problem with notes and hyperlinks (bug??)

Page 1 of 1 (9 items)
This post has 8 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Apr 26 2011 10:54 AM

I'm trying to create a Note with hyperlinks embedded, using an external word processor.  I'm having a couple of issues, though:

1) Both Word for Mac 2008 and Pages '09 change the hyperlink after it is created.  For example, if I want to create the following hyperlink: logosref:Bible.1Sam25, Word will change it to file://localhost/logosref/Bible.1Sam25, and Pages will change it to http://logosref:Bible.1Sam25. This, of course, renders the hyperlink unusuable when copied into a Logos note.  Someone in another thread mentioned a similar problem with NeoOffice.

2) When I create a note using hyperlinks directly through Logos (which for long notes is especially slow seemingly due to the way L4M uses system resources), it works fine and after a few minutes it will be indexed.  However, if I do a search on the reference it will not jump to the place in the note where that reference appears.  For example, using the above hyperlink, if I do a search for 1 Sam 25 on the "go" bar, the note appears in the "my content" section of "my passage guide".  Great.  But, when I click on the note it brings it up in a new pane but at the top of the note, not where the hyperlink appears.  I shouldn't have to search again just to find the reference.

3) Even if I wanted to search in the note to find the reference (which would require knowing how the scripture reference appears - i.e., 1 Sam 25; 1 Samuel 25; 1Sam25; etc), it doesn't seem to perform the search correctly. I don't know if this is because the note is a long one or not, but it doesn't seem to be working correctly.  It starts at the top and scrolls down about a page very slowly and then stops.

4) As stated above, the note is very slow to navigate when it is long.  It doesn't seem to flow smoothly like books in my library do when they are opened.  It seems as if a note takes up more resources than a book.

My initial venture into this note-making was based on me wondering if I could use Logos Notes as a replacement for the PBB.  I see now that won't work for the above reasons.  I'm hoping when PBB is released, it won't have the problems that the Notes function does.

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 26 2011 11:49 AM

I just found another issue.  Not sure if this is limited to notes or if it is a limitation to Logos searching, but if something is hyperlinked to the book in the Bible and not to a specific verse, it will only come up in a search for that book.  For example, if I hyperlink to "Romans" and do a search for "Romans", the note shows up correctly in My Content.  However, if I hyperlink to "Romans" and search for "Romans 2:1", it does not show up in the results.

The results got stranger when I tried to hyperlink to all verses in the book.  When I hyperlinked to Romans 1:1-16:27, I can get the note to come up in search results if my search is "Romans" or "Romans X" where X is a chapter number.  But as soon as I add a verse, the note doesn't return in the search.  So for instance, searching for Romans 16 will bring up the note, but searching for Romans 16:27 will not.  However, when I hyperlink to, say, "2 Corinthians 1:1-10", I can search for an individual verse like "2 Corinthians 1:8" and it will bring up the note in my search results.

Also, it should be noted that this time I didn't create a really long note - it's a table of contents page for a quarterly journal I have saved as a pdf on my computer.  Total of less than 400 words.

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Posts 25105
Forum MVP
Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 26 2011 2:22 PM

Hi Chris

I think this is due to the way search determines the intersection between the specified search range and the target.

So you get different results, for example, if the search range is the same as the target or if it is completely contained within it.

For details of this, please see the table in "Searching for Bible verses and other references" at http://wiki.logos.com/Detailed_Search_Help (the table which defines how various operators are used)

So I use use a search string of <bible superset romans 16:1> for your first example I get a match.

(I am not sure but the anomaly seems to be the positive hits when you specify a chapter number)

Please review this table and see if it matches what you are experiencing - I think it's pretty close.

Graham

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 26 2011 2:40 PM

Graham Criddle:

So I use use a search string of <bible superset romans 16:1> for your first example I get a match.

 

Interesting - that did the trick.  I searched for <bible superset romans 16:2> just to be sure, and it brought up the note as well.  Of course, this makes what used to be simple searching into a complex task.  Also, this doesn't work for searching on the "go" bar, which means no passage guide and no exegetical guide.  I hope the developers find a way around this.

What doesn't make sense to me is why the 2 Corinthians example worked fine.  Is it because my range for the Romans example was too big of a range?

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Posts 25105
Forum MVP
Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 26 2011 2:55 PM

 

Rev Chris:
What doesn't make sense to me is why the 2 Corinthians example worked fine

By default - if I remember correctly - if you don't specify an operator in the search field, the operator "~" is assumed which is why if you get a match within a range it shows as a hit. So this is what you saw in the Corinthians case.

Where it doesn't match is if the range spans chapter boundaries which - I am assuming - caused the problems for the Romans case. If you extend your selection from Corinthians to go into chapter 2 you will see the same problem.

Rev Chris:
Also, this doesn't work for searching on the "go" bar, which means no passage guide and no exegetical guide

I don't understand this. For the Passage Guide and Exegetical Guide L4 works on the range specified - it doesn't search notes. Could you please expand on this?

Graham

 

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 26 2011 3:08 PM

Graham Criddle:

Where it doesn't match is if the range spans chapter boundaries which - I am assuming - caused the problems for the Romans case. If you extend your selection from Corinthians to go into chapter 2 you will see the same problem.

This would seem a pretty big issue for the program.  Does it do this with books in my library as well?  For instance, if I have a book/article in my library that makes a comment about, say, Romans 2:17-3:8 and I do a search for "Romans 3:1" - will it show up in my results?  If not, that seems like a problem.

Graham Criddle:

I don't understand this. For the Passage Guide and Exegetical Guide L4 works on the range specified - it doesn't search notes. Could you please expand on this?

In my above example, if I do a search from the Go bar on "2 Corinthians 1:5", the note shows up in "My Passage Guide" under the section "My Content".  Clicking on it, of course, brings up the problem I noted at the beginning of this thread of it going to the top of the note, not to the reference point.

 

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Posts 25105
Forum MVP
Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 27 2011 12:33 AM

Hi Chris

Sorry for not responding sooner - it was time to get some sleepSmile

Rev Chris:
Does it do this with books in my library as well?  For instance, if I have a book/article in my library that makes a comment about, say, Romans 2:17-3:8 and I do a search for "Romans 3:1" - will it show up in my results?

To check this I took the Baker New Testament Commentary on Acts and the introduction to the section on "The Church in Jerusalem, part 2" which has:

For this exercise, I am focussing on the highlighted reference (3:1-5:26) and checking to see if searches for Romans 4:1 count as hits.

If I do Basic searches for any of the following:

  • acts 4:1 (which is the same as <bible ~ acts 4:1>)
  • <bible = acts 4:1>
  • <bible subset acts 4.1>

I do not get a match

If I do Basic searches for any of the following:

  • <bible superset acts 4:1>
  • <bible intersect acts 4:1>

I do get a match

This is all consistent with the description of the various search operators in the wiki article and how search is designed to work. It does require some understanding of the use of these operators to ensure you get the information you are looking for. I remember a long discussion about this some months ago but can't find it now.

Rev Chris:
In my above example, if I do a search from the Go bar on "2 Corinthians 1:5", the note shows up in "My Passage Guide" under the section "My Content".

Thanks, now I understand.

So it looks as though the notes search being done when running a Passage Guide effectively uses the ~ operator (or something like it). I guess there had to be a design decision as to which type of search was used to either focus the results to those which seemed most relevant or to include the widest set possible (which can make it difficult to find the actual results people are looking for).

I think it comes down to the question of "if you have a note which contains an outline of the entire book, do you want it to appear in a search when looking for a particular verse in the book?" Some people would say yes while others would say no.

Hope this at least throws some light on what is going on.

Graham

 

 

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 27 2011 9:47 PM

Hmm...well thanks for the insights. I'm disappointed that Logos search is limited in this way. Since I can't know all the times a resource tags a passage that spans chapter designations, I guess I will have to always to do two searches when I do a study ... One through the Go bar to do the exegetical analysis and one through the search bar using the non-friendly method you described in case I might miss a valuable resource. Very frustrating.

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Posts 570
Rev Chris | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 1 2011 3:56 PM

Well I added this to uservoice.  The link is:

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-4/suggestions/1777617-make-go-bar-searches-the-same-as-bible-superset-x?ref=title

I can only hope the developers will take notice.

Pastor, seminary trustee, and app developer.  Check out my latest app for churches: The Church App

Page 1 of 1 (9 items) | RSS