Almighty

Page 1 of 1 (8 items)
This post has 7 Replies | 2 Followers

Posts 2404
mab | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Jun 22 2011 7:18 AM

This is a bit baffling to me. I'm working on the names of the Messiah and while several references seem to point to Almighty as a name for Him, other ones seem to reserve it for God (the Father?). I was always under the impression that Revelation 1:8 was being spoken by the Messiah to John. The I am is so decidedly the manner Messiah refers to Himself in relation to His divinity in the Gospel of John that I find myself more perplexed. The scholarly opinion seems to reserve the name for God without a specific distinction; so would that mean the Father? Confused 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 155
Pedro | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 10:15 AM

Michael Ballai:

The scholarly opinion seems to reserve the name for God without a specific distinction; so would that mean the Father? Confused 

The logos resource "Every Name of God in the Bible" has one main section for the name applied to God the Father (Page 33), and the following section for Jesus:

"Almighty" is a descriptive name of God found in the Old Testament (see page 33). It is also a primary name of God the Father in the Book of Revelation, where it emphasizes the Lord's overarching power exercised in His final triumph over sin and evil. In 1:8, Jesus identifies Himself as the Almighty, as well as by a title borne only by Christ, "the Alpha and the Omega."

Larry Richards, Every Name of God in the Bible, Everything in the Bible series (Nashville, Tenn.: Thomas Nelson, 2001), 141.

logosres:evnogib;ref=Page.p_141;off=1553

logosres:evnogib;ref=Page.p_33

 

Posts 2404
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 10:37 AM

Pedro

Thank you for that reference. It corresponds with the citation in New Nave's. I'm still not sure why some of the scholars say otherwise. Of course I'll take the Messiah's word over the scholars!

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 155
Pedro | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 11:34 AM

Michael Ballai:

Pedro

Thank you for that reference. It corresponds with the citation in New Nave's. I'm still not sure why some of the scholars say otherwise. Of course I'll take the Messiah's word over the scholars!

Michael, I performed another search in Logos and found out that the commentators are attributing Rev 1:8 to God the Father (Lord God) as the speaker:

"The second oracle is attributed to the "Lord God" (who speaks just twice in Revelation, here and in the climactic scene in 21:5-8) and contains three self-predications introduced with the phrase "I am": (1) the Alpha and the Omega (drawn from Hellenism), (2) the one who is and who was and who is to come (a combination of Jewish and Hellenistic divine names), and (3) the Almighty (borrowed from Judaism)."

David E. Aune, vol. 52A, Word Biblical Commentary : Revelation 1-5:14, Word Biblical Commentary (Dallas: Word, Incorporated, 2002), 59.

BDAG has the following for παντοκράτωρ :

the Almighty, All-Powerful, Omnipotent (One) only of God (as transl. of צְבָאוֹת [Orig., C. Cels. 5, 45, 46] and שַׁדַּי) π. θεός (3 Macc 6:2; Just., D. 38, 2 al.; Mel., P. 45, 322) 1 Cl ins; ὁ π. θεός (2 Macc 8:18) 2:3; 32:4; 62:2; AcPl Ha 6, 14; ὁ θεὸς ὁ π. Rv 16:14; 19:15; AcPlCor 2:12. ὁ θεὸς ὁ τῶν ὅλων ὁ π. 2:9. θεὸς π. (Jer 3:19) Pol ins; AcPlCor 1:11. ὁ π. καὶ παντοκτίστης καὶ ἀόρατος θεός Dg 7:2; κύριος π. (oft. LXX) 2 Cor 6:18. (ὁ) κύριος ὁ θεὸς ὁ π. (=י״י אֱלֹהֵי הַצְּבָאוֹת.-Hos 12:6; Am 3:13; 4:13; 5:14) Rv 1:8; 4:8; 11:17; 15:3; 16:7; 21:22; MPol 14:1; κύριος ὁ θεὸς ἡμῶν ὁ π.

William Arndt, Frederick W. Danker and Walter Bauer, A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature, 3rd ed. (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2000), 755.

The NT rarely if ever calls Jesus Christ θεός, I guess that is why the scholars and commentators attribute the saying in Rev. 1:8 to God the father rather than God the Son.

EDIT: See also Rev. 21:22 (NASB) "I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb are its temple."  Both, Father (Lord God the Almighty) and Son (Lamb) are spoken of here.

 

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 12:07 PM

Michael Ballai:

This is a bit baffling to me. I'm working on the names of the Messiah and while several references seem to point to Almighty as a name for Him, other ones seem to reserve it for God (the Father?). I was always under the impression that Revelation 1:8 was being spoken by the Messiah to John. The I am is so decidedly the manner Messiah refers to Himself in relation to His divinity in the Gospel of John that I find myself more perplexed. The scholarly opinion seems to reserve the name for God without a specific distinction; so would that mean the Father? Confused 

I see no way to avoid the fact that this does indeed refer to Christ.  Immediately before this it details Christ's work in his death, release from sin, constituting his people as kings and priests and coming with the clouds (theophanic image).  There is no indication that the subject has changed. 

One thing you might note is that παντοκράτωρ does not signify "almighty" but rather "all-ruler" -- i.e., the ruler of the universe.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 2404
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 12:12 PM

I think perhaps what this implies is part of the mystery of the Triune God. I had a couple of commentary citations that placed it in line with Aune. I wonder if it's more our searching for definitions that in the divine realm are assumed.  The gospel mentions that the Messiah is seated at the right hand of the power of God. I read this as if He is acting as the Almighty. Being one with the Father perhaps blurs some of the distinctions.

Thanks again Pedro for taking the time to look this up. 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 2404
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 12:24 PM

That's part of my impression as well. I believe we need to see words more in context rather than how they might be construed elsewhere even in the same book.  I read a fascinating article about the multiple definitions one descriptive word had in the Gospel of John and the answer had to be in the context.

The sovereign ruler is often attributed to God as king, melekh in Hebrew. Here in Revelation, we have Messiah as King of Kings How much more all-ruler do we get than that?

George Somsel:

 

I see no way to avoid the fact that this does indeed refer to Christ.  Immediately before this it details Christ's work in his death, release from sin, constituting his people as kings and priests and coming with the clouds (theophanic image).  There is no indication that the subject has changed. 

One thing you might note is that παντοκράτωρ does not signify "almighty" but rather "all-ruler" -- i.e., the ruler of the universe.

 

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 155
Pedro | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jun 22 2011 12:35 PM

Michael Ballai:

Thanks again Pedro for taking the time to look this up. 

Thank you Michael for sharing this with us and for our edification through a deeper study of God's word!

Page 1 of 1 (8 items) | RSS