I'm confused about what I can remove now that I have Logos 4

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Posts 130
Cindy | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, May 8 2011 4:42 AM

I had logos bible library 3 and then upgraded to logos bible library 4.  I haven't used 3 since the day after I installed 4 and that was quite a long time ago now.  I honestly can't remember if I ever removed it or not.  But when I look on my add/remove programs this is what I see:

 

Can I remove the Libronix Digital Library System?  I did try clicking on it in my programs and it does open up the bible library 3....but I didn't want to take a chance and delete it and then lose all my books that are on my hard drive...

The reason I'm wanting to do this is because I'm having bigger and bigger problems with Logos 4.  It has been running very slowly whenever I switch between my notes and a commentary or bible etc and now it's starting to just totally freeze up.  I thought maybe if I got rid of the other it might help.... I don't know what else to try.  I know I have plenty of room on my computer and my computer and internet connection are fast, but this is getting worse and worse.

I hope some one can help me....

Posts 11306
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 5:52 AM

Hi Cynthia .... guaranteed others will chime in later today after services, etc. But Logos4 doesn't use any portion of Libronix 3. So whether you have Libronix installed or not does nothing for Logos4 per se. Some people keep both on their PC's (like me) due to Libronix 3 running faster on a net computer, or that periodically they want to install some older Libronix 3 resources from a CD (which can also be installed to Logos 4 by calling Logos with the serial #s).

So, in theory, if you uninstall Libronix, nothing good or bad would happen. The exception is if your hard drive is filling up, and the Windows paging file can't get all the space it wants (if it's on automatic size). In that case, the computer would do considerably more work paging. I'm guessing you know this.

Chances are, the slowing Logos4 is associated with the increasing notes file(s) size(s), and the connectivities in your layouts (especially if Logos4 is almost or is stopping). This assumes your PC isn't the issue (which periodically another program on my PC impacts Logos4 though not Libronix).

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 5:54 AM

Cynthia LaFreniere:

I had logos bible library 3 and then upgraded to logos bible library 4.  I haven't used 3 since the day after I installed 4 and that was quite a long time ago now.  I honestly can't remember if I ever removed it or not.  But when I look on my add/remove programs this is what I see:

 

Can I remove the Libronix Digital Library System?  I did try clicking on it in my programs and it does open up the bible library 3....but I didn't want to take a chance and delete it and then lose all my books that are on my hard drive...

The reason I'm wanting to do this is because I'm having bigger and bigger problems with Logos 4.  It has been running very slowly whenever I switch between my notes and a commentary or bible etc and now it's starting to just totally freeze up.  I thought maybe if I got rid of the other it might help.... I don't know what else to try.  I know I have plenty of room on my computer and my computer and internet connection are fast, but this is getting worse and worse.

I hope some one can help me....

Hi Cynthia,

You can remove L3, but it will not improve L4's performance.  I do not know how many forum posts you have read, but speed is an issue that a lot of people are having with L4.

Getting a faster computer does not help either.  Let us say that more than one person has had performance issues with L4, and they have very powerful computers.

Posts 130
Cindy | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 6:55 AM

thank you both so much for replying!  My computer is relatively new...less then a year old and a very good one.  I've never had trouble with it before.  But it started acting up as far as Logos 4 is concerned about a month ago and is steadily getting worse...to the point where I couldn't use it at all today and that really upset me as the majority of my day is spent in my bible library.  I'll try removing the other and hope and pray that helps.  If not, I really have no idea what else to try...other then the usual of course....doing extra virus scanning, and extra maintenance etc..... which is what I planned on doing later today too, just in case.  Thank you again so very much!

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 6:58 AM

Cynthia,

Just a few thoughts about your issues....

If L4 has been getting worse, you might look to what's changed recently in your PC....some typical culprits are apps not playing well together such as virus, or malware scanners...

 

If you look at the Logos wiki (in my sig) you'll find a section on speeding up L4 and some things that you can look at to see if they affect your particular situation.

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 6:59 AM

this might help

http://wiki.logos.com/Speeding_up_Logos_4_responses

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 602
Bill Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 7:00 AM

I have kept Libronix around for two reasons: (1) to install CDs of collections/resources that I have purchased from third party vendors that were designed for Libronix. Once I install them in Libronix, I sync my licenses and the books are brought into Logos 4. I have gotten some pretty good deals this way. (2) To access PBBs that I still like to use.

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 8:09 AM

Cynthia LaFreniere:
The reason I'm wanting to do this is because I'm having bigger and bigger problems with Logos 4.  It has been running very slowly whenever I switch between my notes and a commentary or bible etc and now it's starting to just totally freeze up.  I thought maybe if I got rid of the other it might help.... I don't know what else to try.  I know I have plenty of room on my computer and my computer and internet connection are fast, but this is getting worse and worse.

Someone else already pointed to the wiki article on strategies for speeding up Logos4. Please try some or all of those and report back.

Another couple of things to do, if you haven't is (1) reboot your computer. If you have a habit of leaving it on all the time and never rebooting it, this can cause problems in the Windows cache for the programs you use most. Restarting your computer should help. (2) Clean out your temp files. Again this is a Windows issue that could affect L4. One of the easiest ways to do that is with a little freeware program called CCleaner (find it at CNet.com - a known-safe download site).

One of the ways Logos4 performance will degrade (at least anecdotally) is by having many, many note files, large note files, a large number of collections, and possibly large numbers of other user generated documents. If there are any of those that are really just taking up space, you may want to consider removing them. You could also move some of the content into a Word or other file to store separately. Many of us take only short notes in L4, lengthier studies we put in external files. I do this primarily because of the limitations of notes (and clippings), but it may have the added benefit of not bogging down L4.

There are some more ways that L4 can get bogged down, but they are very difficult to track down and many just haven't been identified. I hope you're not developing one of those problems. On the other hand, if you are, and it can be identified, it could help many other users.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 130
Cindy | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 9:38 AM

Thank you all again!  I will try all those things, but probably not today.  Being a mom and grandma, my children and grandchildren will be arriving any moment so I doubt if I'll be able to get back to it till tomorrow.  But I will report back and let you know what worked and what didn't.  Thank you again!

Posts 2401
Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 8 2011 5:15 PM

Richard DeRuiter:
One of the ways Logos4 performance will degrade (at least anecdotally) is by having many, many note files, large note files, a large number of collections, and possibly large numbers of other user generated documents.

Will Logos still slow down if you have large note files but they are not currently open?

Posts 130
Cindy | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 9 2011 8:02 AM

Well I don't know what was causing the problem but it's gone now and everything is working great again praise God!  All I did yesterday was delete Libronix, run the virus scanners which found nothing, defragmented which it really didn't need, used CC Cleaner which it also really didn't need as I do all these things weekly anyway.  The only thing I did that was "unusual" besides removing libronix was to run scan disk, but I don't think it found any problem either.

I admit that I have a LOT of notes and I don't want to move them elsewhere since the entire purpose is to have them on the verses they're related to for easier studying and remembering.  I also use highlighting a lot but not Sympathetic Highlighting, and I'm not willing to do without that either. I have a lot of linked resources and a lot of "favorites" too.   But I have saved the link you gave me and intend to look that over carefully as soon as I have time to see if there's anything else I "should" do that I'm actually willing to do lol  I mean what's the point of having a program to help you study if you can't take advantage of the things that are there to help you?

Anyway, thank you so much for all your help!

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 7:43 AM

Cynthia LaFreniere:
I mean what's the point of having a program to help you study if you can't take advantage of the things that are there to help you?

Without disputing that, let me just say that some people use notes, clippings and other user-generated content, for purposes beyond their original intent. For example, in the old newsgroups (before the forum was up), before the PBB became available, users would share Libronix note files of entire books. Others would put academic papers in note files.

I have several extended studies, some over 10 pages long, that I have stored in WordPerfect files. Some would put such studies in Logos4 as note files, which isn't designed for such things (that's what the PBB is for), and may bog down the system.

Having lots of brief annotations on Bible texts (e.g.) should not bog down Logos4. However, some with many large note files report that Logos4 works slowly for them. The same is true for those with many collections, many visual filters, etc. What we don't know is whether it's the amount of user generated content that's the problem, or whether a certain type of problem occasionally shows up, so that having more content just increases the chances of having that type of problem, or even whether their experience of L4 being slow is not related to user content at all (the old "correlation is not causation" argument).

Anyway, I'm glad things are working better for you. But I can't see how removing Libronix may have helped, since the two programs do not share data nor programming. The only way they might conflict is if they were both operating at the same time, but there aren't any reports of that either (as far as I know).

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 1141
Juanita | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 7:58 AM

Richard DeRuiter:
One of the ways Logos4 performance will degrade (at least anecdotally) is by having many, many note files, large note files, a large number of collections, and possibly large numbers of other user generated documents.

Hi Rich,

What puzzles me at times when notes are discussed is the use of notes asdescribed in training such as:  use Logos notes to make your own Bible commentary.  And given that scenario wouldn't the user then be creating many, many note files?  Thus, potentially slowing down their systems, to do what one of the intention of notes is-to create your own Bible commentary.

 

 

Posts 308
James W Bennett | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 8:06 AM

Bill Anderson:

I have kept Libronix around for two reasons: (1) to install CDs of collections/resources that I have purchased from third party vendors that were designed for Libronix. Once I install them in Libronix, I sync my licenses and the books are brought into Logos 4. I have gotten some pretty good deals this way. (2) To access PBBs that I still like to use.

One more reason to keep L3 around: For the proper display of Syriac texts.

---

James W Bennett

http://syriac.tara-lu.com/

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 8:28 AM

Joan Korte:
What puzzles me at times when notes are discussed is the use of notes asdescribed in training such as:  use Logos notes to make your own Bible commentary.  And given that scenario wouldn't the user then be creating many, many note files?  Thus, potentially slowing down their systems, to do what one of the intention of notes is-to create your own Bible commentary.

As I said above having many brief notes connected to your Bible shouldn't be a problem, and hasn't been reported as a problem. As far as creating one's own commentary, what sort of commentary did you have in mind? Not to be facetious but I have one volume commentaries on the whole Bible and several volume commentaries on one book of the Bible! As I look at the whole of what Logos has said about notes, I would think they are thinking about the one volume type of commentary, that has only brief notes, and probably not on every verse.

On the other hand, some report that having a large number of note files, and large numbers of other user-generated content seems to make L4 work more slowly. As I also said above, we're not sure if, or how these two things might be related. It's very possible that having many note files and other user-generated stuff is not the issue, but some other issue is creeping in that may or may not be related to these things. (I may have overstated the case in the sentence you quote - but the parenthetical remark was put there to demonstrate the shaky ground that this observation rests upon. Though, I think there is something here.)

As we share our problems on these forums, it's helpful to make connections to other potentially related issues. Cynthia's issue of degrading performance over time was particularly intriguing and suggestive of this type of problem (which others report having). If we knew for example that this case demonstrates the limitations of note file size and/or number, then Logos would see an issue that it could track down and address. Just as importantly, it's important to help those with a problem try to overcome it by suggesting all the potential issues and trying to address them methodically.

The bottom line for this case is that it seems resolved, and the resolution had nothing to do with note file size nor numbers.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 1141
Juanita | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 8:39 AM

Richard DeRuiter:
what sort of commentary did you have in mind?

It's not in my mind since I don't use Logos notes for anything.  It would be in the minds of those who listen to the same training, I would think.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 12:01 PM

Richard DeRuiter:
Having lots of brief annotations on Bible texts (e.g.) should not bog down Logos4.

Unfortunately that has not been my experience.Sad I produce Bible studies that use notes and questions of 1-6 lines I run into performance problems at about 200 notes. Performance sufficiently poor that I create a work file where I create notes. Then I move the notes into the actual file at the end of my session. As I am entering previous work into Logos, this is primarily copy & paste so I'm not hitting the keyboard lag that others describe.Smile

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 12:07 PM

Joan Korte:
What puzzles me at times when notes are discussed is the use of notes as described in training such as:  use Logos notes to make your own Bible commentary.  And given that scenario wouldn't the user then be creating many, many note files?

I think I recall a post by Bob P. that L3 required many small files and L4 was to support large files. However, my experience so far does not match his expectations. A commentary could either be anything from one humongous file to a very fragmented collection of files depending on the work patterns of the creator.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 130
Cindy | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 10 2011 5:21 PM

Oh dear, I didn't mean to start a debate about notes lol  I honestly don't really know what caused the problem or why it's suddenly started working just fine again.  It could be because I removed Libronix and it could be some other weird thing that I have no notion about...

As far as my notes go, I do use a lot of notes.  I wasn't aware what the training or whatever said about them though.  I use them very much like that though...to remind myself of important information about whichever verse I'm on.  Probably 2/3rds of my notes are short enough (barely) to show up on the preview in entirety when you hover your mouse over the box.  Another 1/3rd of them aren't though...they're anywhere from twice as long to a couple of pages long.  Now that I'm aware of this however, i intend to try and knock those down to much smaller and just leave something like the title of the word document that the rest of it can be found on, so when I need to read the rest that I can find it.  To me that's a big inconvenience though that I don't like.  I write extensive bible studies every day for my site, and use my notes constantly for that purpose as well.  I do keep copies of my studies on Word and prior to upgrading to 4 had imported a number of them as sermon files which was also very helpful.  Now, IF I could import the rest as sermon files again, then I wouldn't mind having to chop the notes down as I could just link to the sermon file.  So my hope is that we will soon be able to do that again. 

I love Logos 4 and wouldn't trade it for anything including L 3, which I loved before, but I have to admit that it did upset me when I discovered that so many things I had counted on before (like this) no longer worked the way they had before, or weren't available at all.  It wouldn't have been so bad if there had been a warning before upgrading as at least I would have known what I was going to lose.  I happened across a link recently that was supposed to be to a page that described exactly that...what you'd no longer have after upgrading, but when I went and read it, I was very disappointed because it seemed to be nothing more then a bunch of  meaningless chatter about how much better L 4 was and you really wouldn't miss the things you were losing...but never any list or mention of what exactly those things were. That was very disappointing to me.  I told myself that since I didn't have time to look for possible further links on that page to yet another page that might actually list those things, that perhaps there really was such a page and I just didn't see it.  I hope so...even if it's hard to find at least better to tell folks up front I think.  But that's really my only gripe as it just seemed underhanded to me, especially right at first.  I guess I was in shock...

oh well, such is life.  I'm just very grateful that I have Logos 4 and wish I had enough money to buy one for all my friends and family members too--it's just that good.  I've never seen anything that can really compare with it.  Obviously I'm still learning and still discovering things about L4 that I hadn't realized before and everything I discover just makes me love it even more.  (even though I do have my own "wish list" like wishing we could choose other colors for notes like we did before etc LOL

Thank you all again for taking the time to try and help me though.  I was really desperate and all I knew to do was pray and come here and ask for help.

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