusively to extolling the virtues of Accordance, BW, E-S, etc.
Still, it is more than just seeing how Logos and other software application have a point of contact. So, is a post like the above still satisfactory on these forums?I like Apples. Especially Honeycrisp.
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For those not aware of the Logos edition. See here for the Analytical Bible Expositor http://www.logos.com/search?q=John+G.+Butler%27s+Analytical+Bible+ExpositorGiovanni Baggio said:WordSearch has the complete John G. Butler's Analytical Bible Expositor,
See here http://www.logos.com/products/details/2483Giovanni Baggio said:Following God Series,
Giovanni Baggio said:Biography Series and Studies on the Savior Series which are a magnificent help to preach expository sermons. You put Mattoon's work together with Butler's and you could literally preach for several years using their material alone!!! Superb masterpieces!!! If Logos could manage to get this BRILLIANT resources on Logos 4 format, that would definitely make me a Logos 4 Exclusive user!
You can suggest that these books be made available in Logos in the suggest forum here http://community.logos.com/forums/28.aspx and email - suggest AT logos.com
Ted
Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ
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Thanks for the links Ted,
I'm within the 60 day Wordsearch return policy -- So I'll go ahead and return the Butler's Analytical B.E. and get the logos version instead. I will suggest to Logos to make the Biography series and Studies on the Savior available if they can. I only own a couple of print volumes and I would like to have them in Logos 4 format. Concerning the following God series, I have ordered them from Wordsearch, but they're more like study guides, so for now I'll skip the digital versions (will return them too) and just pray that Logos will get the Biography series and Studies on the Savior series available. Hey, they might even be interested in putting Dr. Rod Mattoon's Treasure's from the Scriptures in Logos 4. Either way, my # 1 Bible software of all time has always been and will always be Logos Bible Software.
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Giovanni Baggio said:
I will suggest to Logos
Giovanni--do you know about suggest@logos.com and also writing a suggestion post on the "suggestions" forum section here? Those two things will help your suggestions get noted by Logos.
I like Apples. Especially Honeycrisp.
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