Interesting writ.
By the way who is Rob Bell and why does he speak[write] so strongly against him in this book?
I thought it was going to be about ‘hell’-?:
How could a loving God send people to hell? Will people have a chance after they die to believe in Jesus and go to heaven? With a humble respect for God's Word, Francis Chan and Preston Sprinkle address the deepest questions you have about eternal destiny. They've asked the same questions. Like you, sometimes they just don't want to believe in hell. But as they write, "We cannot afford to be wrong on this issue." This is not a book about who is saying what. It's a book about what God says. It's not a book about impersonal theological issues. It's a book about people who God loves. It's not a book about arguments, doctrine, or being right. It's a book about the character of God. Erasing Hell will immerse you in the truth of Scripture as, together with the authors, you find not only the truth but the courage to live it out.
How could a loving God send people to hell? Will people have a chance after they die to believe in Jesus and go to heaven?
With a humble respect for God's Word, Francis Chan and Preston Sprinkle address the deepest questions you have about eternal destiny. They've asked the same questions. Like you, sometimes they just don't want to believe in hell. But as they write, "We cannot afford to be wrong on this issue."
This is not a book about who is saying what. It's a book about what God says. It's not a book about impersonal theological issues. It's a book about people who God loves. It's not a book about arguments, doctrine, or being right. It's a book about the character of God.
Erasing Hell will immerse you in the truth of Scripture as, together with the authors, you find not only the truth but the courage to live it out.
Room4more:By the way who is Rob Bell and why does he speak[write] so strongly against him in this book?
Rob Bell is a prominent member of a loose organization of pastors in what is called the "emergent" church. He wrote a book called "Love Wins," in which he denies the possibility of a literal hell. Much hoopla was made over this book by some prominent evangelicals (and Catholics), including John Piper who tweeted "Farewell, Rob Bell."
"Erasing Hell" is a response to Bell by Francis Chan. I have not read either book (yet).
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alabama24: Rob Bell is a prominent member of a loose organization of pastors in what is called the "emergent" church. He wrote a book called "Love Wins," in which he denies the possibility of a literal hell. Much hoopla was made over this book by some prominent evangelicals (and Catholics), including John Piper who tweeted "Farewell, Rob Bell."
Very diplomatic
Some critics of Bell would call him a heretic.
David Carter:Some critics of Bell would call him a heretic.
Is this book being offered in Logos? I am not understanding how this thread relates to Logos.
Vyrso Christian e-books purchased at the Vyrso site (related to Logos) will be downloaded to Logos and can be read on Logos just like any of your other resources.
Vryso is offering FREE for a very limited time, THREE of Francis Chan's books--Erasing Hell, Crazy Love, and Forgotten God. Go to the Francis Chan page at Vryso.
Well, unfortunately I know nothing of Rob Bell, who he is or for what he may claim. But I do know that calling someone a heretic carry's a heavy judgement call whereas a breath of fresh air may carry the same weight, either way It is not necessary, but I am aware that it will be done.
Anywho:
"Let me be more specific and personal. I want everyone to be saved. I do. I don’t want anyone to go to hell. The fact is, I would love for all people to stand before Christ on judgment day and have a chance to say, "They were right all along, Jesus. You really are the Savior. I am so sorry for not believing in You before, but I believe now. Can I have a second chance?"-"
I may not agree with the whole of the statement from the intro - but I do feel that there is a 'universalism' contained within John 3:16, and that reading further Jesus does declare 'not everyone will enter'. As for the 'second chance' - well you may need to read further for further comments.....
[[[pppsssttt - we can keep this civil and discuss the book.....I found somethings interesting]]]
In continuance, he (chan) states, then Blasts Bell:
Most recently, author Rob Bell finds this view compelling. With creativity and wit, he sets forth a similar position, though he avoids the label Universalism. Nevertheless, Bell suggests that every single person will embrace Jesus—if not in this life, then certainly in the next.5 He writes: At the heart of this perspective is the belief that, given enough time, everybody will turn to God and find themselves in the joy and peace of God’s presence. The love of God will melt every hard heart, and even the most "depraved sinners" will eventually give up their resistance and turn to God.6
Most recently, author Rob Bell finds this view compelling. With creativity and wit, he sets forth a similar position, though he avoids the label Universalism. Nevertheless, Bell suggests that every single person will embrace Jesus—if not in this life, then certainly in the next.5 He writes:
At the heart of this perspective is the belief that, given enough time, everybody will turn to God and find themselves in the joy and peace of God’s presence. The love of God will melt every hard heart, and even the most "depraved sinners" will eventually give up their resistance and turn to God.6
Yet, what Bell states is Biblically sound and follows the tenure of most NT scripts. Which is true we - ALL - will stand before God and give an account for our lives, beit words or/and deeds....
Wow..."Rob Bell" and "Biblically sound" in the same sentence. Would it be ironic to say that Hell has frozen over?
I think these two videos tell the story straight forward. One is directly from Mr. Bell (concerning his book "Love Wins"), the second is a well done parody that shows his errors quite clearly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODUvw2McL8g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDLCN8GwBHE
Josh: Wow..."Rob Bell" and "Biblically sound" in the same sentence. Would it be ironic to say that Hell has frozen over? I think these two videos tell the story straight forward. One is directly from Mr. Bell (concerning his book "Love Wins"), the second is a well done parody that shows his errors quite clearly.
So then I will take it that what Bell said has nothing to do with the Bible in the way that Chan presents it? Mind you I don't know anything of Bell nor do I know of Chan, but the presentation seems to Be Biblically correct - unless of course Chan is attempting to say that Bell is wrong(?) if which, is the case, then Chan's presentation seems to be missing something to support his statement, the quote fits Scripture - correct?
When we all stand before God, and not know our true fate, there will be a sigh of relief, so there will be a sense of 'joy' and 'peace' beit slightly displaced, standing before our Maker.
Would you not also agree that "The love of God will melt every hard heart, and even the most "depraved sinners" will eventually give up their resistance and turn to God." to be an accurate statment of what MAY be a true possibility when standing before the Throne?
I will watch the vid's later....
Rob Bell believes everyone will be saved. That no one will go to Hell - even if they openly rejected Christ in this life.
Josh: Rob Bell believes everyone will be saved. That no one will go to Hell - even if they openly rejected Christ in this life.
Whilst that may be a true statement, which I have no idea if it is or is not, Chan makes no merit of statement in that regards but quotes Bell on another matter.
Either what Chan states is correct from the perspective of the quote - or - he quoted incorrectly. The point seems fair that the quote is Biblical.............
[[did Josh read the book?]]
The key word in Bell's quote is "every". The Bible is clear that not everyone will be saved. (e.g. the Antichrist, his false prophet, those who committed the unpardonable sin, etc.) Thus, Bell's quote is not biblical.
Josh: The key word in Bell's quote is "every". The Bible is clear that not everyone will be saved. (e.g. the Antichrist, his false prophet, those who committed the unpardonable sin, etc.) Thus, Bell's quote is not biblical.
But the Love of God WILL melt "every" heart. Even Jesus declare that not all will enter, He went so far as to renounce those that did mighty deeds "IN HIS Name".
Okay demonstrate that Bell's quote is NOT Biblical......In the quote bell does not state that everyone will be saved...
Room4more: But the Love of God WILL melt "every" heart. Even Jesus declare that not all will enter, He went so far as to renounce those that did mighty deeds "IN HIS Name". Okay demonstrate that Bell's quote is NOT Biblical......
Okay demonstrate that Bell's quote is NOT Biblical......
I'm not sure what I was not clear on. Will the Antichrist have his heart melted and eventually turn to God even though Revelation 19 is clear he will be judged and thrown into the Lake of Fire? How about those who Christ Himself said could never be forgiven because of their blasphemy against the Holy Spirit? Will their heart's be melted by God's love and will they eventually turn to God? This last one would make Jesus out to be a liar! (Matt. 12:31-32)
Room4more: In the quote bell does not state that everyone will be saved...
In the quote bell does not state that everyone will be saved...
He says "EVERY" hard heart. Who doesn't have a hard heart that isn't already saved? The implication is clear. Plus, Bell even admits that he believes everyone will be saved.
Josh: Room4more: In the quote bell does not state that everyone will be saved... He says "EVERY" hard heart. Who doesn't have a hard heart that isn't already saved? The implication is clear. Plus, Bell even admits that he believes everyone will be saved.
Then what you are saying is that Chan mis-quoted Bell(?)
-OR-
Chan's statement of "if not in this life, then certainly in the next" is incorrect and misleading to the quote? Thus Chan is misleading the point he is trying to make, which means that he-chan- did not understand what Bell stated-?
As to what Bells claims - I do not know(again) ; I am reading what Chan - the Author- wrote. You want to keep refering to what Bell claims - -I have no idea what he claims.......I am just reading the book - did you read it?
Please, there are many a hard hearted 'christians', and I think that you are aware of this...so that seems like a reaching statement.
Josh: I'm not sure what I was not clear on. Will the Antichrist have his heart melted and eventually turn to God even though Revelation 19 is clear he will be judged and thrown into the Lake of Fire? How about those who Christ Himself said could never be forgiven because of their blasphemy against the Holy Spirit? Will their heart's be melted by God's love and will they eventually turn to God? This last one would make Jesus out to be a liar! (Matt. 12:31-32)
We are not talking about an antichrist. As to Revelation 19, how do you know that he won't get a softened heart? True he will perish, and How do you know that those who Balsphemed won't get a softened heart? yet they will perish.
who are we to say that they won't or will be.
The point is in my former post................Was chan correct in his quote or was he misleading? If bells quote is NOT Biblical then how so? Bell does not state that "all will be saved" in the quote and chan did not state that either nor did he claim that Bell did...........
"In his book Love Wins, Bell never actually comes out and says that this is what he believes. To be fair, he is not explicitly arguing for this position but listing it as a valid view that would help explain a lot of the tension that we feel when thinking about the hard realities of hell. But he presents this position in such favorable terms that it would be hard to say that he is not advocating it. He even says the traditional view of a literal hell that features eternal torment is not "good news" at all. To use Bell’s phrase, "The good news is better than that." He implies the view that all people will eventually be saved is actually much better news. So while he never says that this is the correct view, Bell certainly presents this view as the good view and the traditional view of hell as the bad view. See Love Wins (New York: HarperOne, 2011), 110–111, 173–175."
here's the #5 of Chans statement. Notice what he say's about Bell. then makes the quote..unless I go and read Bells book I have no idea what the point is that chan is attempting to make when he blasts Bell, here in this f-note he is haphazzardly quoting Bell....